Advice on 1st Luger

[SailorBill]

This is my inaugural post, although I’ve been lurking for over a year. I’ve now reached the point where I must expose my lack of knowledge and ask for your opinions and advice. It’s my “what should be my first Luger” question. I’ve learned from this forum that it’s a good idea to own a “shooter” pistol before getting into the collectibles. With that in mind, and after spending too many hours looking at Luger descriptions on the Simpson site. I’m looking at two possible candidates for a fist Luger.

Number one is a classified as a good looking shooter grade DWM 1908 commercial ($1195):

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...ducts_id=27979


The second is an unfired Interarms American Eagle (Mauser) ($1895):

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...ducts_id=31735


It’s probably obvious that I must have a need for a good looking range pistol . . .

Your comments on these Lugers, their quality, other alternatives, etc, are appreciated.

[nukem556]

I'd say go with the 1908....that way you wont have that little nagging voice in the back of your head saying "pssst.. it's not a REAL Luger"

Seriously though, you'll have a 100 year old pistol with a lot of history behind it that you can still shoot...that's pretty cool.

[Edward Tinker]

A shooter is good no matter what - but I always try to steer someone towards what 'era' they really like. WW1, commercial, Weimar, Nazi era and buy one from that time period. of course a 1970's mauser is a great shooter

But a 1908 is cool too ---

[cirelaw]

I definitly go with the 1908. They were the first 9mm luger. I own one and they are classy, well built and very cool even as a mismatch~ One caveat, before go the the range have some one knowlegable with lugers and their workings check to see if its safe for you and the others at your range!!! ~Eric

[ithacaartist]

Hi Bill,

Welcome to posting on the forum...

I'm not so quick to make a decision for you about which pistol you might be happier with--kind of agree with Ed about acquiring within your genre of interest.

Simpson's is a reputable dealer, they apparently stand by what they sell. For this security, however, you will pay a little extra--but it can be worth it.

The 70s Mauser is one of the more desirable/scarce of those produced at that time. Fewer examples with '06 style frames than the other--Swiss style. Personally, these are more handsome. Sounds like basically a new pistol here, you get to break it in! Though manufacturing techniques for these deviate somewhat from the 'originals", they have a reputation for being generally well and fairly faithfully made, and are strong, durable shooters. This one is very nice and has the attractive, properly strawed parts.

The DWM is also charming and desirable (9mm). There is more of a statistical risk of breaking a part with the older guns, but not so great a consequence with a shooter. The early commercials are known for their great finishes and workmanship.

This is likely not news to you, since you've been reading the forum for a year, but I just wanted to add my $.02 worth. This would be a tough decision for me to make (love 'em all!) because the early one costs less--but the later one is all crisp and minty. If price were not an issue, I might flip a coin; or I might buy both! The latter might actually be a good idea because Lugers overall keep appreciating in value.

If you're good right now with either, wait for the opinions and observations by the members to all come in, and there might be something in the discussion that will make your decision easier.

[Sieger]

Hi,

If the Interarms were in 9mm, I'd be tempted to buy it, but it's in .30 Luger, and ammo is difficult to find.

Also, the price of the Interarms is a bit high.

For a reblued and mismatched shooter, the 1908 is also too high for me.

I'd suggest you keep looking and buy a collector grade Luger as an investment for the future. Yes, you can still shoot a nice Luger, if you watch out for the hot stuff. Frankly, its best to reload, if you are a reloader.


Sieger

[SailorBill]

Thanks for the quick responses. ithacaartist, I'll take your advice and wait for more responses to arrive. Also, at this point I have no era in mind. Are the earlier Lugers (similar to the Walther PP) the better quality?

[SailorBill]

A question. What is the difference between the .08 frame and the Swiss frame, and why is one possibly more desirable than the other?

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by SailorBill

Thanks for the quick responses. ithacaartist, I'll take your advice and wait for more responses to arrive. Also, at this point I have no era in mind. Are the earlier Lugers (similar to the Walther PP) the better quality?

The early commercials are more akin to fine jewelry. Military examples can show a few tooling marks, here and there. Commercials had to be pretty.

