totenkopf holster - Page 2

Navy · 01-21-2004, 11:33 PM

All,

let me second Dwight's excellent suggestion. To be involved in collecting Lugers and not be a NAPCA member is patently illogical. The real gray beards in this fraternity do not understand computers and are not really interested in learning about them.

What they DO know about is Lugers.

A NAPCA membership is a wise investment and should be considered as a prerequisite to being a Luger collector.

My zwei pfennigs. Flame away.

Tom A.

John Sabato · 01-22-2004, 10:11 AM

Since your P-38 is obviously a bring back in original condition I would recommend strongly that you visit our sister forum P38forum.com and get in touch with Orv Reichert... He maintains a database of P-38 historical information and would appreciate knowing the conditions and markings details about yours...

thanks,

lugerholsterrepair · 01-22-2004, 12:08 PM

Tom, You know I respect your opinion and this is not meant to disagree with it as I am sure you are right, BUT...Automag has some inherant problems that cannot be solved by subscribing.

If I were to subscribe today, how would I access past knowledge, of which there must be plenty? There is no way to benifit from past issues.

Each publication has provision for only the poorest of photo's which are practacally useless by today's standards.

Since this is a monthly publication the opportunity for immediate dialog, questions and such is delayed to such an extent as to make such an effort annoying.

Every correspondence must be put into hard copy and mailed to Automag for publication. When I was a member this could take up to three months to finally appear.

Don't get me wrong, I think this magazine is publishing somt thoughts and opinions that should be shared with all the Luger collectors in the World but I think the print and mail method is so archaic that it is doing a poor job of accomplishing it's purpose.

When one looks at this Forum or Jan Stills it is instantly clear that Automag, as important as it is, is so behind today's methods of instant communication and clarity that it could be compared to the horse and buggy. Why would one ride a horse accross country when he could fly on a modern jetliner?

Somehow this publication and it's human resources must enter into the computer era. If valuble discourse of Lugers and their collections are being discussed and hidden away in a mimiographed print publication then shouldn't a way be found to bring it to the widest audience possible?

I know the old adage, you can't teach an old dog new tricks but wouldn't it be possible to insert the Automag into say, this Forum verbatum to expose it to everyone?

The only fly in the ointment I have observed so far concerning this discussion is the control of the content of Automag and the subscription fee.

If the content were scanned and un alterable that would solve that portion. Contents of articles could be sent to the publisher and compiled into the regular format then published here.

The only other sticking point is the subscription fee. I don't know how many subscribers there are but I would emagine there are enough that the publisher does not want to give up this source of income. The fees could actually increase if an online subscription were to be developed. I am not computer savvy enough to know how to go about this but I am sure there are those out there who could and would to see this publication leap into the future. Could happen....Jerry Burney

John Sabato · 01-22-2004, 01:00 PM

all very possible Jerry, but it is my understanding that Jan Still offered to help bring the NAPCA out of the hard copy age and the seed fell upon the rock hard ground (heads) instead of the good soil... and achieved the same results as the Biblical parable.

I predict that the NAPCA will demise when the "greybeards" that Tom spoke of have passed on unless a new generation successfully transplants the organization into the 21st century pronto.

A suggestion on how they could finance it? Easy, take ALL the past issues of Automag and transcribe them onto a CD or DVD and sell it ONLINE, with annual updates.

They could also put the content of current AUTOMAG issues online and make it a paid subscription deal. (Just like visiting Ralph Shattuck's website.) The greybeards that want it on paper could have that option if they want it, but by opening it up to the internet market I am sure they would probably double or quadruple their revenue.

Just my $0.02

Edward Tinker · 01-22-2004, 03:59 PM

I know that Jan has a verbal agreement with NAPCA (Tom) on sharing information, as John stated, I am unsure if/how it will happen, but Jan has offered to scan in issues or share infromation.

On a side note, last summer I scanned in 10 years of newsletters for the Japanese Bonzai (sp) site and it took at least 1.25 hours per issue to scan in. So, big dollars in either free time or cost to make NAPCA go from hard copy to electronic.

Ed

John Sabato · 01-22-2004, 04:29 PM

12 issues per year? times 10 years = $150 hours or a month's work...

So just how much would an E-book (containing 10 years of AUTOMAG that is copy protected and can't be shared with others) be worth to a collector who doesn't have it and who wanted the info?

$39.95 plus shipping ??

Times how many members and NON-members @$49.95 would it take to justify the work and production?

Maybe a couple of hundred... 200 would be @$4000.00 USD...

Still think I am pipe dreaming? Maybe? Maybe Not?

How about E-books (similar to G. Henrotin's latest) that contain only 1 Year of info @ $10.00 each?

The numbers are looking better and better, eh?

and maybe just clouds in my coffee...

Dwight Gruber · 01-23-2004, 02:07 AM

Jerry,

A couple of things--

Tom Knox now (and I don't know for how long previously) accepts email for AutoMag submissions, thats how I got him the text for my Witness Mark study.

In the January issue which just arrived today, Tom mentions that they are beginning to transcribe AutoMag beginning with Issue #1 to post on the Members section of the website.

--Dwight

Dwight Gruber · 10-19-2005, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dwight Gruber
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by G. van Vlimmeren:
What were the findings of the NAPCA members regarding the KL-marked lugers?<hr /></blockquote>Gerben,

From a post I made on another forum...

