1900AE Re-cut Rifling?

Dwight Gruber · 09-28-2002, 10:32 AM

Here's a question for all you gunsmith types--

The barrel in my 1900AE is a near-washout. Instead of having lands and grooves it could be more accurately described as having humps and grooves.

I've considered having it relined, but I've never come up with a satisfactory answer to the question. That, and I'm not sure it is even possible considering the thinness of the slim .30 barrel wall. Re-barrelling is not an option, as the gun is matching.

What I'm wondering is, is it possible...feasible...practical...to have the rifling re-cut, maintaining the groove depth but narrowing the lands considerably to the center of the "humps" so that there is at least a sharp edge to grab a bullet, narrow as they might be?

--Dwight

Lugerdoc · 09-29-2002, 09:47 AM

Dwight, Short of boring out barrel to 9mm or relining, which can be done, I think what you're asking, is impossible. Tom H.

policeluger · 09-29-2002, 04:56 PM

For relining try Redmond barrles/relining in Redmond Oregon. If it can be done thay are the folks

Edward Tinker · 09-29-2002, 06:22 PM

Just a question to others.

If relined, would the majority of collectors still feel it was original? I know that a new or different barrel would negate most peoples feelings that it is original, but a reline seems pretty drastic also to lots of the metal?

Dwight Gruber · 09-29-2002, 09:40 PM

Ed,

Its pretty clear to me (having been burned in that discussion in the deep past) that a reline does just as much violence to a Luger's value as any other material change short of making a gun a mismatch.

My own circumstance has to do with the fact that my 1900AE, despite being all matching, is in a condition which is only good for shooting, and I'd like to put it into a shape which would at least give me a chance to hit what I aim at. That is, without rebarreling which would make it a mismatch.

We all have to have our standards.

--Dwight

Edward Tinker · 09-29-2002, 09:53 PM

Makes sense to me Dwight! [img]smile.gif[/img]

G.T. · 10-01-2002, 05:02 PM

Hi Dwight! Just about anything can be accomplished if you have enough time, money and tools! (we will leave skill out of the equation for the time being!) I think that what you suggest could probably be done several ways.... all of them difficult, but not necessarily expensive.... all of these ideas, are what would cross my mind, if I had the only pistol left in the world, and it had no rifling....
1) make a short (Button) broach out of tool steel, using another .30 luger barrel for a reference, (So there are now two left in the world!) with the narrower lands and wider grooves... And press this through the barrel from the chamber end forward, letting the existing rifling, and the pitch on the broach, control the twist....you would most likly have to have successive sizes to make it work...only broaching a few thousands at a time! 2) mount the barrel in a fixture that has the ability to index... then using a rod into which is cut the correct helix,(a simple pin would index the helix) mount a rod that is bore diameter with a single cutter that you can drive through, remove, reindex, and drive through again. Continuing until all the lands have been cut equally! I'll bet you could do a pretty bang up job, just like they did 200+ years ago.... stability is the key.... and time...till...later...G.T. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" /> <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />

09-28-2002, 10:32 AM	#1
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	1900AE Re-cut Rifling? Here's a question for all you gunsmith types-- The barrel in my 1900AE is a near-washout. Instead of having lands and grooves it could be more accurately described as having humps and grooves. I've considered having it relined, but I've never come up with a satisfactory answer to the question. That, and I'm not sure it is even possible considering the thinness of the slim .30 barrel wall. Re-barrelling is not an option, as the gun is matching. What I'm wondering is, is it possible...feasible...practical...to have the rifling re-cut, maintaining the groove depth but narrowing the lands considerably to the center of the "humps" so that there is at least a sharp edge to grab a bullet, narrow as they might be? --Dwight

09-29-2002, 09:47 AM	#2
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Dwight, Short of boring out barrel to 9mm or relining, which can be done, I think what you're asking, is impossible. Tom H. __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

09-29-2002, 06:22 PM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,915 Thanks: 1,989 Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts	Just a question to others. If relined, would the majority of collectors still feel it was original? I know that a new or different barrel would negate most peoples feelings that it is original, but a reline seems pretty drastic also to lots of the metal? __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

09-29-2002, 09:53 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,915 Thanks: 1,989 Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts	Makes sense to me Dwight! [img]smile.gif[/img] __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

09-29-2002, 04:56 PM	#3
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	For relining try Redmond barrles/relining in Redmond Oregon. If it can be done thay are the folks

09-29-2002, 09:40 PM	#5
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	Ed, Its pretty clear to me (having been burned in that discussion in the deep past) that a reline does just as much violence to a Luger's value as any other material change short of making a gun a mismatch. My own circumstance has to do with the fact that my 1900AE, despite being all matching, is in a condition which is only good for shooting, and I'd like to put it into a shape which would at least give me a chance to hit what I aim at. That is, without rebarreling which would make it a mismatch. We all have to have our standards. --Dwight

10-01-2002, 05:02 PM	#7
G.T. Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 3,486 Thanks: 1,284 Thanked 3,583 Times in 989 Posts	Hi Dwight! Just about anything can be accomplished if you have enough time, money and tools! (we will leave skill out of the equation for the time being!) I think that what you suggest could probably be done several ways.... all of them difficult, but not necessarily expensive.... all of these ideas, are what would cross my mind, if I had the only pistol left in the world, and it had no rifling.... 1) make a short (Button) broach out of tool steel, using another .30 luger barrel for a reference, (So there are now two left in the world!) with the narrower lands and wider grooves... And press this through the barrel from the chamber end forward, letting the existing rifling, and the pitch on the broach, control the twist....you would most likly have to have successive sizes to make it work...only broaching a few thousands at a time! 2) mount the barrel in a fixture that has the ability to index... then using a rod into which is cut the correct helix,(a simple pin would index the helix) mount a rod that is bore diameter with a single cutter that you can drive through, remove, reindex, and drive through again. Continuing until all the lands have been cut equally! I'll bet you could do a pretty bang up job, just like they did 200+ years ago.... stability is the key.... and time...till...later...G.T. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" /> <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />