Shooter vs collector

Kwalityguy · 04-06-2017, 11:05 PM

I just bought my first 1936 Luger for $1600 (actually $2000 including a 1937 K98). The Luger is all matching except the mag. Looks very clean. Grips show no signs of wear. No dents, dings, nothing. The previous owner had it for the last 20 years and claims to have never fired it.

How do I know if this is a shooter or collector? I don't like safe queens but don't want to be stupid either.

wayne8661 · 04-06-2017, 11:11 PM

Pictures would be helpful with your query!

mrerick · 04-07-2017, 09:55 AM

Start with our FAQ.

Collectible Lugers are as close to original factory state as possible.

Mixed parts, refinishing, import marking all might reduce value and also relegate it to a shooter.

Things are a bit more flexible with more rare variations, but the ideal is still as close to factory state as possible.

Edward Tinker · 04-07-2017, 10:27 AM

you paid $1600 - that is a lot of money to some folks - shooter is usually $700-$900 - so you paid approximately twice what a shooter costs

you are the only one who knows if you overspent or bought a collectible and plan on shooting it. Damaging one numbered part degrades the collectability very much - major part like the breechblock and you're talking 40-50% hit...

DavidJayUden · 04-07-2017, 10:29 AM

A tough question. IMHO a collector or a shooter is a very relative term, based on variables such as geographical location, personal finances, availability of Lugers, laws governing the ownership of handguns, etc, etc, etc.
Some persons on this forum define a collector in very narrow terms, everything else being a shooter. Others, less sophisticated, less demanding, less well financed, or shooters by nature might consider a collector grade gun much more broadly, such as having original finish, matching except mag, etc.
So, again IMHO, there is no answer to your question other than what do YOU think is collectible.
dju

DonVoigt · 04-07-2017, 12:56 PM

I'm Both, and proud of each one- they are all different for sure- even if it is just the serial number or suffix!

Kwalityguy · 04-08-2017, 07:37 AM

Pic

Kwalityguy · 04-08-2017, 07:38 AM

Other side

Vlim · 04-08-2017, 07:53 AM

Hi, it's a nice restoration, reblued and buffed slightly before the reblueing. So that would place it in the 'shooter grade' category and you have paid a high price for it.

That said: Collections and the nature and basis of collections very: Some collect quality items which are all correct, others, like myself, collect representative examples for research purposes. So I will pick up guns that will not be considered 'true collecting material' at times, because the guns have properties that attract my attention in one way or another. Sometimes, guns in original condition are impossible to find and/or too expensive to be within reach, and one can settle for a less perfect, but still representative example for research/analysis/testing purposes.

To complicate matters further, there are R&D pistols that have been R&D'd considerably and then some. These guns, coming from gun company departments are absolutely collectable, but usually look like a train drove over them a few times. It goes with the territory, and I will never pass up on an original company R&D gun in any condition.

Anyway, it's not a black and white situation, there are numerous shades of grey in between.

SteveM · 04-08-2017, 08:13 AM

If that is the 1936 I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it appears to be a refinish. Telltale signs, it should be rust blued and some of the sharp edges are not sharp anymore. The proof marks look to be washed out as well. Nice shooter though, I wouldn't kick it out of the safe.

kurusu · 04-08-2017, 12:49 PM

That gun is definitely in the "shooter" category.

rhuff · 04-08-2017, 02:54 PM

That Luger is a shooter category gun, but a very handsome shooter!!! I would be proud to own and enjoy it.

cirelaw · 04-08-2017, 03:45 PM

Don't worry my three wives weren't virgins either!

Puretexan · 06-01-2017, 02:02 PM

Come to think of it Cirelaw neither of my three were either.
I do still love my reblued Luger just as much.

Sky Zero · 06-01-2017, 03:58 PM

It has been refinished so it's definitely in the shooter category, as the other users here have stated. Shoot it shoot it shoot it!

stg44fan · 06-01-2017, 04:22 PM

Looks good! Shoot it!

