LugerForum Discussion Forums my profile | register | faq | search
upload photo | donate | calendar

Go Back   LugerForum Discussion Forums > General Discussion Forums > Off Topic & Other Firearms

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 07-18-2012, 10:12 PM   #1
ithacaartist
Twice a Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
ithacaartist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY
Posts: 3,215
Thanks: 6,514
Thanked 2,350 Times in 1,274 Posts
Default molding a holster to fit a 1911

Greetings all,

A few weeks ago i won a tanker style shoulder holster for the 1911 on ebay for $16.95. When it arrived, it was very stiff and to plunge the gun inside it would have begun the inevitable polishing of high spots on the gun. Even though it's a $400 knock-off, I'd still like to keep it in the best condition possible. So, it occurred to me to soften the holster up and shape it sufficiently to the gun's shape to minimize the finish wear when I'm using the two together.

First, I got ahold of Jerry Burney, Maestro of Holsters and Leather work, to obtain guidance. It was established that a good soaking in water would suffice to make it pliable for the job to be done on it. We both agreed that a wooden "proxy gun" would best take the place to present the form of the original gun, on which I had no desire to induce rust.

Then, we diverged. Jerry said he uses a counter mold, to press the leather against the inner form while the leather dries within these constraints. I told him I'd try--go ahead, guess--a foodsaver! Below are the results of the effort. The bag lost its seal somehow, within the first couple hours; sorry, I didn't get a pic of everything sucked down tight.

The first three pics are different views of the holster as it arrived. The 4th pic is of the pine/epoxy putty/plexiglass 1911 I made. The reason it looks a little weird is because I fashioned it to create tunnels in the leather, through which the various protuberances on the 1911 pass unmolested until the gun hits the bottom of the holster. The last is the holster with proxy gun in situ, which shows how closely the leather conformed to the inner mold.

I removed the leather from the plastic bag within a couple of hours of molding it and dried the assembly in front of a fan overnight and, voila! Whadda ya think for a first attempt?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	0617021311.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	126.8 KB
ID:	27676  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0617021313.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	143.5 KB
ID:	27677  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0617021314.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	122.5 KB
ID:	27678  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0717021138.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	143.8 KB
ID:	27679  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0717021139.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	119.2 KB
ID:	27680  

ithacaartist is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-18-2012, 10:44 PM   #2
alanint
User
 
alanint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Marco Island, Florida
Posts: 4,867
Thanks: 1,685
Thanked 1,914 Times in 1,191 Posts
Default

It came out pretty good!!
alanint is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to alanint for your post:
Unread 07-19-2012, 06:16 AM   #3
Ice
User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 552
Thanks: 13
Thanked 69 Times in 57 Posts
Default

It came out good. Another way of moulding a holster is to soak the leather and then cover the gun with Saran wrap to protect the metal. Stuff the plastic wrapped gun into the holster and use a toothbrush handle to form the contours of the leather to the pistol. Let dry and you're good to go.

Charlie
Ice is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-19-2012, 06:40 AM   #4
sheepherder
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
sheepherder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal...
Posts: 8,173
Thanks: 1,381
Thanked 4,417 Times in 2,322 Posts
Default

I did the same thing, long ago. But when I soaked it, the embossed 'US" disappeared...
__________________
I like my coffee the
way I like my women...
...Cold and bitter...
sheepherder is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-19-2012, 12:21 PM   #5
ithacaartist
Twice a Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
ithacaartist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY
Posts: 3,215
Thanks: 6,514
Thanked 2,350 Times in 1,274 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by postino View Post
I did the same thing, long ago. But when I soaked it, the embossed 'US" disappeared...
The embossing on this one is still readable, though maybe not as high now in its relief. Harder to read than when the holster face was flatter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice View Post
It came out good. Another way of moulding a holster is to soak the leather and then cover the gun with Saran wrap to protect the metal. Stuff the plastic wrapped gun into the holster and use a toothbrush handle to form the contours of the leather to the pistol. Let dry and you're good to go.

Charlie
I had heard of the saran wrap technique, which I will try for molding another holster for one of my Ermas that comes the closest to fitting it. The guy who told me about it coated his gun in vaseline before saran wrapping. But I'll still use the food saver, which did an admirable--and very fast--job pressing the leather to the gun inside. 32 psi will win the argument with wet leather every time, and this way, the time spent hanging around in wet leather is absolute minimum.


