Toggle hold open question.

thegundude · 05-08-2005, 09:46 PM

The toggle on my 1920 DWM in .30 does something strange.

When I have the empty, unmarked, wooden bottom mag in it, the toggle does not stay open. If I push up on it, it will hod it open, but when I remove the mag it closes again.

When I put an empty 9mm mag in it, the toggle stays open, even after extract it.

What's up with that?

Edward Tinker · 05-08-2005, 10:49 PM

I believe the push up thingy on the mag is worn on the 30 luger mag and not worn on the 9mm mag (although you can use the same mag for either cartridge, but I think you knew that

Ed

thegundude · 05-08-2005, 11:29 PM

Actually Ed, I'd suspected you could interchange them, but it wasn't confirmed yet until now. :-) Thanks.

So it's the mag and not the gun. That's what I thought that meant, but I couldn't tell much visual difference between the mags.... Or not much anyway....

Edward Tinker · 05-08-2005, 11:47 PM

sometimes a little of both and I am quoting others, this is not my expertise!

So, can be that the part that hits the thing that makes it hold open is worn, so could be both.

Others with more time and smarts will give you real advice, consider this ER advice...

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 09:58 AM

LOL Kind of a Luger Triage? :-)

Thanks Ed.

DougT · 05-09-2005, 11:39 AM

Steve, don't be tempted to "fix" the .30 magazine yourself--we have a few wizards here on the forum who are the ones to do this type of work. Just a suggestion.
DougT

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 01:46 PM

Doug, I could probably do the job myself if I knew what it was that needed to be fixed. I'm an amateur gunsmith, but a reasonable and talented one. But I don't think it's worth fooling with, to be honest. Seems to me the best "fix" for it is just a new mag..... Sounds easy enough to me, now that you guys have confirmed it's the mag and not the gun.... :-P

Rick, if you're a "know nothing guy", you're doing and awfully good imitation of someone whos knows an awful lot! :-) I haven't tried to take the grip off and check it's function yet, but that's a good first step and the first thing I do once I'm home tonight. Thanks...

Edward Tinker · 05-09-2005, 02:13 PM

Steve, that is why it is so nice to bounce ideaers off of so many people here. Lots of talent, then lots of "us" with scatterings of info in our jumbled heads

ed

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 02:28 PM

No kidding Ed. I'm becoming addicted to this place.

You know it will only lead me to purchase another one of those damned Lugers, right? :-P

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 03:16 PM

Rick, I had the grips off this weekend. I took some 0000 steel wool to her and gave her a good scrubbing, something she's not had in years from the look of it. Not badly pitted or anything, just a few spots....

The grips came off surprisingly easy. All I had to do was tap on the underside of the grip (through the mag well) with my finger a few times and they popped off. Now they seem a little loose....

The grips came off well, but I'm not too worried about them. They have the usual broken corner under the safety. You know the one. I've thought about getting some repro grips once I get Thor to work his magic. I'm going to bring it by the range tonight and shoot it. See how it works, if at all. It's IDPA/IPSC night, but I'm sure they'll let me butt in for a mag full. I can't shoot in the competition tonight as my thumb is still too tender to shoot with.

I saw the Artillery rig pictured on another thread that looks like it will be a lot of fun. I can see something like that in my next hunt.... :-) I'd love to be able to slap a buttstock on one and drop a few paper badguys....

DougT · 05-09-2005, 04:02 PM

Steve,
There is no sense in trying to resist it...if the Lugers gotcha--they gotcha! It's kind of like having a mid-life crisis; you can fight it if you want to try, or you can just relax and enjoy it!
DougT

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 04:20 PM

It's LIKE a mid-life crisis? ROTFLMAO!!!! :-d

My SO asked this weekend why I buy so many guns. In the past year and a half, I've accrued about seventy five more guns than I had up to that point. I mentioned to her how much I like these Lugers (I was reading "The Luger Story") and her reaction was "Why do you have to buy more than one of any kind of gun?"

I know, it's a stupid question, but this was how I put it to her. I'm not collecting them just for me, I'm collecting them for her too. After I'm gone, this is all part of her inheritance. She gets the money from the eventual sale of all of my guns. Some people put money in the stock market (I have some there too), some people buy gold and silver. Some buy jewelry as an investment.... Me, I buy guns. Ones that will only increase in value over the years. So it's really all for her.... :-)

How's that for slick? :-P

That was when I took the opportunity to tell her about the Cobray M-11 SMG that I'm waiting for the transfer on...... LMAO!! :-D What can she do? Divorce me?

