scoped luger

[Lonnie Zimmerman]

Have any of you ever mounted a scope on a Luger? I put one on an artillary model using the base for the rear site. It shot GREAT with a stock but the action wouldn"t cycle

[Doug]

The gun probably did not cycle due to the increased mass on the barrel. This would not let the toggle have enough momentum to actuate the toggle correctly. I did see a picture of a scoped carbine in a book once. It looked like it was mounted offset on the left side.

[Lonnie Zimmerman]

John Martz told me he made one once that came off the trigger guard, but that he would never make another.

The mount was pinned and screwed to the left side of the frame between the side plate and the safety.

This sets up a paralax condition that results in the bullet path crossing the line of sight so that accuracy is range dependent. and a makes it a bit rough to judge the "Kentucky Windage"

ViggoG

Check Datigs book for picture of long barrel Luger with scope --side mounted.

[Johnny Peppers]

Viggo,

The small amount of offset of the scope would not be a problem on the Luger at any reasonable range. The rotational drift of the bullet would be much more a factor in sighting the pistol in than the slight amount of offset of the scope. The US M1 Rifle in the scoped versions had to use an offset mount due to the rifle loading from the top with a clip. The offset was never a problem with this rifle, but also the rotational drift of the bullet was very slight (6.7" @ 1000 yds) when compared to the 9mm Luger round. The offset of the scope on the M1 Rifle was slightly less than 1"; so if you sighted the rifle in to hit to the left slightly less than 1" it would remain parallel with the bore to the extent of the accuracy of the rifle except for the outside forces working on the bullet.

Someone that "Bench Sights In" dead on at 25 feet and can not understand why he has a group that center 4" left on the target at 100 yds. (Quite easy to happen with a 4x or more scope)

Thats the small paralax problem that I was referring to.

and this condition becomes more apparent as the scope power increases and allows more precise sight alignment.

ViggoG

[Johnny Peppers]

An initial 25yd zero is common on highpower rifles, but then the target is moved out to 100yds for the final zero. When the shooter made the adjustments at 100yds, the pistol would then be zeroed for all practical purposes at any distance in between, and only off by 1" or so at 200yds which is beyond the precise accuracy of the pistol.

[Lonnie Zimmerman]

After I put one on a Broomhandle that works great I THOUGHT putting one on an artillary model would be easy. Maybe someone will come up with something that is improved over the one in Datig.

[Big Norm]

Lonnie,


I too have had thoughts about mounting a scope on an artillery lugers barrel. I thought that a two piece mount that would resemble a figure 8 as a cross section might work. A screw in the center of the eight would help clamp the two pieces together onto the barrel and the scope. I don't know about the stableness of such a scope. But I did not want to experiment by drilling and tapping because, if I failed, I did not want to screw up a good arty. But if strike me that I saw something like this in a gun magazine someplace. It was not specifically for a Luger.


I do not have good vision in my shooting eye and I thought that this would increase my shooting fun while hunting coyote and ground hog. The hunting of these critters is not a long distance shot. Shotguns are commonly used on coyote. And ground hogs are for fun plus the farmers will love you.

Big Norm

[Lonnie Zimmerman]

Norm; this was to be for the coyotes that I have around here. I got one with a Broomhandle (scoped) and wanted to try and get one with a Luger.


Lonnie

By my figure, When you re-zero at 100 yds. You will now have moved the 25 yd, impact point 3/4" to the right.

There is no way to zero a weapon w/side mtd. scope at more than one range.

All other ranges will be in error by the proportion of the crossing angle, which is Tangent Angle = Scope offset / range (distance)

Its got to be,

But as you suggest, If you zero at a very long distance the maximum error appears at the shortest range and is never more than the scope offset distance.

ViggoG

[Big Norm]

Yah! A 9mm sounds just about right for a coyote. I had a chance at one with my deer rifle a few years ago but I thought that a 30.06 would mangle a good hide. Many people had yelled at me for not shooting anyway. But I was deer hunting in a hot spot and I didn't want to spoil what I was really after. I shot a snowshoe rabbit with my rifle and I only found two of its legs. I felt bad about it because I love eating those suckers.

Big Norm

[Johnny Peppers]

Viggo,

You would be exactly right and I in no way indicated that the pistol would be exactly on at every range out to 100 yards, but for practical accuracy the 3/4" at 25 yards would hardly be noticed. Then the figure becomes 1/2" at 50 yards and only 1/4" at 75 yards. Are not all of these withing the practical accuracy of the weapon?

Again you are right that the weapon cannot be zeroed at more than one range if you want it to hit dead on at a given range, but this also holds true if the scope is mounted directly above the bore. At one point the bullet crosses above the point of aim and then again it drops below the point of aim. This is much more critical than the small amount of error created by the scope being mounted to the side of the barrel. And then again, the rotational drift of the bullet becomes more of an error than the error created by the offset of the scope.

If the pistol was capable of putting all the bullets into one hole at any given range, it could be sighted in to have the bullet strike to the exact 3/4" offset of the scope and the bullet would never cross the line of the bore. The group would only be off by 3/4" at any given range if we again forget about rotational drift.

[Hugh]

BN,


The figure 8 mount you are thinking of was one used back in the 50's & 60's to mount a pistol scope on the barrel of a Mdl. 94 Winchester. A regular scope could not be mounted above the reciever due to the top ejection. So it was this or a side mount.