A 30 luger 1911 barrel, who can do it?

[Merick]

Maybe this should be under another topic, but most of the 30 luger discussions are here it seems.

I've thought about this for a long time but I am finally willing to concede I will never have the tools. A 9mm(or 38 super) 1911 would have the correct slide face for 30 luger, all that is needed is to take a 9/38 1911 barrel (are 45 barrels the same exterior dimensions?) re-line it ( probably a stepped liner) cut the chamber, and perhaps swap the recoil spring. ...or so I understand.

So I am looking for someone that has a lathe, a 30 luger reamer, enough interest to try this, and hopefully enough luck and talent to succeed.

[alanint]

The 1911 was offered in 9mm for many years, so I think the conversion is possible. Colt or others would have 9mm magazines available.

I would start by contacting Bar-sto or Jarvis barrel makers to see if they can turn a blank for you.

Good luck, sounds interesting!

[rhuff]

In early July of 2011, I contacted Irv at BarSto concerning a 30 Luger barrel for:

(1) Colt Defender

(2) Browning Hi Power

(3) Sig P225

He informed me that he would make me a 30 Luger barrel for #1 and #2, but not #3. I placed my order at that time. I have many BarSto barrels, and know of none made finer in quality than Irv's barrels. I have not received the barrels as yet, but I have no problem waiting on quality products.

I load the 30 Luger cartridge, and enjoy shooting it in my P08. I just wanted the 30 Luger caliber available in other platforms.


I would think that if Irv can make it for a Colt Defender, that he could make it for any of the Colt 1911 platforms.

I hope that this info will be a help to you.


Doc

[sheepherder]

+ 1 on Bar-Sto...I used to have one of their 38 Super [Nonte] barrels for my S&W 659...Great shooter...(wadcutters only)... (It seems to have grown legs and walked away)...

7.65 Luger in an M1911...I think there was such a chambering offered by Colt at one time (maybe for foreign police orders?) but I can't be sure...

Recoil spring should be no problem; 9mm should work...

Relining a 9mm or 38 Super barrel to 7.65...Hmmmm...I don't like the sound of that...Maybe LugerDoc's gunsmith could do it...

Bar-Sto sound like the best idea...Take out a second mortgage; you'll need it...

[Merick]

To be clear I am looking for a hobbyist / pseudo commercial enterprise that would be willing to take this on for adventure and barter. A custom commercial barrel would be very nice, but being held upside down and having all the money shaken out of my pockets does not sound like my idea of fun.

I have a local friend with a lathe, but the reamer is the missing link, and I figure who ever has a reamer would have a lathe anyhow.

[nukem556]

I knew I recalled somebody had been there, done that....this is from castboolits....a great site for those that pour their own bullets...a .30 1911 does sound fun, this guy was pleased
with his efforts http://castboolits.gunloads.com/arch...hp/t-2022.html

[rhuff]

Originally Posted by Merick

I have a local friend with a lathe, but the reamer is the missing link, and I figure who ever has a reamer would have a lathe anyhow.

There are a number of places that will rent reamers. Their rental prices are very reasonable. Now whether or not they have a 30 Luger reamer to rent is the next question.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by rhuff

There are a number of places that will rent reamers. Their rental prices are very reasonable. Now whether or not they have a 30 Luger reamer to rent is the next question.

Elk Ridge has one -

http://www.reamerrentals.com/Product...ctCode=30Lug.f

4D may have them too (they didn't show the 30 Mauser I rented) but you'd have to call/email & ask -

http://www.4-dproducts.com/display.p...istol+Calibers

Do you have a Colt Gov't Model in 9mm??? If not, you'll need at least the magazine, slide [complete], ejector, and recoil spring from a 9mm Gov't model for your 45...