I agree with Sieger about the prices, but that's Simpson's. Different areas of the country seem to command different prices for Lugers, and for some Simpson's may be at relative par, or thereabouts, compared to local offerings, if any.

Your best bet--once you decide what you're after--is to pounce upon an offering in our WTS section. As someone posted not too long ago, this way the wheat is already sorted out from the chaff. Also, post your wishes in the WTB.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by SailorBill

A question. What is the difference between the .08 frame and the Swiss frame, and why is one possibly more desirable than the other?

I believe they are referring to the grip frame - the 'Swiss style' straight front strap vs the little bulge at the bottom.

Early commercials [1900AE for example] have much closer tolerances. They were not intended for trench warfare [yet] so they could be hand fitted and tool marks eliminated. Better blue, better wood, etc.

I have bought from Simpson's and if they have what you want, they will work with you. IIRC, either Bob or Brad is a member here. (Maybe both).

Gunbroker.com is a hunting ground that I peruse daily. But as is pointed out here, you have to beware...But you can score a decent shooter if you look closely...

[CAP Black]

I think that both guns under consideration are priced too high. On Gunbroker.com I notice that individual owners don't really know the prices so they tend to be over or under priced. Get a feel for which is which and then make your move.
I agree on items for sale on this site but you have to check the items offered often - as they seem to be gone, in a hurry.
thanks
Jack

[mrerick]

Bill,

Military accepted Lugers that are as close to the original condition they were shipped from the factory are generally the most highly valued to collectors. There are specific commercial Lugers that are also highly valued. Some are quite common. Import marks, refinishing and replacement of original parts generally eliminates collector interest.

Between numerous variations, some are more rare and thus more highly valued than others.

There are exceptions... There are some variations in Russian Capture and East German Volkspolizei reworked Lugers that are starting to become considered collectible. Generally Swiss Lugers that have been rebuilt through normal armory maintenance programs are considered collectible.

You should think about what you're interested in. A specific era of history? High precision technology? Shooting? Understanding these things will help you make a good choice as Lugers within your interest become available.

Do you have a specific area of interest? "All of the above" will probably not help you narrow it down...

Note that there are many, many variations and choices available. This, naturally, offers many points to make decisions. Markings on rare Lugers are regularly faked to increase their value, so focusing on very rare and expensive Lugers can be quite risky, especially if you haven't studied them well enough to recognize fakery.

A run of the mill mismatched shooter Luger should run $800-$1000. Mid quality matching original finish military accepted Lugers generally start at $1350 to $1500.

The books that collectors use to reference variations may seem expensive, but they are inexpensive when they help you avoid a very costly collecting mistake (say, by identifying a fake, or helping you understand rarity of a varistion).

[Sergio Natali]

Bill,

First of all welcome to this forum.
I've not read all the posts, still if what you want is to start with a "shooter" (right choice) and you want to use it at the range, if I were you , I would choose a late production, non matching Luger, say 1941/1942 as I believe that one century old Lugers should never be fired with modern high speed high power ammunitions, as with the time they may have become somehow structurally unsound. IMHO.

Safe shooting.

Sergio

[SailorBill]

". . . one century old Lugers should never be fired with modern high speed high power ammunitions, as with the time they may have become somehow structurally unsound. -- Sergio"

Thanks -- that's something I had not considered. Certainly makes sense.

[SailorBill]

As I expected from this group, the replies coming in are all thoughtful and professional. I just need to review them more than once. Lugers are just more complicated than I ever expected

[cirelaw]

I was told this is the only ammo safe to use! Before you shoot make sure you have some one competent to inspect it to assure its safe to fire!! ~Eric

[spartacus38]

Bill,
I would buy neither.Slow down.Buy some good books by Still and/or Hallock.
See what era you like best and go from there.
Bob

[SailorBill]

Bob, I'm in the Bay Area. Any suggestions on local gun stores that might have an inventory of Lugers?

[spartacus38]

Hi Bill,
Please private email your phone number and I will give you a call.
Spartacus38@charter.net
Bob

[SailorBill]

Bob,

I've not posted enough to have that board "privilege." I'll send an Email.