P08 Trigger Problem

wisgro123 · 03-06-2012, 09:23 PM

I removed the barrel and receiver from my P08 to lubricate the slide. I reassembled the pistol after oiling and cocked it. I had to pull the trigger twice before the firing pin activated. I cocked it a few more times and the pin activated each time with one pull but the next time I cocked it I had to pull the trigger twice before the pin activated. I disassembled the barrel and receiver to check but didn't see anything out of order. Reassembled the pistol, cocked it and the pin activated. Cocked it again and had to pull the trigger twice. I tried about a half dozen more times but had to pull the trigger twice at random times. Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

lugersrkewl · 03-06-2012, 09:35 PM

Is the safety on?

alvin · 03-06-2012, 10:06 PM

Sounds like trigger bar plunger pin's issue. This plunger is the key component of Luger's disconnecting mechanism.

alanint · 03-06-2012, 10:30 PM

Agreed. The plunger at the end of the sear bar is not resetting properly after each firing sequence.

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 07:51 AM

Thanks for responding so quickly. Do you mean the Sear Bar Spring when you say the plunger?

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 07:52 AM

Thanks for responding so quickly. You said "trigger bar plunger pin." Do you mean the Sear Bar Spring?

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 07:53 AM

Thanks for responding so quickly. The pistol won't fire at all with the safety on so I know that's working.

kmichaels90 · 03-07-2012, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wisgro123

Thanks for responding so quickly. The pistol won't fire at all with the safety on so I know that's working.

On the end of the sear bar at the front is a spring plunger that acts as the disconnector. When you fire the gun and it returns to battery this plunger is compressed by the trigger bar in the sideplate. When you release the trigger this plunger pops out behind the trigger bar so that it can contact it when you fire the next shot. It sounds like this plunger is not popping out when you release the trigger therefore not allowing the gun to fire. If you remove the sideplate and look at how it is linked to the trigger and sear bar you will see what im talking about.

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 08:09 AM

Great. Thanks. I'll check it out later today.

Lugerdoc · 03-07-2012, 09:44 AM

W, I'd first check that you have the side plate properly inserted into the notch in the frame and that it is flush with the frame. If so, then you probably will have to do some work on the trigger lever inside the side plate, for correct resetting of the disconnector plunger. TH

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 10:24 AM

Thanks for responding. Before I checked the side plate fit I put a drop of oil at the axle pin where it goes through the lever in the back of the side plate. I then carefully inserted the plate into the notch. (I took it off and replaced it a few times, checking carefully for fit.) If I hold the pistol so that I am facing the muzzle I can see a small gap between the side plate and side of the receiver. I can slide 3 thicknesses of regular bond paper edgewise into the gap (about 1/64). I can press the side plate snugly to the receiver but it doesn't stay there. Pressing the side plate before pulling the trigger doesn't help. I then cocked and pulled the trigger very slowly. Feels like something is not operating smoothly, like an obstruction then fires. Unfortunately when I cocked it again I had to pull the trigger 3 times before it fired.

kmichaels90 · 03-07-2012, 10:40 AM

Did you check the plunger on the sear bar to see if it is indeed sticking in and popping out slowly?

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 10:48 AM

Yes I checked that. It works fine with the trigger side plate off but it's covered when I replace the side plate so I can't see the action. I put a drop of oil on and worked the plunger quite a few times before replacing the side plate but that didn't help.

kmichaels90 · 03-07-2012, 10:58 AM

Seems very odd. If you have the gun cocked with it assembled then remove the upper will it release the firing pin when pressure is applied to the sear bar? If not I would say the issue is with the sear bar or firing pin. If it does release I would think the problem is in the trigger/sideplate/sear bar engagement. That would be an area where I wouldnt know what to do.

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 11:11 AM

I agree it's odd. The pistol has been handled carefully. Just took it out for a periodic wipe down and ran into a brick wall. Could you please explain what you mean by "remove the upper." What part are you referring to? (I looked at the P08 disassemble video and noticed that when the demonstrator pulls the toggle back to **** the pistol the toggle stays up by itself. I have 3 P08s and the toggle doesn't stay up on any of them.)

kmichaels90 · 03-07-2012, 11:20 AM

You very likely have 3 p08's like my p08 which does not have a last shot hold open. What I mean is make sure it is cocked, then remove the sideplate and slide the upper assembly (barrel,receiver,toggle assembly) off the front of the frame. Now push on the sear bar toward the barrel end and see if it releases the firing pin. If so I think you have an issue with your sideplate. If it doest release I'd say the issue is with the sear bar or firing pin.