I'm wondering if you could just cut the barrel section off a 9mm barrel and tap & thread the chamber section for a screw-in 7.65 Luger barrel...(I don't have mine in front of me)...Not one from a Luger, but a blank chambered for 7.65 Luger and turned to the correct diameter & length...and threaded to fit the chamber section...And I would get a Colt Series 70 collet barrel bushing for it...Dremel or mill the feed ramp...

I don't have much faith in silver soldering liners in (others may); I haven't quite figured out how to keep the silver solder where you want it and not all over the whole barrel...

[John Sabato]

Try contacting Clymer about specs on the reamer... they used to have an interactive page for reamers, but that section of their website is under construction at this time.

http://www.clymertool.com

Or you could make your own reamer... the only machine tool required is a lathe... and the reamer is finished with stones and hand tools... it will produce a perfectly acceptable chamber reamer for this type of experiment in an "odd caliber"... I have made them for .22LR many times.

Here is a short web article, and a PDF file is attached that is a longer article with lots of photos on producing such a reamer...

http://www.webcitation.org/query?url...10-25+09:22:07

[sheepherder]

Just got home from work; had a chance to mic my 38 Super barrel and a barrel that I got from Numrich a couple years ago, also in 38 Super...but not for any Colt I ever saw...Muzzle section is way too small for the Colt bushing......

It mic'd .690" major dia in the chamber area; it should take a 1/2" x 28tpi threaded barrel insert OK...I've done these on C96 Mausers & P-38's with no problems...

So, IMHO, if you can locate a 9mm barrel and have your lathe friend turn you a blank & chamber it (and add ramp, ejector cutout, etc) it should take the 7.65 Luger cartridge with no problems...IMHO...

I might try this conversion myself on this Numrich 38 Super barrel...Since I already have a spare Series 70 Colt 38 Super barrel (with Big Bulge muzzle) for my next 80% M1911A1 project...

[rhuff]

It appears that the OP has a number of options available to him at this point. Good Luck, and keep us informed.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by postino

It mic'd .690" major dia in the chamber area; it should take a 1/2" x 28tpi threaded barrel insert OK...

Something like this...

[saab-bob]

Doc
A good friend of mine has a Sig 220-5 that has a convertible barrel for 30 Luger and 9mm.
Interesting gun. Fun to shot in 30 Luger. We used it to fire some 30 Luger handloads we found at at a gun show. The reloader used a M1 carbine bullet. They worked fine.Wouldn't try those rounds in in a real Luger!
That 220 is built like a panzer and very accurate.
I think it would be good choice if you wanted to try different loadings and bullets for 30 Luger reloading.
Bob

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by saab-bob

The reloader used a M1 carbine bullet...

I've used 30 carbine FMJRN bullets for my 30 Mauser, but I drilled them out to lighten them (110 gr with 1/8" x ~3/16" hole = ~86gr)...Worked great!

110gr is a pretty long bullet, though...In the 30 Luger, might be a problem with available space for powder...

Here's an 86 gr 30 cal bullet vs a 110 gr 30 carbine bullet; and a 30 Luger case vs a 30 Mauser case...just for illustration...

[saab-bob]

This was a few years ago and we wondered about that bullet as well. That why we shot those cartridges out of the Sig ,rather then his 1906 A.E.
The spent cases didn't show signs of overpressure?
I wonder if the reloader shortened the bullet? Guess we should have pulled one apart.
Oh well,Fiocchi 30 Luger is fairly available now!
Bob

[rhuff]

Originally Posted by saab-bob

Doc
A good friend of mine has a Sig 220-5 that has a convertible barrel for 30 Luger and 9mm.
Interesting gun. Fun to shot in 30 Luger. We used it to fire some 30 Luger handloads we found at at a gun show. The reloader used a M1 carbine bullet. They worked fine.Wouldn't try those rounds in in a real Luger!
That 220 is built like a panzer and very accurate.
I think it would be good choice if you wanted to try different loadings and bullets for 30 Luger reloading.
Bob

I reload for many different calibers, and have an ample supply of 110gr .308 in JSP bullets for a M1 Carbine. I have been so tempted to try them in 30Luger brass, but just not comfortable loading and shooting them in my 1921 DWM. Perhaps after I get my BarSto barrels for my Colt Defender, and Browning Hi Power(please come soon....I am soooo ready for them), I will be more inclined to give it a try.

