Info neede

451kr · 01-16-2009, 07:20 AM

I`m new on the forum.
I want to buy a navy luger and came accross the following luger.
I know little about Navies but this one looks fine to me.
Any info is welcom.

Thanks in advance. 451kr

Edward Tinker · 01-16-2009, 10:00 AM

A Navy is scary to buy as a first luger, lots of fakes and restores out there.

Looks very nice to me, maybe too nice....

Lots of research and help should be checked out ahead of time.

Welcome to the forum.

ed

Aaron · 01-16-2009, 10:12 AM

What is the asking price for this Luger?

Navy · 01-16-2009, 10:50 AM

Please read my post on authenticating Navys; it is permanently posted in the Navy thread.

Tom A.

Tomathvl · 01-16-2009, 10:50 AM

Leon,
I also welcome you to the forum. I agree with Ed, it maybe too nice looking. I see no evidence of any patina in the finish; from the photos it looks like it maybe refinished but photos can be mileading. A closeup of the crown over M's and the rear sight would also help to see if they look like the real deal. Aaron's question is a good one if it is real and refinished the price should reflect the modified condition.
Tom

Tomathvl · 01-16-2009, 12:42 PM

Leon,
I should have mentioned the flange size on the axle pin should be a large pin on Navy's.
Also, the barrel serial number stamping should show a halo around the numbers.
So far the C/M's and the sight looks OK but the finish and straw still look too good.
Does the barrel serial number exhibit halos? Also refer to Tom A's post that he references.
Tom

Ron Wood · 01-16-2009, 01:42 PM

It appears to be an authentic piece, but I suspect it has been expertly restored. Notice that the toggle axle retaining pin is blued. A clear photo of the barrel markings may help with assessing the finish. Sure is a nice looking gun.

Vlim · 01-16-2009, 02:41 PM

This one has 'Refinished' written all over it.

Shallowness of the 1917 marking, no wear at the edges, crisp strawing. Remember, these things have been on boats for most of their lives. They get wet and get used well.

Holster wear will appear after only a few times in and out of the hoster. This gun has none.

Etc, etc...

Douglas Jr. · 01-17-2009, 04:33 PM

I second the above opinions.
This gun was refinished. A very good job, although.
However, for this amount you can put your hands in a minty, original WWI P08 with holster and spare mag.

Just my humble opinion.

Douglas

LugerVern · 01-17-2009, 06:11 PM

Fake Navy production is getting hard to spot; the enemy has almost perfected their art. Even the experts are finding it difficult to spot their dastardly work and find themselves falling victim.

Please tread carefully!

I am not going to comment negatively on this gun but instead want to show everyone something to help them in their decisions to buy or not.
There is sometimes a height difference between new production barrel ramps and original barrel ramps; it is very slight but visible to the naked eye. It is only one of many things to look for. The pictures shown are not of the gun in question.

I get tired of posting negative posts, its beginning to get boring.
I hope this helps

Vern

drbuster · 01-17-2009, 08:09 PM

Even accounting for the sight ramp, it still looks like a real nice authentic 1917 Navy, albeit it may be expertly refinished. Before giving our blessings with respect to dropping $4K for this, I would very much like to see pictures of the rear toggle pin head and views of the front of the frame and serial number under the barrel.

451kr · 01-18-2009, 09:50 AM

Thanks so far for the comments.
I tried to get some pictures from the seller but until now I didn`t receive them. Maby at a later time.

451kr.

GerColctor · 01-18-2009, 01:43 PM

Seller might be reading this forum discussion. You never know,

Joe

451kr · 01-18-2009, 02:21 PM

Joe,

Thanks for your notice.
I delete the pictures because I didn`t ask the seller before.
Sorry to all.

451kr.

01-16-2009, 07:20 AM	#1
451kr User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Info neede I`m new on the forum. I want to buy a navy luger and came accross the following luger. I know little about Navies but this one looks fine to me. Any info is welcom. Thanks in advance. 451kr Last edited by 451kr; 01-18-2009 at 02:18 PM.

