Beautiful Artillery Rig. . .Wish It Were Mine

Mike B · 05-30-2005, 07:10 PM

I would like to share a few pictures of a beautiful 1917 DWM artillery. I have been a member of this forum for only a short time, but I have learned much about Lugers and my Luger collection in that time. The comradery and the brotherhood that prevails in this forum is so very evident. The help, assistance and support that has been extended to me in the few short months that I have been a member has been very rewarding. Please accept my sincere thanks. This artillery rig belongs to a very good friend. He is not a collector nor a Luger enthusiast. He has no interest in Lugers. Unfortunately he does not want to sell it. He says it is a keepsake from a time long past. I asked him if I could possibly borrow if for a short time to take a few pictures of it to share it with friends and post it here on the forum; so here it is. Sorry about so many pictures, but there are so many components. One of the pictures is of the marking on the inside of the holster. Any feedback on the rig, especially the holster, will be most appreciated. I would like to inform my friend of any interesting information if possible. Thanks, Mike B.

drbuster · 05-30-2005, 08:39 PM

Dear Mike B, Your friend has a great looking 1917 DWM rig. Is he lucky enough to have one or more matching magazines?

Mike B · 05-30-2005, 09:18 PM

Hi drbuster,
Thanks for the reply and the kind words. He has only one magazine and it is not marked.
Mike

George Anderson · 05-30-2005, 09:50 PM

Mike, it is a very nice artillery Luger.

Steve71 · 05-30-2005, 11:11 PM

Mike,

Awesome rig. Don't give it back

Bring it to my house and I'll hide it for you.

Steve

Big Norm · 06-18-2005, 01:25 AM

Mike,
nice lookin artillery. The 1917 artillery had a large production so that year is prety common. But the 1917 arty was a sort of transitional year for the artillery. The transition occured in the front AND rear sights. All the 1916 artilleries had adustible front and rear sights. The 1917's MAY have either the front or rear sights adjustible or neither sight may be adjustible. None of the 1918's had adjustible sights. Maybe I shouldn't say none had adjustile sights. But they are not supposed to have adjustible sights. But it was the end of the war and things got sloppy.

The holster appears to be a nice rig. The 1917 manufacturers date could be any WW1 date without changing the value of this rig but having the holsters date match the guns date is a nice touch to a collector. A close look at all the straps condition and dye color will tell you if this a true matching holster rig or if it is a "put together". An authentic "all matching" holster rig alone could cost as much as the gun itself.

Too bad that there isnt a matching mag. Does the shoulder stocks serial number match the guns serial number? The serial number should be on the top of the attaching iron. If the guns serial number contains a small cap character, then the attaching iron should also have that small cap. Your pictures do not show the area for proof marks on the stock. They should be just below the screw holes toward the rear. The proof mark could look like the horse on a chess board and about .75 inches high.

Take the grips off and look for a two digit serial number. Be very careful about taking the grip on the safety side. The grip could break very easily up by the thumb safety. Your buddy might kill you if that grip is broken and is matching. The two digit number should be the same as the last two digits of the guns serial number. Don't be upset if there isn't a serial number but the grips should fit tight or they might be repros. Many repros used the same pattern on both the right side and the left side. But on authentic grips, the right and left sides have different lengths.

Sorry for sounding picky, but you asked for information to pass on to your friend about his gun.
Big Norm

Big Norm · 06-18-2005, 01:32 AM

Mike,
something that I just noticed. The holster has the last two digits of the guns serial number just above the manufacturers name. This should not be so because the holsters were manufacted by outside contracters and were never matched to individual guns.
Big Norm

George Anderson · 06-18-2005, 08:47 AM

Norm, I have a 1918 LP08 with a fine tune sight. I also have two P08s with matching numbered holsters. I don't think that the mark above the maker's mark on this rig has anything to do with a serial number though unless the gun has a two digit s/n.

Pete Ebbink · 06-18-2005, 11:19 AM

Hi Mike,

Your friend really has a treasure and one is he wisely keeping.

Is there a family connection at all...some one in the family that served in the Great War ?

Value of lugers have been really going up. The Folks at Simpson's have a similar 1918 rig for sale for just under $ 6K.

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=2248

Does your friend's stock (iron part) have a number that matches the gun's serial number ? That is what is meant by "matching stock".

Regards,

Pete...

Mike B · 06-19-2005, 08:28 AM

Norm & Pete,
Thanks so much for the reply and information. There is no number or proof marks on the iron part of the stock. The last two digits of the serial number are stamped on the wood part of the stock just below where the leather strap is stapled. Norm, the numbers you are referring to in the holster are not the last two numbers of the Luger. The number is "10"; no connection to anything I can see. Also, the last two is stamped on the inside of the grips. Thanks again guys. I really do appreciate the input,
Mike

Big Norm · 06-20-2005, 11:28 PM

Mike,
sorry about the mistake on the two digit number on the holster. From the pictures it looked like it was '19' (as found on the gun) and not the '10'.
My 1918 LP-08 rig has the full 4 digit serial number on the neck of the stock. on the wood. There are no proof marks either. At first, I thought that I had a fake on my hands but then I found a picture of another stock with the same serial number location and no proof marks in one of my books. So I sighed a sigh of relief and accepted the stock as original. Look at John Walters book 'The Luger Book' pg 245 and you will see a full serial number stamped on the wood in even a different location.
Big Norm

George Anderson · 06-21-2005, 07:46 AM

LP08 rigs in which the stock has been stamped in the wood are in all likelihood rigs that were made up later in the life of the pistol. Originals were stamped in the iron.