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 11:41 AM

I followed your directions. The sear bar doesn't move and the firing pin is not released. The plunger located in the front of the sear bar pushes back easily. It springs forward into position when I release it. I reassembled the barrel, receiver and toggle assembly and pulled the trigger. I then disassembled the same parts and tried to push the sear bar. It won't move in either direction. (I have a parts map with labels so I can be sure I'm identifying the correct parts.) Should I be able to move the bar? Do you still think it's the sear bar or firing pin?

wisgro123 · 03-07-2012, 11:47 AM

I played around a bit more then realized the sear bar actually pushes inward, not forward. I went through the process you described and the gun fired. If I understand correctly you suspect it's the side plate if the pin fires.

kmichaels90 · 03-07-2012, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wisgro123

I followed your directions. The sear bar doesn't move and the firing pin is not released. The plunger located in the front of the sear bar pushes back easily. It springs forward into position when I release it. I reassembled the barrel, receiver and toggle assembly and pulled the trigger. I then disassembled the same parts and tried to push the sear bar. It won't move in either direction. (I have a parts map with labels so I can be sure I'm identifying the correct parts.) Should I be able to move the bar? Do you still think it's the sear bar or firing pin?

Hmm... when pushing the sear bar you should be pushing the front half of it towards the other side of the gun. Such as put your thumbnail on the side of the plunger and push it in towards the center of the receiver. If thats what you did and it wont release it sounds like something is binding.

mrerick · 03-07-2012, 11:55 AM

Walt,

When everything is assembled, is there play in the trigger plate fit against the side of the receiver? Does the take down lever hold it close to the receiver without movement? Earlier you described a 1/64 inch gap. Is that where it is? Is it flat and parallel against the side of the receiver, or at an angle?

Look inside the trigger plate and look for dirt behind the trigger bar (a right angle transfer bar). Make sure that the small pin is holding it square with the trigger plate.

This area was hand fit by the factory for each Luger. That's the reason the parts were numbered to the pistol s/n. Is your Luger matching?

The right angle transfer bar is hardened, and will snap if you try and bend or "re-form" it. Not something to do yourself.

Marc

03-06-2012, 09:23 PM	#1
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	P08 Trigger Problem I removed the barrel and receiver from my P08 to lubricate the slide. I reassembled the pistol after oiling and cocked it. I had to pull the trigger twice before the firing pin activated. I cocked it a few more times and the pin activated each time with one pull but the next time I cocked it I had to pull the trigger twice before the pin activated. I disassembled the barrel and receiver to check but didn't see anything out of order. Reassembled the pistol, cocked it and the pin activated. Cocked it again and had to pull the trigger twice. I tried about a half dozen more times but had to pull the trigger twice at random times. Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

03-07-2012, 09:44 AM	#10
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	W, I'd first check that you have the side plate properly inserted into the notch in the frame and that it is flush with the frame. If so, then you probably will have to do some work on the trigger lever inside the side plate, for correct resetting of the disconnector plunger. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

03-07-2012, 11:55 AM	#20
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,900 Thanks: 1,370 Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts	Walt, When everything is assembled, is there play in the trigger plate fit against the side of the receiver? Does the take down lever hold it close to the receiver without movement? Earlier you described a 1/64 inch gap. Is that where it is? Is it flat and parallel against the side of the receiver, or at an angle? Look inside the trigger plate and look for dirt behind the trigger bar (a right angle transfer bar). Make sure that the small pin is holding it square with the trigger plate. This area was hand fit by the factory for each Luger. That's the reason the parts were numbered to the pistol s/n. Is your Luger matching? The right angle transfer bar is hardened, and will snap if you try and bend or "re-form" it. Not something to do yourself. Marc __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

03-06-2012, 09:35 PM	#2
lugersrkewl Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Ussr Posts: 425 Thanks: 198 Thanked 75 Times in 58 Posts	Is the safety on?