01-16-2009, 10:00 AM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,910 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	A Navy is scary to buy as a first luger, lots of fakes and restores out there. Looks very nice to me, maybe too nice.... Lots of research and help should be checked out ahead of time. Welcome to the forum. ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

01-16-2009, 01:42 PM	#7
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	It appears to be an authentic piece, but I suspect it has been expertly restored. Notice that the toggle axle retaining pin is blued. A clear photo of the barrel markings may help with assessing the finish. Sure is a nice looking gun. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-18-2009, 01:43 PM	#13
GerColctor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: CT & FL Posts: 308 Thanks: 2 Thanked 40 Times in 27 Posts	Seller might be reading this forum discussion. You never know, Joe __________________ It is better to have lived a day as a tiger, then a thousand years as a lamb.

01-16-2009, 10:12 AM	#3
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	What is the asking price for this Luger?

01-16-2009, 10:50 AM	#4
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Please read my post on authenticating Navys; it is permanently posted in the Navy thread. Tom A.

01-16-2009, 10:50 AM	#5
Tomathvl User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Milan, IN Posts: 363 Thanks: 3 Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts	Leon, I also welcome you to the forum. I agree with Ed, it maybe too nice looking. I see no evidence of any patina in the finish; from the photos it looks like it maybe refinished but photos can be mileading. A closeup of the crown over M's and the rear sight would also help to see if they look like the real deal. Aaron's question is a good one if it is real and refinished the price should reflect the modified condition. Tom

01-16-2009, 12:42 PM	#6
Tomathvl User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Milan, IN Posts: 363 Thanks: 3 Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts	Leon, I should have mentioned the flange size on the axle pin should be a large pin on Navy's. Also, the barrel serial number stamping should show a halo around the numbers. So far the C/M's and the sight looks OK but the finish and straw still look too good. Does the barrel serial number exhibit halos? Also refer to Tom A's post that he references. Tom

01-16-2009, 02:41 PM	#8
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	This one has 'Refinished' written all over it. Shallowness of the 1917 marking, no wear at the edges, crisp strawing. Remember, these things have been on boats for most of their lives. They get wet and get used well. Holster wear will appear after only a few times in and out of the hoster. This gun has none. Etc, etc...

01-17-2009, 04:33 PM	#9
Douglas Jr. User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South America Posts: 948 Thanks: 598 Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts	I second the above opinions. This gun was refinished. A very good job, although. However, for this amount you can put your hands in a minty, original WWI P08 with holster and spare mag. Just my humble opinion. Douglas

01-17-2009, 06:11 PM	#10
LugerVern User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Virginia Posts: 563 Thanks: 1 Thanked 34 Times in 27 Posts	Fake Navy production is getting hard to spot; the enemy has almost perfected their art. Even the experts are finding it difficult to spot their dastardly work and find themselves falling victim. Please tread carefully! I am not going to comment negatively on this gun but instead want to show everyone something to help them in their decisions to buy or not. There is sometimes a height difference between new production barrel ramps and original barrel ramps; it is very slight but visible to the naked eye. It is only one of many things to look for. The pictures shown are not of the gun in question. I get tired of posting negative posts, its beginning to get boring. I hope this helps Vern

01-17-2009, 08:09 PM	#11
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Even accounting for the sight ramp, it still looks like a real nice authentic 1917 Navy, albeit it may be expertly refinished. Before giving our blessings with respect to dropping $4K for this, I would very much like to see pictures of the rear toggle pin head and views of the front of the frame and serial number under the barrel.

01-18-2009, 09:50 AM	#12
451kr User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks so far for the comments. I tried to get some pictures from the seller but until now I didn`t receive them. Maby at a later time. 451kr.

01-18-2009, 02:21 PM	#14
451kr User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Joe, Thanks for your notice. I delete the pictures because I didn`t ask the seller before. Sorry to all. 451kr.