Pete Ebbink · 06-27-2005, 07:57 PM

Like this one :

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW

05-30-2005, 07:10 PM	#1
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	Beautiful Artillery Rig. . .Wish It Were Mine I would like to share a few pictures of a beautiful 1917 DWM artillery. I have been a member of this forum for only a short time, but I have learned much about Lugers and my Luger collection in that time. The comradery and the brotherhood that prevails in this forum is so very evident. The help, assistance and support that has been extended to me in the few short months that I have been a member has been very rewarding. Please accept my sincere thanks. This artillery rig belongs to a very good friend. He is not a collector nor a Luger enthusiast. He has no interest in Lugers. Unfortunately he does not want to sell it. He says it is a keepsake from a time long past. I asked him if I could possibly borrow if for a short time to take a few pictures of it to share it with friends and post it here on the forum; so here it is. Sorry about so many pictures, but there are so many components. One of the pictures is of the marking on the inside of the holster. Any feedback on the rig, especially the holster, will be most appreciated. I would like to inform my friend of any interesting information if possible. Thanks, Mike B.

05-30-2005, 11:11 PM	#5
Steve71 User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Sumner, Wa. Posts: 130 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Mike, Awesome rig. Don't give it back Bring it to my house and I'll hide it for you. Steve __________________ "Hey soldier, don't forget to pick up the Lugers. Someday, they'll be worth a lot of money".

05-30-2005, 08:39 PM	#2
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Dear Mike B, Your friend has a great looking 1917 DWM rig. Is he lucky enough to have one or more matching magazines?

05-30-2005, 09:18 PM	#3
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	Hi drbuster, Thanks for the reply and the kind words. He has only one magazine and it is not marked. Mike

05-30-2005, 09:50 PM	#4
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,772 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	Mike, it is a very nice artillery Luger.

06-18-2005, 01:25 AM	#6
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Mike, nice lookin artillery. The 1917 artillery had a large production so that year is prety common. But the 1917 arty was a sort of transitional year for the artillery. The transition occured in the front AND rear sights. All the 1916 artilleries had adustible front and rear sights. The 1917's MAY have either the front or rear sights adjustible or neither sight may be adjustible. None of the 1918's had adjustible sights. Maybe I shouldn't say none had adjustile sights. But they are not supposed to have adjustible sights. But it was the end of the war and things got sloppy. The holster appears to be a nice rig. The 1917 manufacturers date could be any WW1 date without changing the value of this rig but having the holsters date match the guns date is a nice touch to a collector. A close look at all the straps condition and dye color will tell you if this a true matching holster rig or if it is a "put together". An authentic "all matching" holster rig alone could cost as much as the gun itself. Too bad that there isnt a matching mag. Does the shoulder stocks serial number match the guns serial number? The serial number should be on the top of the attaching iron. If the guns serial number contains a small cap character, then the attaching iron should also have that small cap. Your pictures do not show the area for proof marks on the stock. They should be just below the screw holes toward the rear. The proof mark could look like the horse on a chess board and about .75 inches high. Take the grips off and look for a two digit serial number. Be very careful about taking the grip on the safety side. The grip could break very easily up by the thumb safety. Your buddy might kill you if that grip is broken and is matching. The two digit number should be the same as the last two digits of the guns serial number. Don't be upset if there isn't a serial number but the grips should fit tight or they might be repros. Many repros used the same pattern on both the right side and the left side. But on authentic grips, the right and left sides have different lengths. Sorry for sounding picky, but you asked for information to pass on to your friend about his gun. Big Norm

06-18-2005, 01:32 AM	#7
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Mike, something that I just noticed. The holster has the last two digits of the guns serial number just above the manufacturers name. This should not be so because the holsters were manufacted by outside contracters and were never matched to individual guns. Big Norm

06-18-2005, 08:47 AM	#8
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,772 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	Norm, I have a 1918 LP08 with a fine tune sight. I also have two P08s with matching numbered holsters. I don't think that the mark above the maker's mark on this rig has anything to do with a serial number though unless the gun has a two digit s/n.

06-18-2005, 11:19 AM	#9
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Mike, Your friend really has a treasure and one is he wisely keeping. Is there a family connection at all...some one in the family that served in the Great War ? Value of lugers have been really going up. The Folks at Simpson's have a similar 1918 rig for sale for just under $ 6K. http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=2248 Does your friend's stock (iron part) have a number that matches the gun's serial number ? That is what is meant by "matching stock". Regards, Pete...

06-19-2005, 08:28 AM	#10
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	Norm & Pete, Thanks so much for the reply and information. There is no number or proof marks on the iron part of the stock. The last two digits of the serial number are stamped on the wood part of the stock just below where the leather strap is stapled. Norm, the numbers you are referring to in the holster are not the last two numbers of the Luger. The number is "10"; no connection to anything I can see. Also, the last two is stamped on the inside of the grips. Thanks again guys. I really do appreciate the input, Mike

06-20-2005, 11:28 PM	#11
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Mike, sorry about the mistake on the two digit number on the holster. From the pictures it looked like it was '19' (as found on the gun) and not the '10'. My 1918 LP-08 rig has the full 4 digit serial number on the neck of the stock. on the wood. There are no proof marks either. At first, I thought that I had a fake on my hands but then I found a picture of another stock with the same serial number location and no proof marks in one of my books. So I sighed a sigh of relief and accepted the stock as original. Look at John Walters book 'The Luger Book' pg 245 and you will see a full serial number stamped on the wood in even a different location. Big Norm

06-21-2005, 07:46 AM	#12
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,772 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	LP08 rigs in which the stock has been stamped in the wood are in all likelihood rigs that were made up later in the life of the pistol. Originals were stamped in the iron.

06-27-2005, 07:57 PM	#13
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Like this one : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW