Holster Test...

[Pete Ebbink]

Real or Repro...that is the question...

http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=1424150

[lew1]

I would be inclined to say that it is a repo.

Looks like it is dated 1938, but it is WWI type construction. The belt loops should be a little angled and not at the same height. The pull up strap stitching should be a continuation of the belt loop stitching, which is not the case. The lid is attached in the wrong manner for a 1938 holster (as it is attached in the WWI style).

I have not checked to see if the WaA marking corresponds with the manuacturer.

[Pete Ebbink]

Hi Charles,

I thought so as well...the WWI style of fhe magazine pouch not being common with the back panel as the WWII hosters do...

Not sure...but didn't the "P08" stamping along the back show up a bit later...i.e. not in 1938...??? I am not sure on this point, though...

[lew1]

The P08 marking was started in 1940 I believe. 1938 would be too early. I also forgot to mention that the belt loops are too high on the body (in addition to the angle). There are so many things that did not ring true. I should have written a list before making my post.

[wlyon]

Yes the PO8 marking was mid 1940 to the end. I would call it a repro but will let our expert Jerry tell us. Bill

[Ron Wood]

It is a repro (I cheated and read the auction description).

[lugerholsterrepair]

C'mon guys..Most of you have been around the block...This thing stands out as a repro for all the reasons Lew points out and a dozen more! Pete, yer kiddin me right? Tell me you didn't for one second think this Paki hunk O cow peelins was a real German 1938 crafted holster?
Geeezeee....Jerry Burney

[Edward Tinker]

Jerry, Geeezeee, is that the sound of air escaping from your pursed lips or your hair being pulled out....

[davidkachel]

"Paki hunk O cow peelins"

ROFL

What does "Paki" mean?

[lugerholsterrepair]

Ed, These guys are just tryin to pull my leg. A trained monkey should be able to tell this thing is as phony as a politicians promise. There is a pretty good phony artillery on auction. I think Pete brought it up somewhere.

Dave, many of these things were and are made in Pakistan or India, Russia or Eastern Europe, Belurus etc. Paki is short for Pakistan.

The good stuff is drying up but there is not now nor will there ever be the same with repro junk. If they would just make it right it might be worth having. Jerry Burney

[Pete Ebbink]

Jerry,

Yep...thought the new folks might learn a thing or two...

[davidkachel]

Interesting thread. I have made a conscious decision NOT to collect original military holsters because of the prices and all the fakery. Not to mention that I don't have an endless supply of cash. My approach is simple: if it is being sold at the price of a fake, I'll consider it, otherwise no.

[lugerholsterrepair]

Pete, I suspected as much you rascal!

Dave, I started years ago to collect Luger accoutrements because pistols were rising beyond my reach. Holsters are hard to fake actually. It can be done but awfully difficult to do successfully. Mostly you don't have too...There are many newbies in the collecting field willing to pay big money for repro's that just look old. You apparently don't have to fake it, just offer it without comment. There is a place for repro made items of course but one should know the difference. Jerry Burney

[cirelaw]

Well spoken, I wouldn't buy a belt without checking with The Leather King of the Rockies,

[davidkachel]

Jerry,
I've been buying a lot of stuff on ebay lately, some holsters (hand-carved stuff mostly) and some fancy grips.
There is a trend which I am certain carries over to luger holsters and the like...
The dishonest seller labels the object as genuine knowing full well that it is not, then says he thinks it might be legitimate but doesn't know for sure because he doesn't know anything about it. If you question him, there is lots of wriggling. He won't remove the claim of originality, but he'll add aditional hedges. I'm going through this with a guy now who says he is selling "real" ivory 1911 grips. But he hedges and wriggles and qualifies, so you know that he knows damn well they aren't the real deal.
I'm completely dumbfounded by people who believe there are degrees of honesty! Give me a straight out lying, cheating, stealing, murdering sonofabitch any day. At least with him you know where you stand.

[cirelaw]

This convinces me. If its not avaible from one or out estute collectors, how could you trust someone out there in 'MEPAY.COM' land.

[Pete Ebbink]

I posted this holster up over on Jan's Gun Boards...

This one has me vascilating between real and not real...more inclined to think it is real...

http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12375

Here is the direct link to the eBay auction :

http://cgi.liveauctions.ebay.com/ws/...m=320141073891

A collector on the forums won a fantastic deal on a real Dutch holster, tools, and magazines from this same seller...so the seller may have access to a nice holster collection...

[John Sabato]

Pete, look at the stitching! Especially the poor stitching on the tool pocket...Look at the sharp leather edges! Look at the clean interior... This is not a 90 year old holster... it is a repro. This holster didn't leave the cow or the camel till just a few months ago.

[lugerholsterrepair]

Pete, I do not believe this holster is authentic. Look at the ears over the cleaning rod pouch. Double stitched on more than the first row...The pull-up strap is not attached at the upper hinge area. Hard to tell where it is attached actually. It should be attached at the hinge and under the stock block.
The stock block is put on crookedly and the ends of it are rounded. Originals are not this crooked and the ends are square. A top collector just recently sent me a very well made repro Artillery. Well done but still a repro in the end.
One other thing to notice on this one..Look where the front body cutout is made, it is way too low right above the pull-up strap. This holster just dosen't cut it. Jerry Burney

[hqbmw]

As many of you are aware, Jerry Burney and I are great friends. I once showed up at his home with a 1915 Arty holster in desperate need of his expertise. It had a back hacked out to have a belt fed through it and no stock-block. I asked my friend to do the repairs to which he replied "Do it you own damn self." Thus was born "Self-Service."

Doing it myself was something I had been nagging Jerry to teach my stubby- arthritic- riddled little paws to perform; and perform they did. Under his correct adult supervision, I was to turn the ugly duckling into a swan! Indeed, learning was the bonus to restoring.

I urge you all to at least disassemble an authentic holster carefully enough to learn what Jerry taught me in those 3 (full) days it took me to restore mine. The small nuances that have little to do with looks are the keys to really spotting fakes. Pay close attention to the actual stitching. You will find a place below the magazine pouch that EVERY holster has an end/restart of the stitching. At many places the stitches are started and double stitched for sometimes two and three stitches along. Many areas have stitches that overlap and most straight lines aren't. The stitching, however, is always charactoristicaly, the same high quality.

I can't tell here all I learned , but do take close inspections of the tiny details of the quality holsters made for Lugers and you will quickly educate yourself. You have no idea how difficult and time/labor intensive Jerry's expert and economical repair is. Ask me and my aching-painful paws how I actually did my own work!! I now have a holster with every stitch replaced by me and with a complete new back and not one person to whom I have shown could identify the repair I did to it. Thanks to Jerry (and Ellie) who put up with me.