ROTFLMAO!!! :-D

DougT · 05-09-2005, 10:56 PM

Steve,
The "inheritance excuse" that you are offering her seems pretty flimsy to me--you are what, 42 years old? Are you planing on leaving anytime soon? If so, will a couple of 'em to me, OK?

Take it from a veteran (3 ex-wifes, currently on #4). They usually ask "why do you need so many guns?" Take a couple of deep breaths, then (in your best Dirty Harry voice) look them in the eye and say "it's not a matter of need." You may have to repeat this treatment from time to time, but it's the best response I've ever found and usually works right up to the time they divorce you. You can learn a lot from this forum.
DougT

Edward Tinker · 05-09-2005, 11:04 PM

no, no DougT, that is why you are on #4, borrow this line;

What guns?

or

But, this is the one from Bob's collection, he asked me to take pictures!

or

What? This is the 1937 I had before??? (I know she didn't believe this one either, or the others...

buy her some jewlery, or take her to dinner, or ANYTHING she asks for...

thegundude · 05-09-2005, 11:05 PM

ROTFLMAO!! :-D Doug, yer killin' me!!! :^D

No, she's okay with it. It's not like we're married or anything. And that's just as much her choice as it is mine. She cool with it....

During that conversation I brought up the fact that she just paid nearly $2,000 for a digital SLR camera, after the $150 media card, case, extra batteries, et al.... She says, "But I can use my camera. You can't just go and shoot a machine gun."... "Wrongo sweetheart..."... you see, I call her sweetheart :-P "... I can go the the pistol range anytime I want to and shoot there, perfectly legal.".

"Oh" she says... That was the end of that arguement.

I'm still an idiot though. :-) But that's okay. After twelve years together I've gotten used to being wrong all the time.

DougT · 05-10-2005, 02:24 AM

Ed,
Good material, I've used some of them myself. I love to take her and buy her nice jewelry, then comment later about what a good gun the money could have bought: "Coulda' bought a beautiful Swiss cross in shield for what that cost!" or something like that. I like to point out to her that I can always shoot my guns, but she can only wear her jewelry. I heard a story years ago about a guy who kept a wooden rifle in his gun safe. When he wanted to buy a new rifle, he simply took out the wooden rifle when his wife was around and commented that he needed to "take this one in to get it fixed." He would later bring the new rifle in saying "got it back, works great" or something like that when she was present and then reuse the wooden rifle again the next time. I've been considering a wooden Luger.

Steve, you're not "wrong all the time." Years ago a friend and fellow sufferer (he's married too) explained to me that what really happens is "you get tired of being right." I have finally surrendered to the inescapable fact that they are women, and they just can't help it. God loves 'em and we try!
DougT

thegundude · 05-10-2005, 09:24 AM

Wow Ed, we were writing to the same thread at the same time last night... And those are some good lines. I like the "What guns?" one best...

Yeah, she gets her fair share of jewelry and stuff, but what's gets me is I have to buy her jewelry, but she never buys me guns....

What's up with that? :-/

DougT · 05-10-2005, 01:27 PM

Steve, you're busted! Another member (who shall remain nameless) alerted me to your discussion thread on Parallax Bill's forum--how could you??? After presenting you with my best arguments for restoration (which are bulletproof), you go and change your mind! And I was just starting to like you...I'm crying great big Luger collector tears. OK, let me present my case yet again in another perspective: Consider it from the gun's point of view--it was made in 1920 for the commercial market, and was also probably an export (to where we don't know). If it could talk, what stories would it tell? Did it help put the roar in the "Roaring 20's?". Has it saved lives? Or did it serve the dark side and take them? Who knows, but the odds are that it does have some sort of active history because we do know that it didn't spend it's years in a sheltered, cared for environment. So the poor old thing has a history that it can't tell us about. Now (again from the gun's perspective) if you were in it's place would you want to stay in a downgraded, dilapidated fade-away condition or would you welcome the chance to be restored to your former glory and appreciated for what you once were? Think about it Steve, would you want to fade away to obscurity or be returned to your rightful place in history? Have you no heart, no compassion? Shame on you. Bring the gun back--you'll love it!!!
DougT

thegundude · 05-10-2005, 02:40 PM

I am literally LMAO!! :-D

I see what you're saying about the restoration, but I got to thinking about the whole reason I got this gun, and that was to shoot it. It'd be a shame to restore it back to nearly new again, only to ugly it up again shooting. And I do plan on shooting the crap out if it too. :-)

I hear you, though. Everytime I look at it I think about restoring it. But it was intended to be my shooter after all.

