LP-08 Cl rod Opinions, Comments?

lugerholsterrepair · 02-08-2004, 12:32 PM

Guys, Anyone have an opinion about these two cleaning rods? Mauro? What do you say...George Anderson? What do you think? Jerry Burney

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...&category=4078

the gunman · 02-08-2004, 01:56 PM

Hi I have never seen that proof on a WWI rod nor the
flat type tip .My 2 cents

George Anderson · 02-08-2004, 03:02 PM

Jerry, I aint never heard of such a thing. Given the rarity of LP08's in Nazi service, I can't imagine that cleaning rods were produced. Also I think they had pretty much switched over to the cleaning kit with chain. Such set-ups were used, not only for PP's PPK's but also K98's.

Could it be intended for use with a flare gun? Maybe it's just another fake.geo

mauro · 02-08-2004, 06:32 PM

Tom,
this is the first time I meet this kind of cleaning rod. Only a few of LP08 were used during WWII so it is very difficult to have a clear understanding on it. I consider this item as a curiosity.
My tip is donÃ¢??t spend a lot of money.
Ciao
Mauro

lugerholsterrepair · 02-08-2004, 07:05 PM

George, Mauro, gunman, I appreciate your expertise. I too have never seen anything like it but I wanted the opinion of people who study this subject on a daily basis. They look old but I cannot see them well enough to determine much about them such as if they have the grooves in the barrels. Jerry Burney

nnoonan · 02-09-2004, 03:49 PM

sirs
i am selling the rods on ebay i can garentee that they and their markings are genuine .i belive they are luger but i accept the longer on could have another aplication .i have sold and sent tom one perhaps he can give an oppinion when he recieves it. they came from the estate of a shooter who had been using them and the seller did not put a value on them becauce of the markings .

mauro · 02-09-2004, 04:46 PM

Hello nnoonan,
welcome to the Luger Site.
Your cleaning rod is very unusual. For this reason it is difficult to associate a value or a cost. It doesnÃ¢??t mean that it is faked.
Ciao
Mauro
http://lugerlp08.free.fr/

Pete Ebbink · 02-09-2004, 05:02 PM

Nick also has a shorter version on e-Bay as well...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=2224102943

Hello Nick...

And welcome to the Luger Forum. Would it be possible for you to post more close -up photos of one of these rods, both the barrel end and the cleaning swatch end...? if folks had more clear photos, they might be able to make a better assessment...

If you cannot master the photo-posting procedure on this Forum, you are welcomed to email them to me and I will post them for you. Jpeg size does not matter, as I have a high speed Internet connection...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Pete Ebbink · 02-10-2004, 11:14 AM

Here are some photos Nick sent to me for posting.

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Lugerdoc · 02-10-2004, 12:24 PM

The slot in the top rivet and the cleaning patch hole at the tip don't ring true to any German production, or even repros that I've seen previously. I seriously doubt that the Reich would have gear up to produce rod for a 6" barrelled luger during WW2. Perhaps these were commerically made revolver rods or made by some other nation, that were pressed into service. TH

nnoonan · 02-10-2004, 05:58 PM

i have the rods in front of me they are original. when tom gets his hopefully he can comfirm this .perhaps they were commerdially made but as i had 3 ,one for 4" with a threaded end and the two i am offering on ebay ,all with identical wooden ends i think they came out of an armourers kit .the waffenampts are proper the smaller sloted one has no stamp .if they were repro with fake marks why only stamp 2 one twice then sell them for pennies?. they came out of an estate sale in a large box of rods and cleaning equipment
they were not valued for the marks and sold as cleaning rods not collectors items

lugerholsterrepair · 02-10-2004, 11:37 PM

nnoonan, No one here is trying to knock your offering on eBay. We are studying the problem and as such, it is open to all sorts of discussion. Some will be one way, some another. Please do not be put off by the discussion. In this Forum, it is the way we try to determine origin, authenticity and provenance. I am happy you choose to participate as it is very usefull to help us all learn something.These artifacts are quite interesting and to date, not seen by many of the knowledgeable people here. This does not make them wrong, just out of the ordinary. Thanks, Jerry Burney

Navy · 02-11-2004, 10:06 AM

All,

Received the rod yesterday. Here is what I sent mnoonan about it..

The rod is a type unknown to me; it is most certainly not a Luger rod. Additionally, the markings are not waffenampt stamps, but appear to be crude copies of the eagle and swastika proof marks seen on mid war P-38s. Who marked it and why it was done are anyone's guess.

Additional to the comment above, I should point out that the rod end is threaded like it was supposed to fit into an attachment of some sort. It is not tapered to accomodate the threads, however. The handle is made of a dense dark brown/blackish wood of unknown origin and the shaft appears to have been blued at one point. The spurious stamps are located on the b arrel end and also across the handle long axis abeam the rod shaft. The stamp appears to have been damaged as the right wing of the eagle is not visible.

Odd piece indeed.
Oh, I bought the 6" holster she was selling...a magnificent and completely genuine Type 3 (A Type 1 manufactured to be mounted with a shoulder strap instead of with the block for stock attachment...my designation).

It is exactly like the "watchman's", "E-boat" "U-Boat" 4" version discussed earlier but in 6" length. Have never seen one before but this baby is completely legit.

Tom A.

lugerholsterrepair · 02-11-2004, 03:25 PM

Tom, good report! Thanks and congratulations on your type 3...Jerry Burney

Navy · 02-11-2004, 07:52 PM

Jerry,

It will be coming to you shortly for a bit of "refreshment"; I think you will get a kick out of handling such an unusual piece.

