1918/1920 Double Date w/ Simson proofs

Thor · 01-28-2003, 08:04 PM

This is an 1918/1920 Erfurt Military Luger coverted to a Prussion Police Luger (I GUESS)
6XXX "i" with Simson Eagle over 33 on barrel top at left side, with Simson Eagle over 66 on top of front sight block. Unit Marking is "S.Kg.1113."
Looks like Schutzpolizei Konigsberg. No sear or mag safety. Konigsberg appears to be about 25 miles SE of Munich (Munchen). Interesting Luger.

JohnF · 01-30-2003, 01:28 PM

Hi Thor,
This could be even more interesting as I suspect that the Konigsberg that it refers to is actually the one that was in what was then East Prussia. This is now called Kaliningrad and is sovereign Russian territory. Here's a map from my 1895 school atlas showing the old Germany (not that I was at school in 1895!!). Konigsberg is marked with an arrow in the top right.
http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/Pre1918Germany.JPG

Thor · 01-30-2003, 02:44 PM

I found it John, it is close to the Polish town of Gdanzk on the Baltic sea coast where Russia and Poland come together. Thanks for the History lesson! I sure needed it bad!

More History of this City-Click Here

JohnF · 01-30-2003, 06:17 PM

Never saw myself as a teacher Thor :-)
Having a Konigsberg marking might just increase the value of that pistol - it would certainly make me want to have it. This is a real piece of history; a Luger marked to the Police in a city that hasn't existed in any recognisable form since 1945.
As I recall, Kaliningrad was a closed city to foreigners for a long time as it became a big Soviet Naval base. It's probably open now.
Any chance of a photo or two of the Luger?

Thor · 01-30-2003, 06:34 PM

I will have photos as time permits (I am VERY CRAZY BUSY right now)

Bernard · 01-31-2003, 09:38 AM

Thor, crazy busy is good, given the alternative of no busy!

Right after WWII, the Russians evicted the ethnic Germans and forcibly relocated Russians (from Georgia and the Ukraine, I believe) to Konigsberg.

Konigsberg is now open to everyone and gets a lot of tourists. The Russians are not happy living there, they want to go to their ancestral homes, and some Germans would just as soon move back to Konigsberg. It will be interesting. National Geographic had a nice article a few years ago.

Thor · 02-02-2003, 02:56 PM

Here are a couple of pics of the Konigsberg Police Luger. The Unit marking on the front grip strap and the Barrel Eagle and Coat of Arms for Konigsberg.
<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/Konigsberg1BIG.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/Konigsberg1BIG.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB4.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB4.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB7.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB7.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA2.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA2.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>
<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA3.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA3.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a>

Thor · 02-18-2003, 06:20 PM

Ready to ship this beauty!! Notice it has no sear safety but it is grip strap marked to a Police District.

CLICK HERE for Larger Image

Edward Tinker · 02-18-2003, 09:38 PM

Very nice Thor! A++

Thor · 06-12-2004, 10:29 AM

This was a very interesting Luger that came through my shop early last year. It was made for WWI by Erfurt, then later rebarreled by SIMSON, then put into Police Service in Konigsberg Prussia, but never had a police sear safety added so I assume it was taken out of service before the safety would have been added. It had a very interesting history and was bought from a prominent Luger dealer for a shooter price. The gun was all matched and a real piece of history.
Thought it beared looking at again for those that missed it.

01-28-2003, 08:04 PM	#1
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	1918/1920 Double Date w/ Simson proofs This is an 1918/1920 Erfurt Military Luger coverted to a Prussion Police Luger (I GUESS) 6XXX "i" with Simson Eagle over 33 on barrel top at left side, with Simson Eagle over 66 on top of front sight block. Unit Marking is "S.Kg.1113." Looks like Schutzpolizei Konigsberg. No sear or mag safety. Konigsberg appears to be about 25 miles SE of Munich (Munchen). Interesting Luger. __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

01-30-2003, 02:44 PM	#3
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	I found it John, it is close to the Polish town of Gdanzk on the Baltic sea coast where Russia and Poland come together. Thanks for the History lesson! I sure needed it bad! More History of this City-Click Here __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

01-30-2003, 06:34 PM	#5
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	I will have photos as time permits (I am VERY CRAZY BUSY right now) __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

02-02-2003, 02:56 PM	#7
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Here are a couple of pics of the Konigsberg Police Luger. The Unit marking on the front grip strap and the Barrel Eagle and Coat of Arms for Konigsberg. <a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/Konigsberg1BIG.jpg" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/Konigsberg1BIG.jpg" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB4.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB4.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB7.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/DDPoliceB7.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA2.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA2.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> <a href="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA3.JPG" target="_fullview"><img src="http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/RJDDPoliceA3.JPG" width="400" alt="Click for fullsize image" /></a> __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

02-18-2003, 06:20 PM	#8
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Ready to ship this beauty!! Notice it has no sear safety but it is grip strap marked to a Police District. CLICK HERE for Larger Image __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

01-30-2003, 01:28 PM	#2
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Hi Thor, This could be even more interesting as I suspect that the Konigsberg that it refers to is actually the one that was in what was then East Prussia. This is now called Kaliningrad and is sovereign Russian territory. Here's a map from my 1895 school atlas showing the old Germany (not that I was at school in 1895!!). Konigsberg is marked with an arrow in the top right. http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/Pre1918Germany.JPG

01-30-2003, 06:17 PM	#4
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Never saw myself as a teacher Thor :-) Having a Konigsberg marking might just increase the value of that pistol - it would certainly make me want to have it. This is a real piece of history; a Luger marked to the Police in a city that hasn't existed in any recognisable form since 1945. As I recall, Kaliningrad was a closed city to foreigners for a long time as it became a big Soviet Naval base. It's probably open now. Any chance of a photo or two of the Luger?

01-31-2003, 09:38 AM	#6
Bernard User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Diego Posts: 35 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thor, crazy busy is good, given the alternative of no busy! Right after WWII, the Russians evicted the ethnic Germans and forcibly relocated Russians (from Georgia and the Ukraine, I believe) to Konigsberg. Konigsberg is now open to everyone and gets a lot of tourists. The Russians are not happy living there, they want to go to their ancestral homes, and some Germans would just as soon move back to Konigsberg. It will be interesting. National Geographic had a nice article a few years ago.

02-18-2003, 09:38 PM	#9
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,987 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	Very nice Thor! A++ __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

06-12-2004, 10:29 AM	#10
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	This was a very interesting Luger that came through my shop early last year. It was made for WWI by Erfurt, then later rebarreled by SIMSON, then put into Police Service in Konigsberg Prussia, but never had a police sear safety added so I assume it was taken out of service before the safety would have been added. It had a very interesting history and was bought from a prominent Luger dealer for a shooter price. The gun was all matched and a real piece of history. Thought it beared looking at again for those that missed it. __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."