Ron Wood · 06-01-2017, 05:59 PM

You paid a bit of a stiff price, but you got a darned fine looking shooter that will be the envy of the range. Enjoy the bejeebers out of it!
Ron

Sergio Natali · 06-02-2017, 02:20 PM

You've got a nice Luger to learn from, so now go to the range and crank it out!

4 Scale · 06-02-2017, 02:54 PM

That is a nice shooter. Some people buy all matching but rough finish guns with intent to restore. So with that in mind, I think it could be argued that the price paid for this one was not unreasonable given its finish.

I have to admit that I find the question of shooter cost tricky, especially if matching with better cosmetics like the pistol in this thread. I would like another Mauser shooter, '37 military or later, 'nice' cosmetics, and have a target max price of $1,100 or so. If my time is worth minimum wage, and if "time is money", I would be better off paying a dealer $1,500 -$2,000 for a collectible, swapping some parts and shooting it. While I enjoy the hunt, I sometimes wonder if shooter searching is rational.

DonVoigt · 06-02-2017, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4 Scale

That is a nice shooter. Some people buy all matching but rough finish guns with intent to restore. So with that in mind, I think it could be argued that the price paid for this one was not unreasonable given its finish.

I have to admit that I find the question shooter cost tricky, especially if matching with better cosmetics like the pistol in this thread. I would like another Mauser shooter, '37 military or later, 'nice' cosmetics, and have a target max price of $1,100 or so. If my time is worth minimum wage, and if "time is money", I would be better off paying a dealer $1,500 -$2,000 for a collectible, swapping some parts and shooting it. While I enjoy the hunt, I sometimes wonder if shooter searching is rational.

No it is not really "rational", but then neither is building one and selling it.

One can always "hope" a deal will fall into your range box.

04-06-2017, 11:05 PM	#1
Kwalityguy New User Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Shooter vs collector I just bought my first 1936 Luger for $1600 (actually $2000 including a 1937 K98). The Luger is all matching except the mag. Looks very clean. Grips show no signs of wear. No dents, dings, nothing. The previous owner had it for the last 20 years and claims to have never fired it. How do I know if this is a shooter or collector? I don't like safe queens but don't want to be stupid either. __________________ Die Gedanken sind frei. So far.

04-07-2017, 09:55 AM	#3
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,900 Thanks: 1,370 Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts	Start with our FAQ. Collectible Lugers are as close to original factory state as possible. Mixed parts, refinishing, import marking all might reduce value and also relegate it to a shooter. Things are a bit more flexible with more rare variations, but the ideal is still as close to factory state as possible. __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

04-07-2017, 10:27 AM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	you paid $1600 - that is a lot of money to some folks - shooter is usually $700-$900 - so you paid approximately twice what a shooter costs you are the only one who knows if you overspent or bought a collectible and plan on shooting it. Damaging one numbered part degrades the collectability very much - major part like the breechblock and you're talking 40-50% hit... __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

04-07-2017, 12:56 PM	#6
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,677 Thanks: 1,439 Thanked 4,347 Times in 2,038 Posts	I'm Both, and proud of each one- they are all different for sure- even if it is just the serial number or suffix! __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

04-08-2017, 07:37 AM	#7
Kwalityguy New User Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Pic Attached Thumbnails __________________ Die Gedanken sind frei. So far.

04-06-2017, 11:11 PM	#2
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Pictures would be helpful with your query!

04-07-2017, 10:29 AM	#5
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	A tough question. IMHO a collector or a shooter is a very relative term, based on variables such as geographical location, personal finances, availability of Lugers, laws governing the ownership of handguns, etc, etc, etc. Some persons on this forum define a collector in very narrow terms, everything else being a shooter. Others, less sophisticated, less demanding, less well financed, or shooters by nature might consider a collector grade gun much more broadly, such as having original finish, matching except mag, etc. So, again IMHO, there is no answer to your question other than what do YOU think is collectible. dju

04-08-2017, 07:38 AM	#8
Kwalityguy New User Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Other side Attached Thumbnails __________________ Die Gedanken sind frei. So far.