03-06-2012, 10:06 PM	#3
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Sounds like trigger bar plunger pin's issue. This plunger is the key component of Luger's disconnecting mechanism.

03-06-2012, 10:30 PM	#4
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Agreed. The plunger at the end of the sear bar is not resetting properly after each firing sequence.

03-07-2012, 07:51 AM	#5
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for responding so quickly. Do you mean the Sear Bar Spring when you say the plunger?

03-07-2012, 07:52 AM	#6
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for responding so quickly. You said "trigger bar plunger pin." Do you mean the Sear Bar Spring?

03-07-2012, 07:53 AM	#7
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for responding so quickly. The pistol won't fire at all with the safety on so I know that's working.

03-07-2012, 08:09 AM	#9
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Great. Thanks. I'll check it out later today.

03-07-2012, 10:24 AM	#11
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for responding. Before I checked the side plate fit I put a drop of oil at the axle pin where it goes through the lever in the back of the side plate. I then carefully inserted the plate into the notch. (I took it off and replaced it a few times, checking carefully for fit.) If I hold the pistol so that I am facing the muzzle I can see a small gap between the side plate and side of the receiver. I can slide 3 thicknesses of regular bond paper edgewise into the gap (about 1/64). I can press the side plate snugly to the receiver but it doesn't stay there. Pressing the side plate before pulling the trigger doesn't help. I then cocked and pulled the trigger very slowly. Feels like something is not operating smoothly, like an obstruction then fires. Unfortunately when I cocked it again I had to pull the trigger 3 times before it fired.

03-07-2012, 10:40 AM	#12
kmichaels90 User Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Bucyrus OH Posts: 60 Thanks: 1 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Did you check the plunger on the sear bar to see if it is indeed sticking in and popping out slowly?

03-07-2012, 10:48 AM	#13
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Yes I checked that. It works fine with the trigger side plate off but it's covered when I replace the side plate so I can't see the action. I put a drop of oil on and worked the plunger quite a few times before replacing the side plate but that didn't help.

03-07-2012, 10:58 AM	#14
kmichaels90 User Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Bucyrus OH Posts: 60 Thanks: 1 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Seems very odd. If you have the gun cocked with it assembled then remove the upper will it release the firing pin when pressure is applied to the sear bar? If not I would say the issue is with the sear bar or firing pin. If it does release I would think the problem is in the trigger/sideplate/sear bar engagement. That would be an area where I wouldnt know what to do.

03-07-2012, 11:11 AM	#15
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I agree it's odd. The pistol has been handled carefully. Just took it out for a periodic wipe down and ran into a brick wall. Could you please explain what you mean by "remove the upper." What part are you referring to? (I looked at the P08 disassemble video and noticed that when the demonstrator pulls the toggle back to **** the pistol the toggle stays up by itself. I have 3 P08s and the toggle doesn't stay up on any of them.)

03-07-2012, 11:20 AM	#16
kmichaels90 User Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Bucyrus OH Posts: 60 Thanks: 1 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	You very likely have 3 p08's like my p08 which does not have a last shot hold open. What I mean is make sure it is cocked, then remove the sideplate and slide the upper assembly (barrel,receiver,toggle assembly) off the front of the frame. Now push on the sear bar toward the barrel end and see if it releases the firing pin. If so I think you have an issue with your sideplate. If it doest release I'd say the issue is with the sear bar or firing pin.

03-07-2012, 11:41 AM	#17
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I followed your directions. The sear bar doesn't move and the firing pin is not released. The plunger located in the front of the sear bar pushes back easily. It springs forward into position when I release it. I reassembled the barrel, receiver and toggle assembly and pulled the trigger. I then disassembled the same parts and tried to push the sear bar. It won't move in either direction. (I have a parts map with labels so I can be sure I'm identifying the correct parts.) Should I be able to move the bar? Do you still think it's the sear bar or firing pin?

03-07-2012, 11:47 AM	#18
wisgro123 User Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 24 Thanks: 16 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I played around a bit more then realized the sear bar actually pushes inward, not forward. I went through the process you described and the gun fired. If I understand correctly you suspect it's the side plate if the pin fires.