What I am thinking is this. Either I buy another one that's in much better shape, and maybe more collectable, to go with it or I have my 1939, 42 code restored....

Now what do you think?

DougT · 05-10-2005, 07:59 PM

Steve,

Although I am slow to anger, you have done it. Now you will feel the heat of my fury, and bear my weight of my wrath!

We have spoken of Picasso paintings, Stradivarius violins and Luger pistols in the same breath. We have examined history through the perspective of an elegant, deadly tool that functioned before we were born. And yet we still have not brought you from and through your position of quivering indecisiveness. One can display, lovingly gaze at and always be in awe of a Picasso. We can equally appreciate the exquisite form and function of a Stradivarius, as well as hear it's beautiful voice. We can do all of these and more with a restored Luger, and yet the Luger offers something the art object or the musical instrument does not: We can use it to shoot the painting and the fiddle to pieces!

I am sick of your jello-like wavering. Even the newest beginner moves forward...but not you. No, you take up our time with "should I or shouldn't I?" I can tell that you're in pain--the pain of not being able to make up your fickle mind. Well, I'm gonna end it for you Steve; I'm gonna take your pain. My standing offer to you on your newly acquired 1920 Commercial Luger is this: If after having Thor completely restore it, and after receiving it back from him and holding it in your hand, if after all of this you still are not sure if you should have restored it or not then I promise in front of God and the Lugerforum to buy this Luger from you at 105% of the total amount you have in it. I am absolutely serious, I have my C&R and I'm not afraid to use it. This is what you have driven me to; I hope you can sleep at night. So what's it gonna be Steve--the ball's in your court. Like the man said: Go ahead, make my day!
DougT

05-08-2005, 09:46 PM	#1
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Toggle hold open question. The toggle on my 1920 DWM in .30 does something strange. When I have the empty, unmarked, wooden bottom mag in it, the toggle does not stay open. If I push up on it, it will hod it open, but when I remove the mag it closes again. When I put an empty 9mm mag in it, the toggle stays open, even after extract it. What's up with that? __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-08-2005, 11:29 PM	#3
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Actually Ed, I'd suspected you could interchange them, but it wasn't confirmed yet until now. :-) Thanks. So it's the mag and not the gun. That's what I thought that meant, but I couldn't tell much visual difference between the mags.... Or not much anyway.... __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-09-2005, 09:58 AM	#5
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	LOL Kind of a Luger Triage? :-) Thanks Ed. __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-09-2005, 01:46 PM	#7
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Doug, I could probably do the job myself if I knew what it was that needed to be fixed. I'm an amateur gunsmith, but a reasonable and talented one. But I don't think it's worth fooling with, to be honest. Seems to me the best "fix" for it is just a new mag..... Sounds easy enough to me, now that you guys have confirmed it's the mag and not the gun.... :-P Rick, if you're a "know nothing guy", you're doing and awfully good imitation of someone whos knows an awful lot! :-) I haven't tried to take the grip off and check it's function yet, but that's a good first step and the first thing I do once I'm home tonight. Thanks... __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-09-2005, 02:28 PM	#9
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	No kidding Ed. I'm becoming addicted to this place. You know it will only lead me to purchase another one of those damned Lugers, right? :-P __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-08-2005, 10:49 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,933 Thanks: 2,032 Thanked 4,530 Times in 2,092 Posts	I believe the push up thingy on the mag is worn on the 30 luger mag and not worn on the 9mm mag (although you can use the same mag for either cartridge, but I think you knew that Ed

05-08-2005, 11:47 PM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,933 Thanks: 2,032 Thanked 4,530 Times in 2,092 Posts	sometimes a little of both and I am quoting others, this is not my expertise! So, can be that the part that hits the thing that makes it hold open is worn, so could be both. Others with more time and smarts will give you real advice, consider this ER advice...