Jim Cate and Nico Van Gijn, in the November "Automag", published a well-researched and -considered speculation that these pistols were assembled from leftover Erfurt parts, some of them rejects, by "Werkstatt (workshop) Klett", an old gunmaking family workshop within the Simson/BSW plant.
--Dwight

Depending upon memory and one's previous posts will run one afoul of the facts every time. I discovered I have misattributed this article, it is actually the work of Jim Cate and Nico VanGijn. I have corrected it in my previous post here, and elsewhere.

My apologies to Joe Wotka and Jim Cate for the error.

--Dwight

01-22-2004, 10:11 AM	#22
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Since your P-38 is obviously a bring back in original condition I would recommend strongly that you visit our sister forum P38forum.com and get in touch with Orv Reichert... He maintains a database of P-38 historical information and would appreciate knowing the conditions and markings details about yours... thanks, __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

01-22-2004, 12:08 PM	#23
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Tom, You know I respect your opinion and this is not meant to disagree with it as I am sure you are right, BUT...Automag has some inherant problems that cannot be solved by subscribing. If I were to subscribe today, how would I access past knowledge, of which there must be plenty? There is no way to benifit from past issues. Each publication has provision for only the poorest of photo's which are practacally useless by today's standards. Since this is a monthly publication the opportunity for immediate dialog, questions and such is delayed to such an extent as to make such an effort annoying. Every correspondence must be put into hard copy and mailed to Automag for publication. When I was a member this could take up to three months to finally appear. Don't get me wrong, I think this magazine is publishing somt thoughts and opinions that should be shared with all the Luger collectors in the World but I think the print and mail method is so archaic that it is doing a poor job of accomplishing it's purpose. When one looks at this Forum or Jan Stills it is instantly clear that Automag, as important as it is, is so behind today's methods of instant communication and clarity that it could be compared to the horse and buggy. Why would one ride a horse accross country when he could fly on a modern jetliner? Somehow this publication and it's human resources must enter into the computer era. If valuble discourse of Lugers and their collections are being discussed and hidden away in a mimiographed print publication then shouldn't a way be found to bring it to the widest audience possible? I know the old adage, you can't teach an old dog new tricks but wouldn't it be possible to insert the Automag into say, this Forum verbatum to expose it to everyone? The only fly in the ointment I have observed so far concerning this discussion is the control of the content of Automag and the subscription fee. If the content were scanned and un alterable that would solve that portion. Contents of articles could be sent to the publisher and compiled into the regular format then published here. The only other sticking point is the subscription fee. I don't know how many subscribers there are but I would emagine there are enough that the publisher does not want to give up this source of income. The fees could actually increase if an online subscription were to be developed. I am not computer savvy enough to know how to go about this but I am sure there are those out there who could and would to see this publication leap into the future. Could happen....Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

01-22-2004, 01:00 PM	#24
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	all very possible Jerry, but it is my understanding that Jan Still offered to help bring the NAPCA out of the hard copy age and the seed fell upon the rock hard ground (heads) instead of the good soil... and achieved the same results as the Biblical parable. I predict that the NAPCA will demise when the "greybeards" that Tom spoke of have passed on unless a new generation successfully transplants the organization into the 21st century pronto. A suggestion on how they could finance it? Easy, take ALL the past issues of Automag and transcribe them onto a CD or DVD and sell it ONLINE, with annual updates. They could also put the content of current AUTOMAG issues online and make it a paid subscription deal. (Just like visiting Ralph Shattuck's website.) The greybeards that want it on paper could have that option if they want it, but by opening it up to the internet market I am sure they would probably double or quadruple their revenue. Just my $0.02 __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

01-22-2004, 03:59 PM	#25
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	I know that Jan has a verbal agreement with NAPCA (Tom) on sharing information, as John stated, I am unsure if/how it will happen, but Jan has offered to scan in issues or share infromation. On a side note, last summer I scanned in 10 years of newsletters for the Japanese Bonzai (sp) site and it took at least 1.25 hours per issue to scan in. So, big dollars in either free time or cost to make NAPCA go from hard copy to electronic. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

01-22-2004, 04:29 PM	#26
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	12 issues per year? times 10 years = $150 hours or a month's work... So just how much would an E-book (containing 10 years of AUTOMAG that is copy protected and can't be shared with others) be worth to a collector who doesn't have it and who wanted the info? $39.95 plus shipping ?? Times how many members and NON-members @$49.95 would it take to justify the work and production? Maybe a couple of hundred... 200 would be @$4000.00 USD... Still think I am pipe dreaming? Maybe? Maybe Not? How about E-books (similar to G. Henrotin's latest) that contain only 1 Year of info @ $10.00 each? The numbers are looking better and better, eh? and maybe just clouds in my coffee... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

01-21-2004, 11:33 PM	#21
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	All, let me second Dwight's excellent suggestion. To be involved in collecting Lugers and not be a NAPCA member is patently illogical. The real gray beards in this fraternity do not understand computers and are not really interested in learning about them. What they DO know about is Lugers. A NAPCA membership is a wise investment and should be considered as a prerequisite to being a Luger collector. My zwei pfennigs. Flame away. Tom A.

01-23-2004, 02:07 AM	#27
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,889 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,281 Times in 423 Posts	Jerry, A couple of things-- Tom Knox now (and I don't know for how long previously) accepts email for AutoMag submissions, thats how I got him the text for my Witness Mark study. In the January issue which just arrived today, Tom mentions that they are beginning to transcribe AutoMag beginning with Issue #1 to post on the Members section of the website. --Dwight