Tom A.

lugerholsterrepair · 02-12-2004, 12:17 AM

Tom, As usual I enjoy whatever you send me for my workbench. I will be happy to own it for a few days! Thanks very much, Jerry

02-08-2004, 12:32 PM	#1
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	LP-08 Cl rod Opinions, Comments? Guys, Anyone have an opinion about these two cleaning rods? Mauro? What do you say...George Anderson? What do you think? Jerry Burney http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...&category=4078 __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

02-08-2004, 06:32 PM	#4
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Tom, this is the first time I meet this kind of cleaning rod. Only a few of LP08 were used during WWII so it is very difficult to have a clear understanding on it. I consider this item as a curiosity. My tip is donÃ¢??t spend a lot of money. Ciao Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

02-08-2004, 07:05 PM	#5
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	George, Mauro, gunman, I appreciate your expertise. I too have never seen anything like it but I wanted the opinion of people who study this subject on a daily basis. They look old but I cannot see them well enough to determine much about them such as if they have the grooves in the barrels. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

02-09-2004, 04:46 PM	#7
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hello nnoonan, welcome to the Luger Site. Your cleaning rod is very unusual. For this reason it is difficult to associate a value or a cost. It doesnÃ¢??t mean that it is faked. Ciao Mauro http://lugerlp08.free.fr/ __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

02-10-2004, 12:24 PM	#10
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	The slot in the top rivet and the cleaning patch hole at the tip don't ring true to any German production, or even repros that I've seen previously. I seriously doubt that the Reich would have gear up to produce rod for a 6" barrelled luger during WW2. Perhaps these were commerically made revolver rods or made by some other nation, that were pressed into service. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

02-08-2004, 01:56 PM	#2
the gunman User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Leland NC 28451 Posts: 1,017 Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	Hi I have never seen that proof on a WWI rod nor the flat type tip .My 2 cents

02-08-2004, 03:02 PM	#3
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,771 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	Jerry, I aint never heard of such a thing. Given the rarity of LP08's in Nazi service, I can't imagine that cleaning rods were produced. Also I think they had pretty much switched over to the cleaning kit with chain. Such set-ups were used, not only for PP's PPK's but also K98's. Could it be intended for use with a flare gun? Maybe it's just another fake.geo

02-09-2004, 03:49 PM	#6
nnoonan User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: london Posts: 60 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	sirs i am selling the rods on ebay i can garentee that they and their markings are genuine .i belive they are luger but i accept the longer on could have another aplication .i have sold and sent tom one perhaps he can give an oppinion when he recieves it. they came from the estate of a shooter who had been using them and the seller did not put a value on them becauce of the markings .

02-09-2004, 05:02 PM	#8
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Nick also has a shorter version on e-Bay as well... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=2224102943 Hello Nick... And welcome to the Luger Forum. Would it be possible for you to post more close -up photos of one of these rods, both the barrel end and the cleaning swatch end...? if folks had more clear photos, they might be able to make a better assessment... If you cannot master the photo-posting procedure on this Forum, you are welcomed to email them to me and I will post them for you. Jpeg size does not matter, as I have a high speed Internet connection... Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

02-10-2004, 11:14 AM	#9
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Here are some photos Nick sent to me for posting. Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

02-10-2004, 05:58 PM	#11
nnoonan User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: london Posts: 60 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	i have the rods in front of me they are original. when tom gets his hopefully he can comfirm this .perhaps they were commerdially made but as i had 3 ,one for 4" with a threaded end and the two i am offering on ebay ,all with identical wooden ends i think they came out of an armourers kit .the waffenampts are proper the smaller sloted one has no stamp .if they were repro with fake marks why only stamp 2 one twice then sell them for pennies?. they came out of an estate sale in a large box of rods and cleaning equipment they were not valued for the marks and sold as cleaning rods not collectors items

02-10-2004, 11:37 PM	#12
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	nnoonan, No one here is trying to knock your offering on eBay. We are studying the problem and as such, it is open to all sorts of discussion. Some will be one way, some another. Please do not be put off by the discussion. In this Forum, it is the way we try to determine origin, authenticity and provenance. I am happy you choose to participate as it is very usefull to help us all learn something.These artifacts are quite interesting and to date, not seen by many of the knowledgeable people here. This does not make them wrong, just out of the ordinary. Thanks, Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

02-11-2004, 10:06 AM	#13
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	All, Received the rod yesterday. Here is what I sent mnoonan about it.. The rod is a type unknown to me; it is most certainly not a Luger rod. Additionally, the markings are not waffenampt stamps, but appear to be crude copies of the eagle and swastika proof marks seen on mid war P-38s. Who marked it and why it was done are anyone's guess. Additional to the comment above, I should point out that the rod end is threaded like it was supposed to fit into an attachment of some sort. It is not tapered to accomodate the threads, however. The handle is made of a dense dark brown/blackish wood of unknown origin and the shaft appears to have been blued at one point. The spurious stamps are located on the b arrel end and also across the handle long axis abeam the rod shaft. The stamp appears to have been damaged as the right wing of the eagle is not visible. Odd piece indeed. Oh, I bought the 6" holster she was selling...a magnificent and completely genuine Type 3 (A Type 1 manufactured to be mounted with a shoulder strap instead of with the block for stock attachment...my designation). It is exactly like the "watchman's", "E-boat" "U-Boat" 4" version discussed earlier but in 6" length. Have never seen one before but this baby is completely legit. Tom A.

02-11-2004, 03:25 PM	#14
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	Tom, good report! Thanks and congratulations on your type 3...Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

02-11-2004, 07:52 PM	#15
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Jerry, It will be coming to you shortly for a bit of "refreshment"; I think you will get a kick out of handling such an unusual piece. Tom A.

02-12-2004, 12:17 AM	#16
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	Tom, As usual I enjoy whatever you send me for my workbench. I will be happy to own it for a few days! Thanks very much, Jerry __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."