experimentation

Rick W. · 09-10-2001, 09:33 AM

i

Thor · 09-10-2001, 10:05 AM

On the old site, the one John Chapman started and the pre DOK era, there was a picture of a Luger with a side mount scope on it! I dont think I have a copy any more! I doubt it worked very well or we would have seen some more of them. ~Thor~

John Sabato · 09-10-2001, 12:12 PM

But I remember that Photo was of a 16" barreled Luger without a forestock or handguard, and that the scope was side mounted using tow Williams type thumbscrews that were tapped into the large rectangle of the frame to the right of the sideplate area and in front of the safety...

If I come across the photo at a later time Rick (& Ted) I will let you know... but IMHO it was a pretty ugly setup.

If I were going to scope a Luger I would get a long barrel that pleased my eye and then forward mount a long eye relief scope on a base much like the Artillery Rear Sight base... In fact, one of the new reproduction Artillery barrels with the built in base would be perfect for this...

-John

Big Norm · 09-10-2001, 01:57 PM

When I first started collecting artillery Lugers I thought there might be an original sniper type scope that I could mount. I was not able to find any examples of it in books or at gun shows. Then the price of artilleries started increasing and I thought that artilleries were just too expensive to risk messing up.

Big Norm

09-10-2001, 02:41 PM

Forgive this newbie the question; and I am prepared to take some lumps. But, as I understood it, the "artillery" was issued as a defensive arm. Snipers were issued specially prepared rifles. So, other than "just to do it", what is the rationale of scoping an artillery?

lugerholsterrepair · 09-10-2001, 03:42 PM

It's the American way!

Hugh · 09-10-2001, 03:49 PM

Collectors Firearms in Houston had one with a 16" bbl with a "holosight" mounted on the bbl in a recent Auction Arms auction. I don't know if it sold or for how much, as I wasn't interested. It looked horrible!

John Sabato · 09-10-2001, 03:57 PM

I don't know of a scope that would take the pounding of the lock/unlock cycle of the toggle very many times...

Forward mounting above the barrel or the sidemount described in my other post are the only feasible options on a Luger I can see as worthy of the attempt... but I am with Ad Yeaman... WHY bother?

-John

Dok · 09-10-2001, 04:54 PM

Is this the picture you are thinking of???

http://www.lugerforum.com/images/luger-04.jpg

09-10-2001, 05:37 PM

09-10-2001, 06:20 PM

Silvano · 09-10-2001, 09:26 PM

I agree it did look horrible!

His reserve was $950.00. He ran the auction twice and it didn't sell. It had a nice original commercial barrel with the rear mount for an artillery sight and a raised front mount to match. I wanted the barrel and wasn't to interested in the rest of the gun. Does anyone have a barrel like that? (With the rear sight mount for an artillery sight)

Silvano

Silvano · 09-10-2001, 09:32 PM

Never mind the scope! Thats the barrel I'm looking for!

Silvano

Big Norm · 09-11-2001, 06:22 AM

I was the guy who brought up the possibility of a sniper luger. Here is the reason why. In southern Michigan, rifle hunting for deer is illegal. But pistols are legal to use. Deer hunting with a pistol has become very popular but a 9mm is quite light and most guys use a heavier pistol. Cannons are more like it. Now when I first started collecting Lugers I considered mounting a scope thinking that if I placed a good shot, say to the high neck area, then a Luger could do the job. I had a shooter artillery so I looked to see if there was such a thing as a scope for a Luger. Maybe something that could be clamped to the barrel. I did not think that I would be good enough of a shot with the standard military sights. Since I would be sitting in a blind, the gun would not be jossled around much.

Now I have seen some strange things that were attached to the barrels of artillery Lugers during the war by the Germans. One thing that comes to mind was a brass light afixed to the barrel and powered by a belt battery with wires running from the battery to the light on the gun. The light was held onto the Lugers barrel with clamps. Weird huh? This contraption is currently owned by Doug Smith of F.A.S. in Ohio. I was there when he bought it and he was tickled pink explaining and showing it to everyone.

So this naturally gave me an idea that maybe there was a sort of military sniper scope for an artillery luger. I have since given up on the idea of hunting deer with a luger. But maybe rabbit or coyote with a Luger is possible. A 9mm might be just right for coyote or a big snowshoe rabbit. My brother has suggested using a Luger for boar in California. Like deer and coyote hunting, thats an ambush type of hunting too. I am thinking about that but I think that my 30-30 Winchester model 94 would be better. But Lugers are just too expensive to use in the type of Michigan weather that I hunt deer in. It would be just too easy to rust them up.

Big Norm

09-11-2001, 10:03 PM

John & Thor, I also recall a photo of an artillery with the rear sight removed and a long eye relief ZF41 scope & mount adapted to the dove tail.