Here are more pics. First is of the back side of the holster after molding; the second is one of the actual gun installed. It slips in easily, without excessive room, and holds gently but snugly.


The rest of the pics are of a GB listing http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...=297169623#PIC for which I paid $9.95 plus a few for shipping. The guy has some remaining of the batch he is selling. Can anyone tell by the wear marks inside just what pistol it held? It is actually a bit small for a P.08 and the Erma KGPs would fit it much better after a similar adjustment.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021118.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	113.3 KB
ID:	27702  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021121.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	137.0 KB
ID:	27703  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021142.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	85.2 KB
ID:	27704  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021139.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	101.0 KB
ID:	27705  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021137.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	85.1 KB
ID:	27706  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021136.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	227.1 KB
ID:	27707  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021147.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	127.3 KB
ID:	27708  

Click image for larger version

Name:	0719021200.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	110.6 KB
ID:	27709  

ithacaartist is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-19-2012, 01:42 PM   #6
GySgt1811
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
GySgt1811's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Southern Indiana
Posts: 237
Thanks: 1,238
Thanked 126 Times in 84 Posts
Default Unintended result!

"...the time spent hanging around in wet leather is absolute minimum."

I just snorted coffee through my nose!

John D.
GySgt1811 is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to GySgt1811 for your post:
Unread 07-19-2012, 04:14 PM   #7
ithacaartist
Twice a Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
ithacaartist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY
Posts: 3,215
Thanks: 6,514
Thanked 2,350 Times in 1,274 Posts
Default

Ya, it's gonna match my Go-Go boots.
ithacaartist is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to ithacaartist for your post:
Unread 07-19-2012, 05:12 PM   #8
lugerholsterrepair
Moderator
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
lugerholsterrepair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Arizona/Colorado
Posts: 7,724
Thanks: 4,648
Thanked 3,008 Times in 1,402 Posts
Default

David, Looks great!
__________________
Jerry Burney
11491 S. Guadalupe Drive

Yuma AZ 85367-6182


lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net

928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round
719 207-3331 (cell)


"For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."
lugerholsterrepair is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to lugerholsterrepair for your post:
Unread 07-19-2012, 05:21 PM   #9
rhuff
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
rhuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Az.
Posts: 2,253
Thanks: 2,641
Thanked 940 Times in 691 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice View Post
It came out good. Another way of moulding a holster is to soak the leather and then cover the gun with Saran wrap to protect the metal. Stuff the plastic wrapped gun into the holster and use a toothbrush handle to form the contours of the leather to the pistol. Let dry and you're good to go.

Charlie


This is the method that I have used for many years to mold a new holster to a firearm.

You know, if your mold/mock handgun was chrome plated with pearl grips, you might make a buck or two on Ebay!!
rhuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-19-2012, 05:40 PM   #10
pitsword
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Southern Maine
Posts: 446
Thanks: 3,549
Thanked 95 Times in 78 Posts
Default

I have had excellent results by really soaking the leather, Vacuum seal the pistol. Insert the pistol in holster, put the holster in a zip lock bag to retain the moisture and let it set for up to a week. Exercise the holster, remove the pistol and reinsert several times, then when the holster is totally dry, it is good to go. Never had a bag leak or a mold issue.
pitsword is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-19-2012, 06:24 PM   #11
sheepherder
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
sheepherder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal...
Posts: 8,173
Thanks: 1,381
Thanked 4,417 Times in 2,322 Posts
Default

FWIW, a company by the name of "Cathey Ent" had the contract for the 45 shoulder holster (chest holster, really). They were still in business back when I was into such things; sometime in the 80's...They made holsters commercially, too...
__________________
I like my coffee the
way I like my women...
...Cold and bitter...
sheepherder is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-20-2012, 10:32 AM   #12
ithacaartist
Twice a Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
ithacaartist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY
Posts: 3,215
Thanks: 6,514
Thanked 2,350 Times in 1,274 Posts
Default

I googled Cathay Ent and learned that black holsters of this sort appeared in 1955, when the color was changed from brown. If this is true, I'm not sure it is period correct, because the 1911 is original configuration, including the narrow spline front sight. I don't know if the front sight was ever changed by the military.

Forgive me if I take Jerry's comment as a compliment!