05-09-2005, 11:39 AM	#6
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, don't be tempted to "fix" the .30 magazine yourself--we have a few wizards here on the forum who are the ones to do this type of work. Just a suggestion. DougT

05-09-2005, 02:13 PM	#8
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,933 Thanks: 2,032 Thanked 4,530 Times in 2,092 Posts	Steve, that is why it is so nice to bounce ideaers off of so many people here. Lots of talent, then lots of "us" with scatterings of info in our jumbled heads ed

05-09-2005, 03:16 PM	#10
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Rick, I had the grips off this weekend. I took some 0000 steel wool to her and gave her a good scrubbing, something she's not had in years from the look of it. Not badly pitted or anything, just a few spots.... The grips came off surprisingly easy. All I had to do was tap on the underside of the grip (through the mag well) with my finger a few times and they popped off. Now they seem a little loose.... The grips came off well, but I'm not too worried about them. They have the usual broken corner under the safety. You know the one. I've thought about getting some repro grips once I get Thor to work his magic. I'm going to bring it by the range tonight and shoot it. See how it works, if at all. It's IDPA/IPSC night, but I'm sure they'll let me butt in for a mag full. I can't shoot in the competition tonight as my thumb is still too tender to shoot with. I saw the Artillery rig pictured on another thread that looks like it will be a lot of fun. I can see something like that in my next hunt.... :-) I'd love to be able to slap a buttstock on one and drop a few paper badguys.... __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-09-2005, 04:02 PM	#11
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, There is no sense in trying to resist it...if the Lugers gotcha--they gotcha! It's kind of like having a mid-life crisis; you can fight it if you want to try, or you can just relax and enjoy it! DougT

05-09-2005, 04:20 PM	#12
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	It's LIKE a mid-life crisis? ROTFLMAO!!!! :-d My SO asked this weekend why I buy so many guns. In the past year and a half, I've accrued about seventy five more guns than I had up to that point. I mentioned to her how much I like these Lugers (I was reading "The Luger Story") and her reaction was "Why do you have to buy more than one of any kind of gun?" I know, it's a stupid question, but this was how I put it to her. I'm not collecting them just for me, I'm collecting them for her too. After I'm gone, this is all part of her inheritance. She gets the money from the eventual sale of all of my guns. Some people put money in the stock market (I have some there too), some people buy gold and silver. Some buy jewelry as an investment.... Me, I buy guns. Ones that will only increase in value over the years. So it's really all for her.... :-) How's that for slick? :-P That was when I took the opportunity to tell her about the Cobray M-11 SMG that I'm waiting for the transfer on...... LMAO!! :-D What can she do? Divorce me? ROTFLMAO!!! :-D __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-09-2005, 10:56 PM	#13
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, The "inheritance excuse" that you are offering her seems pretty flimsy to me--you are what, 42 years old? Are you planing on leaving anytime soon? If so, will a couple of 'em to me, OK? Take it from a veteran (3 ex-wifes, currently on #4). They usually ask "why do you need so many guns?" Take a couple of deep breaths, then (in your best Dirty Harry voice) look them in the eye and say "it's not a matter of need." You may have to repeat this treatment from time to time, but it's the best response I've ever found and usually works right up to the time they divorce you. You can learn a lot from this forum. DougT

05-09-2005, 11:04 PM	#14
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,933 Thanks: 2,032 Thanked 4,530 Times in 2,092 Posts	no, no DougT, that is why you are on #4, borrow this line; What guns? or But, this is the one from Bob's collection, he asked me to take pictures! or What? This is the 1937 I had before??? (I know she didn't believe this one either, or the others... buy her some jewlery, or take her to dinner, or ANYTHING she asks for... __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

