Pimp Gun - Apology...

Gentlemen, and Ladies;


In my earlier posting regarding the museum quality Artillery lugers for sale (American Historical Foundation), I did not intend to insult anyone with such a "pimp gun" as one Forum member replied.


I guess I assumed the starting gun was a rusty piece of junk even beyond "shooter" quality.


I admired the skill of the restoration, engraving and inlay work and the fact that a rusty piece of junk (not even good enough to be a shooter) could be given somewhat of a new life, albeit a bastardized life.


I was also amused knowing that some folks would have enough disposable income to consider the actual price. I would be curious to know how many of the 25 offered have actually sold.


Again, my apologies to any I insulted...

[Herb]

Pete, That was no pimp gun, take a look at my post about Herman Gorings Krieghoff!! Now that's a GUN!

[schwob]

Can someone please explain to me the significance of what appear to be oak leaves engraved on this Goring Luger?

[Herb]

Can't give you any real 'reason' other than I have seen them on many German engravings, daggers, swords, even coo-coo clocks. Apparently the German engravers like them. I know of no connection of them to any national emblem such as the eagle is attributed to the U.S. Many of them indlude acorns also. Interesting fact, there are really coo-coo birds in Germany, have heard them in the woods near the Wansee golf course in Berlin, they sound just like the clocks!

[Ron Wood]

The oak leaf motif is commonly known as "Germanic" style engraving. It appears on many high quality German weapons.

[schwob]

Thanx guys, 'preciate your input:-)

[Doug]

There is no need to apologize! What truly upsets me regarding this type of work is that I would much rather see Ted rework a poor condition gun than it get the glitz job. At least Ted does tasteful accurate restorations and does not add things to the gun and then call them RARE and collectable. I feel that the maker and marketers of these guns are deliberately trying to take advantage of a novice collector. In reference to the Goring repro, I have seen a gun similar to this. It was a S/42 made for Franz Von Papen the deputy foreign minister of the Third Reich. It too is 100% engraved and covered in a burnished gold. The color is almost like tarnished brass. The craftsmanship is evident when you look at the quality of the engraving.

The main difference is that a factory commissioned engraved gun is always desirable, but third party work such as the LP-08 is not. By the way, don't assume that they started with rust buckets. True they were probably not pristine, but I bet they were in decent enough shape that someone would have given at least $700 for it.

Nothin' to apologize for. Any and all luger tales are interesting here--I would greatly regret anyone not commenting in a forum because they were afraid of being attacked by in inconsiderate person. As it is, the company that makes these faux collectibles takes a few guns bought from importers or R Shattuck or other sources at the rock bottom price for currently available lugers. Then a few are "processed" (their term, not mine) but belt sanding them. They are then sent to a husband and wife engraving team who engrave them to the design. There is also a bit of gold leafing but I don't know the method for this.Application of a finish such as "french grey" (their term not mine) is also done somewhere along the line as is addition of some high gloss smooth grips. They are then put in a wood display box (average quality wood box) and shipped out. Few guns are done in the beginning. They tend to be made in batches based on demand. If they say 25 guns, it may not ever be over 15 if the demand is not present. The raw material lugers are cheap but may be original all matching or not depending on what they turn up.


This LP08 project has been in the works for at least five years 'cause I discussed the project with one of their employees that long ago when I was living in Virginia (the firm is in Mechanicsville north of Richmond).


dave

[Don]

I guess I missed the response(s) that were offended by the "pimp" remark, but I have to put in my $.02 anyway.


If you like flashy things with gold and diamonds, you're money's better spent on a Rolex. Those guns are like a fancy plate from the Franklin Mint with George Washington's picture or whatever. They sell for thousands of dollars, but have no historical or artistic value, and will never appreciate in value. They're just kitsch that was hyped up to make people think they're getting something special.


Seems to me these monstrosities miss the whole point of why anyone would be interested in Lugers. Lugers have an elegant and functional design that makes them like a work of art. Those decorated LP08's would be equivalent to the Louvre deciding to peddle reproductions of the Venus de Milo -- but with "improvements" such as gold plating, lips made out of rubies, etc. etc. -- a gaudy, tacky parody of the real thing.

I look at it this way: There is art and there are historic artifacts. Multiple copies of an item, like a group of identically decorated lugers, falls a bit short of the usual concept of art being a unique artistic creation that may or may not be expert, creative, attractive or otherwise of high quality. The LP08s are rather cheesy and closer to a velvet Elvis than a Van Gogh. Historic artifacts are a different matter valued for their historic information and associations. These LP08s are an odd blurring of both art and history that in the end is neither--the art is arguable and copied while much of the historic information in the LP08s has been stripped off with the original finish and parts. No purchaser should have confidence that the money spent will be recoverable.


Just my opinion.

dm