But no one has noticed the white holster? I'm curious as to what's up with that.
ithacaartist is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-20-2012, 01:34 PM   #13
Vlim
Moderator
Lifetime
LugerForum Patron
 
Vlim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Europe
Posts: 4,964
Thanks: 1,003
Thanked 3,621 Times in 1,121 Posts
Default

The white holster has an NSN number inside, which identifies it as being German.
The color suggests military police use. 1979 date. So I would expect it was used to carry a P1.
Vlim is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-20-2012, 03:26 PM   #14
lugerholsterrepair
Moderator
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
lugerholsterrepair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Arizona/Colorado
Posts: 7,724
Thanks: 4,648
Thanked 3,008 Times in 1,402 Posts
Default

Forgive me if I take Jerry's comment as a compliment!

I knew I was being too criptic! Yes..You did a wonderful job. Used leather is much more difficult to work with than new leather because of what's been put on it over the years.

In the molds I make the food saver idea might not keep the shape I want long enough for it to dry completely. Once the pressure is released..the form could shift enough to lose control.

Luger Imperial Navy holsters for instance..they must be very precise. Tucked and rolled so to speak and made to stay that way for days..might take a week to completely dry.

Anyway, Atta Boy! Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
__________________
Jerry Burney
11491 S. Guadalupe Drive

Yuma AZ 85367-6182


lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net

928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round
719 207-3331 (cell)


"For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."
lugerholsterrepair is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to lugerholsterrepair for your post:
Unread 07-20-2012, 04:09 PM   #15
ithacaartist
Twice a Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
ithacaartist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY
Posts: 3,215
Thanks: 6,514
Thanked 2,350 Times in 1,274 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by postino View Post
I did the same thing, long ago. But when I soaked it, the embossed 'US" disappeared...
this one is still there. Its relief might be a little lower, and it is harder to read as it negotiates the new contours, but overall this one survived.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlim View Post
The white holster has an NSN number inside, which identifies it as being German.
The color suggests military police use. 1979 date. So I would expect it was used to carry a P1.
Thanks,Gerben. Not sure if you followed the GB link, but it had some different pics and the description said it was German. I have no clue about the coding the stamped numbers represent, but guessed at the '79 date. Did you catch the name, K Lingbiel, written inside the flap, close to where it is sewn on?
I've seen the equivalent, in parades, etc. here when I was a kid. (Small town parades seem pretty rare these days.) I recall it was MPs/color guard, or the like, with matching white belts and helmets. I grew up in Watertown, NY, and its proximity to Fort Drum probably ensured a limitless resource of military marching units for local parades.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair View Post
In the molds I make the food saver idea might not keep the shape I want long enough for it to dry completely. Once the pressure is released..the form could shift enough to lose control.

Luger Imperial Navy holsters for instance..they must be very precise. Tucked and rolled so to speak and made to stay that way for days..might take a week to completely dry.
I was worried about that, too, but even though I removed the holster and blank from the plastic bag after not much more than an hour, it didn't seem to have budged after drying overnight--which, now that I'm thinking more about it, drying it relatively quickly might also help it keep the new shape.
ithacaartist is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-20-2012, 04:25 PM   #16
lugerholsterrepair
Moderator
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
lugerholsterrepair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Arizona/Colorado
Posts: 7,724
Thanks: 4,648
Thanked 3,008 Times in 1,402 Posts
Default

drying it relatively quickly might also help it keep the new shape.

Dave, The quicker you dry leather the better it holds it's shape. I set my molds in the bright sun and they can dry pretty much in a few hours..But then it might take a week or more to COMPLETELY dry enough to sew it together without worrying about further shrinkage.
__________________
Jerry Burney
11491 S. Guadalupe Drive

Yuma AZ 85367-6182


lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net

928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round
719 207-3331 (cell)


"For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."
lugerholsterrepair is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-23-2012, 12:10 PM   #17
John Sabato
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
John Sabato's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: The Capital of the Free World
Posts: 10,150
Thanks: 3,003
Thanked 2,303 Times in 1,096 Posts
Default

Here is a good list from a militaria forum (source link provided):

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/foru...howtopic=17086

(My Kudo's to the originator of this post for his research)


Gentlemen:

One of my collecting sidelines is USGI holsters. Over the years I have seen a lot of misinformation circulated on the identification of the makers of the M1916 holster for the M1911 and M1911A1 pistols. This holster was the most widely produced and, in my view, the most important US military holster of the 20th Century. It was in continuous use for seven decades, a remarkable achievement. I thought it might be useful to correct that misinformation and to supply those with a interest in the subject some new information as well. Accordingly, I have prepared a comprehensive list of all known manufacturers of US Government Issue M1916 Holsters. The list is posted below.