05-09-2005, 11:05 PM	#15
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	ROTFLMAO!! :-D Doug, yer killin' me!!! :^D No, she's okay with it. It's not like we're married or anything. And that's just as much her choice as it is mine. She cool with it.... During that conversation I brought up the fact that she just paid nearly $2,000 for a digital SLR camera, after the $150 media card, case, extra batteries, et al.... She says, "But I can use my camera. You can't just go and shoot a machine gun."... "Wrongo sweetheart..."... you see, I call her sweetheart :-P "... I can go the the pistol range anytime I want to and shoot there, perfectly legal.". "Oh" she says... That was the end of that arguement. I'm still an idiot though. :-) But that's okay. After twelve years together I've gotten used to being wrong all the time. __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-10-2005, 02:24 AM	#16
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ed, Good material, I've used some of them myself. I love to take her and buy her nice jewelry, then comment later about what a good gun the money could have bought: "Coulda' bought a beautiful Swiss cross in shield for what that cost!" or something like that. I like to point out to her that I can always shoot my guns, but she can only wear her jewelry. I heard a story years ago about a guy who kept a wooden rifle in his gun safe. When he wanted to buy a new rifle, he simply took out the wooden rifle when his wife was around and commented that he needed to "take this one in to get it fixed." He would later bring the new rifle in saying "got it back, works great" or something like that when she was present and then reuse the wooden rifle again the next time. I've been considering a wooden Luger. Steve, you're not "wrong all the time." Years ago a friend and fellow sufferer (he's married too) explained to me that what really happens is "you get tired of being right." I have finally surrendered to the inescapable fact that they are women, and they just can't help it. God loves 'em and we try! DougT

05-10-2005, 09:24 AM	#17
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	Wow Ed, we were writing to the same thread at the same time last night... And those are some good lines. I like the "What guns?" one best... Yeah, she gets her fair share of jewelry and stuff, but what's gets me is I have to buy her jewelry, but she never buys me guns.... What's up with that? :-/ __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-10-2005, 01:27 PM	#18
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, you're busted! Another member (who shall remain nameless) alerted me to your discussion thread on Parallax Bill's forum--how could you??? After presenting you with my best arguments for restoration (which are bulletproof), you go and change your mind! And I was just starting to like you...I'm crying great big Luger collector tears. OK, let me present my case yet again in another perspective: Consider it from the gun's point of view--it was made in 1920 for the commercial market, and was also probably an export (to where we don't know). If it could talk, what stories would it tell? Did it help put the roar in the "Roaring 20's?". Has it saved lives? Or did it serve the dark side and take them? Who knows, but the odds are that it does have some sort of active history because we do know that it didn't spend it's years in a sheltered, cared for environment. So the poor old thing has a history that it can't tell us about. Now (again from the gun's perspective) if you were in it's place would you want to stay in a downgraded, dilapidated fade-away condition or would you welcome the chance to be restored to your former glory and appreciated for what you once were? Think about it Steve, would you want to fade away to obscurity or be returned to your rightful place in history? Have you no heart, no compassion? Shame on you. Bring the gun back--you'll love it!!! DougT

05-10-2005, 02:40 PM	#19
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	I am literally LMAO!! :-D I see what you're saying about the restoration, but I got to thinking about the whole reason I got this gun, and that was to shoot it. It'd be a shame to restore it back to nearly new again, only to ugly it up again shooting. And I do plan on shooting the crap out if it too. :-) I hear you, though. Everytime I look at it I think about restoring it. But it was intended to be my shooter after all. What I am thinking is this. Either I buy another one that's in much better shape, and maybe more collectable, to go with it or I have my 1939, 42 code restored.... Now what do you think? __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve

05-10-2005, 07:59 PM	#20
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, Although I am slow to anger, you have done it. Now you will feel the heat of my fury, and bear my weight of my wrath! We have spoken of Picasso paintings, Stradivarius violins and Luger pistols in the same breath. We have examined history through the perspective of an elegant, deadly tool that functioned before we were born. And yet we still have not brought you from and through your position of quivering indecisiveness. One can display, lovingly gaze at and always be in awe of a Picasso. We can equally appreciate the exquisite form and function of a Stradivarius, as well as hear it's beautiful voice. We can do all of these and more with a restored Luger, and yet the Luger offers something the art object or the musical instrument does not: We can use it to shoot the painting and the fiddle to pieces! I am sick of your jello-like wavering. Even the newest beginner moves forward...but not you. No, you take up our time with "should I or shouldn't I?" I can tell that you're in pain--the pain of not being able to make up your fickle mind. Well, I'm gonna end it for you Steve; I'm gonna take your pain. My standing offer to you on your newly acquired 1920 Commercial Luger is this: If after having Thor completely restore it, and after receiving it back from him and holding it in your hand, if after all of this you still are not sure if you should have restored it or not then I promise in front of God and the Lugerforum to buy this Luger from you at 105% of the total amount you have in it. I am absolutely serious, I have my C&R and I'm not afraid to use it. This is what you have driven me to; I hope you can sleep at night. So what's it gonna be Steve--the ball's in your court. Like the man said: Go ahead, make my day! DougT