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unspellable · 07-19-2002, 12:22 AM

I am of the opinion that barring a few exceptions, one cartridge is as inherently accurate as another. A great deal of time, effort, and money has been expended over the years getting the best accuracy out of the 45 ACP. The 9 mm Parabellum is an orphan in this respect. What would it do if the same effort were put into it?

kidvett · 07-19-2002, 12:58 AM

AL,

I've shot with a 1950 MATCH GOLD CUP 38 wadcutter [img]eek.gif[/img] a very accurate piece!

Had about a dozen 45's over the years...ALL good shooters...nice memories of an old WWI era COLT 1911 Commercial [img]smile.gif[/img]

But I do have a 4 inch Model 29 ( long live Dirty Harry! ) that does 3/4 inch at 50 yds with 300gr Speer bullet backed by a heavy charge of 2400 ( long live Elmer Keith! )It is a favorite winter time carry piece...

And I'm still trying to get decent accuracy from 9mm pistols.....

kidvett [img]cool.gif[/img]

AGE · 07-19-2002, 10:42 AM

Kidvett and Unspellable,

The US army match shooters (and gunsmiths) seem to have achieved some success in 9mm. As I understand it, most of the service people now use 9mm at Camp Perry matches.

My Luger seems very accurate. However, my match 1911s have great sights (I use progressive eyeglass lenses like Thor to get a sharp sight picture), very light and smooth triggers, and are tighter than bank vault doors. If a Luger were set up similarly (maybe Hugh could do it), I believe it would be as good or better than the 1911 because the barrel is fixed to the sights (if the toggle is tight enough). The 1911's sights are on the slide and there is a lot of room for movement between the barrel and slide.

Anyway, I now shoot for personal fun (rather than match success) and don't plan to turn a Luger into a paper punch (only) like my match .45s. However, if Hugh is interested (the grips have already been reworked by him).......?

I also have a Ruger SA 4.75" barrel stainless .44 mag that is unbelievably accurate with full power loads. It is so-so with .44 special loads, but give it 20 grains of 2400 behind a 240 grain SWC and it is as accurate as anything I have (slow to load and a 6 round magazine though).

kidvett · 07-20-2002, 09:27 AM

Al,

Ever shot a BOWEN custom Blackhawk? I shot one, from a friend's, and MY GOD ! what a piece....

A long term project is to get a 4 5/8 in. 44 Blackhawk built by BOWEN for deer hunting....I'm presently using a 4 in. M29 & a 6 in. M629.

Shooting paper for fun, accuracy testing, hunting ang collecting LUGERS & P-38 are my primary activities in the shooting sports.....

kidvett [img]cool.gif[/img]

AGE · 07-20-2002, 04:49 PM

Kidvett,

No, I never shot a Bowen gun, but I've seen plenty of articles on them over the years.

I'm not really into hunting or heavy recoiling guns anymore (if I ever was). I have a couple of 30-06s (that I haven't shot for 20+ years) that I won't part with for sentimental reasons, but I did sell my Ruger flattop .44 magnum 20 years ago. It shot remarkably small groups at 100 yards, but I never expected to need anything more than .45 ACP again. Then, I moved to coastal Florida and I do live on the water. There are some nasty critters here that .45s might bounce off of--so I got another .44 magnum as a boat gun.

Anyway, rifles are too awkward for me today and in my experience the Ruger SA .44 Blackhawks make great industrial strength medicine for tough varmints. I have been lucky enough over the years to find two guns with light triggers and incredible accuracy. The Rugers are big and crude compared to my Colts, but great guns.

At present I am into neat guns and fun shooting--Colt 1911s, Colt SAAs, Luger(s), etc. etc. and an AR-15 .223. I can shoot these all day, nothing hurts, and it's still fun. The big stuff is available if needed.

07-19-2002, 10:42 AM	#23
AGE User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 597 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Kidvett and Unspellable, The US army match shooters (and gunsmiths) seem to have achieved some success in 9mm. As I understand it, most of the service people now use 9mm at Camp Perry matches. My Luger seems very accurate. However, my match 1911s have great sights (I use progressive eyeglass lenses like Thor to get a sharp sight picture), very light and smooth triggers, and are tighter than bank vault doors. If a Luger were set up similarly (maybe Hugh could do it), I believe it would be as good or better than the 1911 because the barrel is fixed to the sights (if the toggle is tight enough). The 1911's sights are on the slide and there is a lot of room for movement between the barrel and slide. Anyway, I now shoot for personal fun (rather than match success) and don't plan to turn a Luger into a paper punch (only) like my match .45s. However, if Hugh is interested (the grips have already been reworked by him).......? I also have a Ruger SA 4.75" barrel stainless .44 mag that is unbelievably accurate with full power loads. It is so-so with .44 special loads, but give it 20 grains of 2400 behind a 240 grain SWC and it is as accurate as anything I have (slow to load and a 6 round magazine though). __________________ Al Eggers (AGE) NRA Life Member

07-20-2002, 04:49 PM	#25
AGE User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 597 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Kidvett, No, I never shot a Bowen gun, but I've seen plenty of articles on them over the years. I'm not really into hunting or heavy recoiling guns anymore (if I ever was). I have a couple of 30-06s (that I haven't shot for 20+ years) that I won't part with for sentimental reasons, but I did sell my Ruger flattop .44 magnum 20 years ago. It shot remarkably small groups at 100 yards, but I never expected to need anything more than .45 ACP again. Then, I moved to coastal Florida and I do live on the water. There are some nasty critters here that .45s might bounce off of--so I got another .44 magnum as a boat gun. Anyway, rifles are too awkward for me today and in my experience the Ruger SA .44 Blackhawks make great industrial strength medicine for tough varmints. I have been lucky enough over the years to find two guns with light triggers and incredible accuracy. The Rugers are big and crude compared to my Colts, but great guns. At present I am into neat guns and fun shooting--Colt 1911s, Colt SAAs, Luger(s), etc. etc. and an AR-15 .223. I can shoot these all day, nothing hurts, and it's still fun. The big stuff is available if needed. __________________ Al Eggers (AGE) NRA Life Member

07-19-2002, 12:22 AM	#21
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 18 Times in 10 Posts	I am of the opinion that barring a few exceptions, one cartridge is as inherently accurate as another. A great deal of time, effort, and money has been expended over the years getting the best accuracy out of the 45 ACP. The 9 mm Parabellum is an orphan in this respect. What would it do if the same effort were put into it?

07-19-2002, 12:58 AM	#22
kidvett User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 584 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	AL, I've shot with a 1950 MATCH GOLD CUP 38 wadcutter [img]eek.gif[/img] a very accurate piece! Had about a dozen 45's over the years...ALL good shooters...nice memories of an old WWI era COLT 1911 Commercial [img]smile.gif[/img] But I do have a 4 inch Model 29 ( long live Dirty Harry! ) that does 3/4 inch at 50 yds with 300gr Speer bullet backed by a heavy charge of 2400 ( long live Elmer Keith! )It is a favorite winter time carry piece... And I'm still trying to get decent accuracy from 9mm pistols..... kidvett [img]cool.gif[/img]

07-20-2002, 09:27 AM	#24
kidvett User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 584 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Al, Ever shot a BOWEN custom Blackhawk? I shot one, from a friend's, and MY GOD ! what a piece.... A long term project is to get a 4 5/8 in. 44 Blackhawk built by BOWEN for deer hunting....I'm presently using a 4 in. M29 & a 6 in. M629. Shooting paper for fun, accuracy testing, hunting ang collecting LUGERS & P-38 are my primary activities in the shooting sports..... kidvett [img]cool.gif[/img]