As I stated in another thread, I have found a source for a nice 93gr LRN bullet at a reasonable price, and nice folks to deal with also.


I have a very well equipped workshop, but I know that I have nowhere near the machining skills to produce the barrels that I want. When I pull the trigger on either the Defender, or BHP, I want to know that Irv from BarSto built the barrels. I have grown very fond of my hands, face, and pistols.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Rick W.

Looks like any runout from the boreline will be of interest as the project goes along, when the tuning of the lockup and barrel bushing is worked. Guess one could always plan ahead and put the newly stubbed barrel assembly between centers...

I don't have a center plate, or a 4-jaw...What I did was cut one end square and chamfer the bore for a live center...then swapped ends and did the other end...Then, with one end live centered, I turned that end's OD, enough to chuck it in my 3-jaw. Runout was ~.002"...I turned the workpiece 120º in the 3-jaw, and it was down to ~.001"...Close enough...I swapped ends and did it again...Then I cut the threads...Took a while to get a nice tight semi-interference fit...Long thread means lots of friction surface...I'll thin down the mid-barrel section & turn the bushing surface later...

I've checked this enough now to know that this can't be done by mail, or over the phone...To make this worthwhile, you'll have to have the pistol on hand, and trial fit everything as you go along...Trying to make it a universal 'fits-all' just isn't practical...

I've never thought about any other custom chamberings for the 45 except for my 38-45 Clerke barrels...Everything else has always been available in new barrels, fairly cheap...

[Ron Wood]

Rich,
I always enjoy your posts. I think I might be tempted to sacrifice one half of a pair of no longer useful body parts to have your skills and tools. Keep the project photos coming!

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Rich,
I always enjoy your posts. I think I might be tempted to sacrifice one half of a pair of no longer useful body parts to have your skills and tools. Keep the project photos coming!

Ron -

I didn't intend to highjack Matt's thread...It just happened...

Matt - Even though the barrel is identical to the one already fitted to the Colt Gov't Model, the new barrel will have to be 'fitted'...The locking lugs need to be lined up, the barrel hood needs to be located, the link cutout on the bottom of the barrel (where the takedown lever/slide stop fits) needs to be checked & recut if necessary, the barrel bushing needs to be checked & fitted...

You need the complete package on hand...

In theory, if you had a working 9mm Colt Gov't model and just bored it out and sweated a 7.65 Luger liner in place, it would only need minor tweaking...My way needs major tweaking...

[sheepherder]

Well, finished turning, milling, chambering, and a [very] little polishing, and this is what I have...(first pic)...I don't have any spare links or link pins (or a 9mm magazine), so I ordered those from Numrich today. It still needs a *lot* of hand fitting to this Colt frame/slide...I might just put it on one of my in-the-white 80% M1911A1's...

...BUT...Whilst (cool word!) I was measuring the headspace on my Series 70 Colt Gov't Model 38 Super, I was aghast (aghast I say!!!) to find it was .038"!!! That's thirty-eight thousandths!!! I chamber my barrels at .003" - .004" typically...

The second pic shows a Winchester 38 Super round in the 38 barrel, and a reload/resized 7.65 Luger in my 30 Luger barrel...at .005" headspace...(I was off by a thousandth...second time...have to check where I'm going wrong)...

The 38 Super case measures .900" exactly (I expect that from Winchester) and since the 38 Super indexes on the case mouth, there is no excuse for Colt to have this much headspace...I've fired it with no problems, but this is definately something that quality control at Colt should have caught...I bought it used, so there's no point in trying to get it warranteed, but I'll have to look into a new Series 70 Colt 38 Super barrel...