04-08-2017, 07:53 AM	#9
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	Hi, it's a nice restoration, reblued and buffed slightly before the reblueing. So that would place it in the 'shooter grade' category and you have paid a high price for it. That said: Collections and the nature and basis of collections very: Some collect quality items which are all correct, others, like myself, collect representative examples for research purposes. So I will pick up guns that will not be considered 'true collecting material' at times, because the guns have properties that attract my attention in one way or another. Sometimes, guns in original condition are impossible to find and/or too expensive to be within reach, and one can settle for a less perfect, but still representative example for research/analysis/testing purposes. To complicate matters further, there are R&D pistols that have been R&D'd considerably and then some. These guns, coming from gun company departments are absolutely collectable, but usually look like a train drove over them a few times. It goes with the territory, and I will never pass up on an original company R&D gun in any condition. Anyway, it's not a black and white situation, there are numerous shades of grey in between.

04-08-2017, 08:13 AM	#10
SteveM User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,016 Thanks: 94 Thanked 275 Times in 137 Posts	If that is the 1936 I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it appears to be a refinish. Telltale signs, it should be rust blued and some of the sharp edges are not sharp anymore. The proof marks look to be washed out as well. Nice shooter though, I wouldn't kick it out of the safe.

04-08-2017, 12:49 PM	#11
kurusu User Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,225 Thanks: 2,679 Thanked 929 Times in 509 Posts	That gun is definitely in the "shooter" category.

04-08-2017, 02:54 PM	#12
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,270 Thanks: 2,686 Thanked 958 Times in 704 Posts	That Luger is a shooter category gun, but a very handsome shooter!!! I would be proud to own and enjoy it.

04-08-2017, 03:45 PM	#13
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Don't worry my three wives weren't virgins either!

06-01-2017, 02:02 PM	#14
Puretexan User Join Date: May 2017 Location: Pearland Texas Posts: 176 Thanks: 11 Thanked 70 Times in 36 Posts	Come to think of it Cirelaw neither of my three were either. I do still love my reblued Luger just as much.

06-01-2017, 03:58 PM	#15
Sky Zero User Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Michigan Posts: 308 Thanks: 134 Thanked 43 Times in 30 Posts	It has been refinished so it's definitely in the shooter category, as the other users here have stated. Shoot it shoot it shoot it!

06-01-2017, 04:22 PM	#16
stg44fan User Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Portland OR Posts: 81 Thanks: 42 Thanked 49 Times in 27 Posts	Looks good! Shoot it!

06-01-2017, 05:59 PM	#17
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	You paid a bit of a stiff price, but you got a darned fine looking shooter that will be the envy of the range. Enjoy the bejeebers out of it! Ron __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-02-2017, 02:20 PM	#18
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,082 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	You've got a nice Luger to learn from, so now go to the range and crank it out! __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list.

06-02-2017, 02:54 PM	#19
4 Scale User Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 544 Thanks: 194 Thanked 489 Times in 251 Posts	That is a nice shooter. Some people buy all matching but rough finish guns with intent to restore. So with that in mind, I think it could be argued that the price paid for this one was not unreasonable given its finish. I have to admit that I find the question of shooter cost tricky, especially if matching with better cosmetics like the pistol in this thread. I would like another Mauser shooter, '37 military or later, 'nice' cosmetics, and have a target max price of $1,100 or so. If my time is worth minimum wage, and if "time is money", I would be better off paying a dealer $1,500 -$2,000 for a collectible, swapping some parts and shooting it. While I enjoy the hunt, I sometimes wonder if shooter searching is rational. Last edited by 4 Scale; 06-02-2017 at 10:42 PM.