Please help Luger Artillery newb: molested barrel (ewe!)?

[1917garkunkel]

Hello all,

Another Luger inheritor here, looking for a clue!

Mine is a 1917 Artillery (i hope) all numbers 37 except rear section of toggle link and possibly the barrel, and magazine. My father bought this in Chicago in '65. It was last fired in '90-ish. Now it is mine.

After some reading here and elsewhere, i'm coming to the conclusion that the 8" barrel on this was turned or machined somehow at the breech end to get rid of the squared section for the mounting of the sight. if this is the case, i want to find the machinist and begin strangling procedures!

The bottom of the barrel where markings would typically be found shows absolutely nothing. also, i can't discern numbers on the front sight, but maybe the small cross piece was punched out, inverted, reinstalled, hiding the 37?? see that pic, showing a line punched in to the top right side of that little cross piece.

So...
I'm wondering if any one of you have seen this characteristic on an artillery barrel, or could shed any light on 'who dunnit' ...or just tell me anything about my assumptions that this thing has been majorly tampered with/altered!

I saw one other artillery on here somewhere (it was an hour or so back in my searching) with a round area where the sight would mount, that someone affixed an artillery style rear sight to. this was definitely a mod.

thank you all very much!! -Ross



well, crap... i just tried to upload 6 pictures and am unable to. hmm, i will try again, or, maybe it's because i am new here?

in the meantime i will post this

[1917garkunkel]

pic..

[lugerholsterrepair]

Your pistol is out of battery. Likely the toggle hook to attach to the mainspring is not hooked properly.

You are actually lucky..this is not an Artillery. Someone put a FUBAR Artillery barrel on it..but it doesn't belong to this pistol. Well..with the mis numbered rear toggle part it MIGHT have been once..This mis matched part has a rear sight that wouldn't be on an Artillery pistol.

The sight base has been lathe turned off?

[alanint]

Welcome to the forum,

I agree that the barrel is an artillery that someone turned down at the rear sight area and that a rear toggle with sight was added in order to create a longer sight base. Turning down the barrel at the rear sight would have also eliminated any markings usually found there, so that you will never know if the barrel is original to the pistol.

The gun has been buffed and refinished as well.

This makes the gun a mismatched shooter worth maybe $800 or so.

[ithacaartist]

The relief notch for the original rear sight leaf clearance is on the frame, which means that this would started out as an artillery. Strictly speaking, I'd call it an Artillery with two major issues. I agree with Doug about the rear toggle link. Way too bad about the barrel... But it is reminiscent of commercial Lugers Stoeger might have re-barreled in the 20s? Aside from the aesthetics and finer points of the approach used on the former rear sight, an 8" Luger with standard sights looks just fine to me. And it would have a sight radius of about a foot. It should be a gas to shoot!

[1917garkunkel]

Thank you both Jerry and alanint! I do appreciate your information.

I took the slide/toggle off for the first time ever without any prior experience (you would've gotten a kick out of watching me try to figure this thing out!) so i'm not surprised I got it back together incorrectly... you know, since then i've continued looking at it thinking "this does not look right." will try again.

Do you fellows think it's even the slightest bit possible a #'37' rear toggle link could be sourced--or do Luger collectors have a (an online) place they go when looking for numbered parts for these guns? I've found Lugerman.com. Or is that all pretty pointless due to the barrel issue...

thank you all again for your time!

As I knew i'd be receiving this gun, my thoughts were, I'd sell it if it was worth 2K or more, and if not I'd keep it forever. Looks like i'm now an Owner... and as such will be on here from time to time.

[DavidJayUden]

You can advertise below for that toggle link, or over on Jan Still's website, however I doubt that it will benefit your cause. The gun is mismatched and a shooter and hunting up a #37 link isn't going to change that.
However as David pointed out, it should be an exceptional shooter.
dju

[1917garkunkel]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

The relief notch for the original rear sight leaf clearance is on the frame, which means that this would started out as an artillery. Strictly speaking, I'd call it an Artillery with two major issues. I agree with Doug about the rear toggle link. Way too bad about the barrel... But it is reminiscent of commercial Lugers Stoeger might have re-barreled in the 20s? Aside from the aesthetics and finer points of the approach used on the former rear sight, an 8" Luger with standard sights looks just fine to me. And it would have a sight radius of about a foot. It should be a gas to shoot!

Ahh, cool. you're talking about that little flat that runs transverse just about 1/2" toward the front from the '1917'... hmm, cool observation.

The number stamped into the rear toggle... at first looks like a 32, then i realize the original font would make that first number a 7 then there's definitely a 2... but there's weird stuff going on there: definitely some over-stamping and another strange symbol or lettering/numbering at the upper area of those numbers. Would you happen to know if Stoeger used to stamp their own info on the guns they de-flowered?

i guess it's a little cumbersome to thank everyone individually, so, going forward i'll just exude it and know that you know what i mean.

-Ross

[lugerholsterrepair]

Do you fellows think it's even the slightest bit possible a #'37' rear toggle link could be sourced? Yes..parts can and are found every day BUT you have a rather severe problem. You will not only be looking for a 37 numbered part but an ARTILLERY part with NO sight! I won't say it's impossible but it narrow's the odds. I have a long list of magazine numbers taped to the side of my monitor..every day I see magazines..in 15 years I have yet to find any kind of match. I know..other people have and they are out there..with the internet you really have a chance to see one. Like others have said..it really won't make much difference in the long run.

[JTD]

Spend the money on bullets. John

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by JTD

Spend the money on bullets. John

Ross, I'm not saying it was re-barreled by Stoeger. It was an 8" LP.08 when it was born. Somebody turned down the barrel and removed the accommodation for a rear sight. A mis-/force matched standard rear toggle link was changed in, its v-notch sight to compensate for the loss of the barrel's sight. After all this heavy-handed surgery, it looks like one of the Stoeger Lugers. They would re-barrel in a number of lengths--some of them approaching outrageous--and the standard rear toggle link was retained.

Even if you found a rear toggle link numbered 37 with no sight notch, you'd need to find an artillery barrel with sight leaf intact, and all those parts would need to match, too. The odds of returning this pistol to number matching are homeopathic!

[1917garkunkel]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

Ross, I'm not saying it was re-barreled by Stoeger. It was an 8" LP.08 when it was born. Somebody turned down the barrel and removed the accommodation for a rear sight. A mis-/force matched standard rear toggle link was changed in, its v-notch sight to compensate for the loss of the barrel's sight. After all this heavy-handed surgery, it looks like one of the Stoeger Lugers. They would re-barrel in a number of lengths--some of them approaching outrageous--and the standard rear toggle link was retained.

Even if you found a rear toggle link numbered 37 with no sight notch, you'd need to find an artillery barrel with sight leaf intact, and all those parts would need to match, too. The odds of returning this pistol to number matching are homeopathic!

Yeah, I'm hearin' ya on this. Such a shame!
I think I've finally reached the acceptance stage... and now just thinking about goin' shootin'.

I did get it broken down though, pretty much completely, oiled and back together the right way, so, that's something anyway!