09-10-2001, 09:33 AM	#1
Rick W. User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 339 Thanks: 81 Thanked 359 Times in 198 Posts	experimentation i

09-10-2001, 10:05 AM	#2
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Re: experimentation On the old site, the one John Chapman started and the pre DOK era, there was a picture of a Luger with a side mount scope on it! I dont think I have a copy any more! I doubt it worked very well or we would have seen some more of them. ~Thor~

09-10-2001, 12:12 PM	#3
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	I have looked through my photo archive and can't find it either... But I remember that Photo was of a 16" barreled Luger without a forestock or handguard, and that the scope was side mounted using tow Williams type thumbscrews that were tapped into the large rectangle of the frame to the right of the sideplate area and in front of the safety... If I come across the photo at a later time Rick (& Ted) I will let you know... but IMHO it was a pretty ugly setup. If I were going to scope a Luger I would get a long barrel that pleased my eye and then forward mount a long eye relief scope on a base much like the Artillery Rear Sight base... In fact, one of the new reproduction Artillery barrels with the built in base would be perfect for this... -John

09-10-2001, 01:57 PM	#4
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: experimentation When I first started collecting artillery Lugers I thought there might be an original sniper type scope that I could mount. I was not able to find any examples of it in books or at gun shows. Then the price of artilleries started increasing and I thought that artilleries were just too expensive to risk messing up. Big Norm

09-10-2001, 02:41 PM	#5
Ad. Guest Posts: n/a	Why do it? Forgive this newbie the question; and I am prepared to take some lumps. But, as I understood it, the "artillery" was issued as a defensive arm. Snipers were issued specially prepared rifles. So, other than "just to do it", what is the rationale of scoping an artillery?

09-10-2001, 03:42 PM	#6
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Re: Why do it? It's the American way!

09-10-2001, 03:49 PM	#7
Hugh RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeast Texas Swamp Posts: 2,460 Thanks: 2 Thanked 165 Times in 64 Posts	Re: scoped Loogers Collectors Firearms in Houston had one with a 16" bbl with a "holosight" mounted on the bbl in a recent Auction Arms auction. I don't know if it sold or for how much, as I wasn't interested. It looked horrible!

09-10-2001, 03:57 PM	#8
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	A scope attached to the toggle is not feasible! I don't know of a scope that would take the pounding of the lock/unlock cycle of the toggle very many times... Forward mounting above the barrel or the sidemount described in my other post are the only feasible options on a Luger I can see as worthy of the attempt... but I am with Ad Yeaman... WHY bother? -John

09-10-2001, 04:54 PM	#9
Dok RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Bermuda (Eat Your Heart Out) Posts: 1,626 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Dok kept all John Chapman's pics... Is this the picture you are thinking of??? http://www.lugerforum.com/images/luger-04.jpg

09-10-2001, 05:37 PM	#10
Ad. Guest Posts: n/a	Oh. Nobody 'splained it that way! (EOM)

09-10-2001, 06:20 PM	#11
Rob Regers Guest Posts: n/a	lets leave scopes off please (EOM)

09-10-2001, 09:26 PM	#12
Silvano User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 16 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: scoped Loogers I agree it did look horrible! His reserve was $950.00. He ran the auction twice and it didn't sell. It had a nice original commercial barrel with the rear mount for an artillery sight and a raised front mount to match. I wanted the barrel and wasn't to interested in the rest of the gun. Does anyone have a barrel like that? (With the rear sight mount for an artillery sight) Silvano

09-10-2001, 09:32 PM	#13
Silvano User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 16 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Dok kept all John Chapman's pics... Never mind the scope! Thats the barrel I'm looking for! Silvano

09-11-2001, 06:22 AM	#14
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	SNIPER LUGER I was the guy who brought up the possibility of a sniper luger. Here is the reason why. In southern Michigan, rifle hunting for deer is illegal. But pistols are legal to use. Deer hunting with a pistol has become very popular but a 9mm is quite light and most guys use a heavier pistol. Cannons are more like it. Now when I first started collecting Lugers I considered mounting a scope thinking that if I placed a good shot, say to the high neck area, then a Luger could do the job. I had a shooter artillery so I looked to see if there was such a thing as a scope for a Luger. Maybe something that could be clamped to the barrel. I did not think that I would be good enough of a shot with the standard military sights. Since I would be sitting in a blind, the gun would not be jossled around much. Now I have seen some strange things that were attached to the barrels of artillery Lugers during the war by the Germans. One thing that comes to mind was a brass light afixed to the barrel and powered by a belt battery with wires running from the battery to the light on the gun. The light was held onto the Lugers barrel with clamps. Weird huh? This contraption is currently owned by Doug Smith of F.A.S. in Ohio. I was there when he bought it and he was tickled pink explaining and showing it to everyone. So this naturally gave me an idea that maybe there was a sort of military sniper scope for an artillery luger. I have since given up on the idea of hunting deer with a luger. But maybe rabbit or coyote with a Luger is possible. A 9mm might be just right for coyote or a big snowshoe rabbit. My brother has suggested using a Luger for boar in California. Like deer and coyote hunting, thats an ambush type of hunting too. I am thinking about that but I think that my 30-30 Winchester model 94 would be better. But Lugers are just too expensive to use in the type of Michigan weather that I hunt deer in. It would be just too easy to rust them up. Big Norm

09-11-2001, 10:03 PM	#15
tom h Guest Posts: n/a	Re: I have looked through my photo archive and can't find it either... John & Thor, I also recall a photo of an artillery with the rear sight removed and a long eye relief ZF41 scope & mount adapted to the dove tail.