my profile |
register |
faq |
search upload photo | donate | calendar |
06-29-2024, 01:10 PM | #1 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
Black Widow ( so called )
What would be the correct holster for a BYF Black Widow? Not sure I agree "there is no such thing..." Lugers side by side to this one overall are a different color...
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-29-2024, 04:00 PM | #2 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Newburgh,IN
Posts: 790
Thanks: 393
Thanked 631 Times in 334 Posts
|
I have a 1942 BYF "black widow" Luger and a holster that came with it. Was the 1942 dated P.08 holster originally issued with the firearm? Well, possibly. There are a number of appropriate holsters that could have been issued with my or your BYF Luger.
__________________
“God created war so that Americans would learn geography.” ― Mark Twain |
06-29-2024, 04:24 PM | #3 |
User
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Southwest Virginia
Posts: 373
Thanks: 768
Thanked 554 Times in 198 Posts
|
Many collectors consider a “correct” holster to be one of the same year, or within a year, of the pistol’s manufacture. I.e., a 1941 Luger would be correct in a 1940/41/42. And course, a police Luger would have a police style holster, etc.
__________________
John 8:32 reive (riːv) vb (Military) (intr) dialect Scot and Northern English to go on a plundering raid [variant of reave] ˈreiver n e.g., " Some view the Border Reivers as loveable rogues." |
The following 4 members says Thank You to Bill_in_VA for your post: |
06-29-2024, 04:36 PM | #4 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
I like the within 1 year theory. Makes sense.
Purchased a number of really nice holsters over the years.
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
The following 2 members says Thank You to militaria for your post: |
06-29-2024, 04:41 PM | #5 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
My 1942 P08 Otto Koberstein Landsberg a.W (an der Warthe) should be good although it's not mint like the Luger . Hard to read below the Waffenamt. Think WaA14
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-29-2024, 07:20 PM | #6 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
Thanks to all my other is Carl Hepting! Nearly impossible to read but with some letters voila!!!!
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-29-2024, 09:39 PM | #7 |
Super Moderator
Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North of Spokane, WA
Posts: 15,931
Thanks: 2,030
Thanked 4,527 Times in 2,090 Posts
|
I'm in the Pacific NW also, but near Spokane.
I think the newer looking a luger is, then it is darker, age and handling make them less dark. So, although a Black Widow can "LOOK" darker than one with wood grips, they are not any different, were not made for any specific groups like the SS or any other silly nonsense. Did they get issued to those folks, sure.
__________________
Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV |
The following member says Thank You to Edward Tinker for your post: |
06-29-2024, 10:41 PM | #8 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
No question finish gets rubbed off. Perhaps BYF also had a darker finish they used at times?
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-30-2024, 03:40 AM | #9 |
Lifetime Forum
Patron Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska. Home of the best moose.
Posts: 658
Thanks: 364
Thanked 1,175 Times in 393 Posts
|
BYF is the concealment code for Mauser-Werke. Same as an S/42 or 42 code or a Mauser "Banner". All the guns came off the same assembly line and went through the same blueing tanks. They went from the time consuming, labor intensive "rust blue" to the hot tank salt bath blueing in 1937. There are slight variations in color, but nothing specific to a BYF 42 gun, other than the black bakelite grips, which came about in '41 and continued into '42, although they were not used all the time. Many guns of those years were supplied with walnut or beech grips. "Black Widow" is a made up term, much like "assault rifle".
|
The following 4 members says Thank You to gunbugs for your post: |
06-30-2024, 10:51 AM | #10 |
User
Join Date: Aug 2023
Posts: 76
Thanks: 18
Thanked 58 Times in 35 Posts
|
True dat. In my limited experience there is a premium on any 1941 or '42 waffenamt-issued military holster just because they are correct for a black widow. Somewhat harder to find as well on that account.
I have a 1941 dated all correct holster that I found for $150, but it is really beat. It's OK because I have a shooter-grade byf 41 BW that does not justify an expensive holster. FWIW, I have seen nice 41/42 examples go for $450 or more. -Bob |
06-30-2024, 11:23 AM | #11 |
User
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Rocky Mountain High
Posts: 312
Thanks: 173
Thanked 248 Times in 86 Posts
|
I'm waiting for the "Brown Recluse" fad. The "Black Widow" mania has just been hilarious. Lemmings
Ford, there isn't any better. Last edited by Roadster 02; 07-01-2024 at 12:57 PM. |
06-30-2024, 01:39 PM | #12 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
I'm a lemming? Really? It's a discussion man we're not all as incredibly intelligent as you...
