Newbie

[durr3]

Hello all
I have a Luger that was brought home from WWII by my father. It was taken from Hitler's Reich Chancellery Building at the end of the war. The Luger is one of several found in a crate, unopened, wrapped in a wax paper type paper and covered with cosmoline.
The gun has had maybe 25 rounds thru it. It is a 7.65 cal.

What is the best way to start searching for more information on this type Luger?

I can post photos, if anyone would like.

Thanks for any help.

J Durr Wise
Mississippi
USA

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by durr3

What is the best way to start searching for more information on this type Luger?

I can post photos...

That would be the way!

Left & right, top, full length all, any markings, the serial of course, and any accessories or paperwork you might have. Bringback paper, bill of sale, note from customs, whatever.

Attach your pictures to this thread. If for some reason the forum won't let you attach them, post a couple more times - it's to keep bots out. After 4 or 5 posts, you'll be able to attach them. The people you want to reach with your pictures are behind corporate/gov't firewalls that block Photobucket, TinyPic, Google, YouTube, SmugMug etc.

Sounds like a neat Luger!

[durr3]

[durr3]

[durr3]

[durr3]

[sheepherder]

Made by DWM [duh!] Deutsche Waffen und Munitionsfabriken [sic] and in seeming outstanding condition. Have you stripped it yet to see if all numbers match? Last two digits should be on the marked pieces. Pay special attention to the magazine base and the trigger plate. They seem to be the most mismatched.

7.65 is most commonly a commercial pistol; military Luger production stopped in 1942. I don't believe DWM was even in business by then. If found in a WW II setting, it would require more detail to come up with an explanation of why it was not issued or what its intended use was...

Pile on as much details as you know about it. Any accessories? Do you still have the greasy paper???

Commercial proof on left side receiver; no military proofs on right. Markings on bottom of barrel???

[durr3]

The barrel is stamped 922 with a Z or N and a symbol ...right in front of the trigger guard is 922...on the left side is the Z or N and symbol again...on top of the gun 89 appears 3 times....the magazine is stamped 789. So far that is all of the stampings that I see.

[alanint]

Welcome to the forum. You have a nice commercial Luger in great shape.
With all due respect to the family story behind this pistol, unless your father was a member of the Russian army, it is highly unlikely that this pistol came from a crateful at the Reich Chancellery.
No US troops came close to this building until the end of and after hostilities and it is highly unlikely that invading Soviet troops would have missed looting a crateful of Lugers sitting around in this building.
It is not unusual for family lore to be embellished. We see it here fairly often.

[sheepherder]

And by the numbers, the cannon assembly and magazine are from a different Luger...

[alanint]

So the idea that it was "new in the grease" goes up in smoke as well. Don't take offense, these family stories are common.

[durr3]

Can I ask if you were there Mr. alanint? Can you say with 100% certainty, that you are right? I don't think so.....
My father is almost 90 now and will be glad to debate you on your opinion.

[rhuff]

All the folks on this forum have to go by are the photos. If you have a Luger that is in 7.65 Para/30 Luger caliber, on the barrel and frame is a "N" above a Crown, then you have a commercial and not a military Luger.....originally. Because the frame numbers do not match the toggle train numbers, then it is a parts Luger.....made up from parts of two or more Lugers. These are the only things we have to evaluate, and this is how it comes out....sorry.

[DavidJayUden]

Please do not take offense at Alan's skepticism. We have learned over the years that probably 50% of the Luger bring-backs come with a bit of daring-do attached.
And a lot of things don't add up about a .30 commercial luger, supposedly new but already mismatched, showing up at that particular point in history.
Anyway, please understand our skepticism. And if Dad is willing, maybe ask him about it.
dju

[durr3]

I am sorry that I asked. I will be glad to follow up with names, dates, and any more information. I was not trying to start WWIII. It is what it is........

[Ben M.]

crown nitro proof ?

[DavidJayUden]

D:
Thank you and we will look forward to the addl. info.
dju

[alanint]

Originally Posted by durr3

Can I ask if you were there Mr. alanint? Can you say with 100% certainty, that you are right? I don't think so.....
My father is almost 90 now and will be glad to debate you on your opinion.

As I asked from the begining, "don't take offense". But to any student of history, it is like telling us you were born in 1958 but insist you were aboard the Titanic.
Nothing about your story adds up historically and your photos support this opinion. Enjoy your family legacy but take the story with a grain of salt.

[Ron Wood]

This is a very odd gun. By the proofs it is a commercial piece made in the 1920s but the serial number is not consistent with that identification. It is in fantastic condition and from the photos it does not appear to be refinished. I'm pretty sure it hasn't...the markings are way too sharp and exhibit halos and upset metal around the numbers. The toggle train is a mis-match but is in the same condition as the rest of the gun. I can't speak to the story of the origin or history of the gun, but it appears to be as close to factory new as you can get. It is fascinating and I would very much like to see several more detailed photos of the gun. If you took one out of a crate whenever or wherever that might have been, I would expect it to look like this. It might be a fantasy piece, but it sure is a pretty one.

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by durr3

I am sorry that I asked. I will be glad to follow up with names, dates, and any more information. I was not trying to start WWIII. It is what it is........

I suggest recording this conversation with your father. It can be referred to later, for details; and the recorded interview, itself, will be a family heirloom. It is one way to preserve your dad's experiences and stories--which would otherwise be lost.