A couple of preliminary comments are in order. By design this list does not include private purchase holster makers, makers of holster models other than the M1916, reproduction holster makers, nor does it include inspector markings or dates. This list is confined to the identification of those manufacturers known to have supplied M1916 holsters to the Government.

The list identifies in all caps each manufacturer's marking which was required by the Government holster specification to be placed on each holster. To the right of each such mark I identify, where known, the complete name of the manufacturer and its location.

I believe that this listing is complete and accurate. However, if errors or omissions are noted I would welcome input to correct any such errors or omissions. Beyond that, several makers have eluded my efforts to identify them over the course of many years. Anyone with evidence of the proper name and location of those makers is invited to contact me.

Some of this information has never been published before to my knowledge. I hope that it proves useful to those here with an interest in the M1916 holster.

Regards,
Charlie Flick

WORLD WAR I

B.BROS. (Brydon Brothers Harness & Saddle Company, Los Angeles, Calif.)
BOYT (Walter Boyt Saddlery Co., Des Moines, Iowa)
CLINTON
HOYT (F. M. Hoyt Shoe Co., Manchester, New Hampshire)
G&K (Graton & Knight Manufacturing Co., Worcester, Massachusetts)
KEYSTON (Keyston Brothers, San Francisco, Calif.)
K.B. (Keyston Bros., San Francisco, Calif.)
W.H. McM. CO. (William H. McMonies & Company, Portland, Oregon)
PERKINS CAMPBELL (Perkins-Campbell Co., Cincinnati, Ohio)
ROCK ISLAND ARSENAL (Rock Island, Illinois)
SEARS (Sears Saddlery Co., Davenport, Iowa)
S.&R.
WARREN LEATHER GOODS CO. (Warren Leather Goods Co., Worcester, Mass.)
WESTERN MFG. CO. (Western Manufacturing Co., San Francisco, Calif.)

WORLD WAR II

A.L.P. CO. (Atchison Leather Products Co., Atchison, Kansas)
BRAUER (Brauer Brothers Mfg. Co., St. Louis, Missouri)
BOYT (Boyt Harness Company, Des Moines, Iowa)
CRAIGHEAD (John R. Craighead Co., Inc., Denver, Colorado)
CRUMP (Benjamin T. Crump & Co., Richmond, Virginia)
ENGER-KRESS (Enger-Kress Company, West Bend, Wisconsin)
FINK (Fink Leather Shops, Kansas City, Missouri)
G.P.& S. (Australian manufacturer)
GRATON & KNIGHT CO. (Graton & Knight Manufacturing Co., Worcester, Mass.)
HARPHAM BROS. (Harpham Brothers Co., Lincoln, Nebraska)
MILWAUKEE SADDLERY CO. (Milwaukee Saddlery Co., Milwaukee, Wisconsin)
JOSEPH H. MOSSER (Joseph H. Mosser Co.)
S-B CO
SEARS (Sears Saddlery Co., Davenport, Iowa)
TEXTAN (Texas Tanning & Manufacturing Co., Yoakum, Texas)
WALSH (Walsh Harness Co., Milwaukee, Wisconsin)
WARREN LEATHER GOODS CO. (Warren Leather Goods Co., Worcester, Mass.)

KOREAN WAR (For US Air Force Only)

BLOOMBERG LEATHER GDS.
BOYT (Boyt Harness Company, Des Moines, Iowa)

VIET NAM WAR

BUCHEIMER (J. M. Bucheimer Co., Frederick, Maryland)
BOLEN LEATHER PRODUCTS, INC.
BOLEN LEA. PROD.
CATHEY ENTERPRISES, INC. (Cathey Enterprises, Inc., Brownwood, Texas)
HUNTER CORP. (Hunter Corporation, West Minster, Colorado)
NORDAC MFG. CO. (Nordac Manufacturing Company, Fredericksburg, Virginia)
__________________
regards, -John S

"...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL and are endowed by their Creator with certain UNALIENABLE rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."
John Sabato is offline   Reply With Quote
The following 2 members says Thank You to John Sabato for your post:
Reply

Tags
1911, holster, leather, mold

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1998 - 2023, Lugerforum.com