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-30-2024, 02:37 PM | #13 |
Lifetime Forum
Patron Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska. Home of the best moose.
Posts: 658
Thanks: 364
Thanked 1,175 Times in 393 Posts
|
No offense meant. I'm sure it just bothers some that the Luger community has been bombarded with made up descriptions. Much like the seller on GB that has a "combat chromed" Luger. Or the "Grey Ghost" P-38's, or "Tanker" Garands. Heavy sigh. None of which actually were called that. Just invented names to make something common seem special. A so called "Black Widow" Luger is correctly described as a BYF '41 or '42 with Black bakelite grips. Actually one of the more common variations, akin to a 1940 42 code. Nothing more, nothing less.
|
The following 6 members says Thank You to gunbugs for your post: |
06-30-2024, 02:49 PM | #14 |
User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 7
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
I was just posting, asking, wondering. Sad is that some people behind a keyboard would not communicate in a room with 10 people like they do behind the veil of the Internet. Makes forums a very unrewarding visit. This isn't the only one obviously but toss this kind of posting.
__________________
Porsche, there is no substitute. |
06-30-2024, 03:01 PM | #15 |
Lifetime Forum
Patron Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska. Home of the best moose.
Posts: 658
Thanks: 364
Thanked 1,175 Times in 393 Posts
|
I have to agree. Some folks will say things over the phone, or post things from the keyboard that they would never say to your face....
|
06-30-2024, 06:14 PM | #16 |
Moderator
Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Europe
Posts: 5,053
Thanks: 1,036
Thanked 3,988 Times in 1,205 Posts
|
Basically any military German P08 holster is fair game for any P08. The Germans truly did not care which pistol went in which holster and they were ordered separately anyway.
|
The following 6 members says Thank You to Vlim for your post: |
07-01-2024, 09:20 AM | #17 |
User
Join Date: Aug 2023
Posts: 76
Thanks: 18
Thanked 58 Times in 35 Posts
|
Perhaps the greatest thing about a true BW is that it holds its value and appreciates in value more than the pre-byf run-of-the-mill Mauser P.08's.
Lots of people know about the American origin of the name but that hasn't stopped them from wanting and buying one, even when they know the truth. Even original phenolic grips for BW's are approaching what a decent shooter-grade P.08 is bringing. |
The following member says Thank You to velodog455~ for your post: |
07-01-2024, 09:43 AM | #18 |
Moderator
Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Europe
Posts: 5,053
Thanks: 1,036
Thanked 3,988 Times in 1,205 Posts
|
The black widow is a fairy tale, plain and simple. And anyone paying a premium for those black grips needs his head examined.
|
The following 10 members says Thank You to Vlim for your post: |
07-01-2024, 11:29 AM | #19 |
Lifer
Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 725
Thanks: 2,089
Thanked 606 Times in 327 Posts
|
My 42 byf came with a holster and unmarked loading tool.
The holster is a 1942 “DLU” Ewald Lunenschloss, Militareffekten-Fabrik, Solingen (formerly Eastern Germany, near Dusseldorf). They are fairly common, from what I have seen. References: Luger Holsters and Accessories of the 20th Century, Eugene J. Bender, p. 207 and The Standard Directory of Proof Marks (WWII German Ordinance Codes) Gerhard Winsberger. |
07-06-2024, 10:44 PM | #20 |
Lifer
Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 617
Thanks: 3,065
Thanked 1,057 Times in 429 Posts
|
I concur with Vlim 100%
Never forget that the world was a vastly different world around 1900 to 1950 or so as compared with the later RADIO ERA. It was a rough brutal landscape of poverty, starvation, disease and anarchy. Chaos & disorder were the hallmarks of the day. Communication was laughable by today's standards & surviving on this world was by no means easy or guaranteed. People of the day were worried about how to stay alive & fed rather than what color their holsters were !
__________________
Whoever said that "money can't buy you happiness" never bought a Luger. WTB - Take Down Lever & Trigger Plate (#90) for an Imperial Artillery.
|
The following 2 members says Thank You to spangy for your post: |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|