HOW MUCH WILL AN iMPORT AFFECT A lUGES' VALUE

[cirelaw]

My Good Friend, and resident Biker and Vietnam Vet, bought a beautiful 1939, s/42 serial number, '112 the suffix resembles an 'a', I was taking beautiful closeup that I would, with your help publish. Then there in pretty minute letters, hidden under the running bar, that dreaded few words, 'COL____ST _____VILLE, KY' He never noticed it, and is now looking at an otherwise, amost beautiful piece, thinking she a virgin, now not knowing what its value should be. I would like your advice, what, if any do it detract from the lugers' value? Which brings to the question, is a seller obligated to point out an Import Marking, I know the answer legally, but morally may be another case. Back to my question, what persent, if any should the piece be discounted. Im sure a few of you are pulling out your gems, I welcome your opinions, Eric, JD

[drjon4u2]

The way to look at it is...given two pistols side by side in equal condition one is 2 grand and is as issued and the other is 1800 with an import stamp, which one would you buy? And if the import was 1600 would that sway you. Would 1500, or less? Personally, I would avoid them as they are harder to sell than non-marked ones, but then I collect with some sense of buying items that I think will go up in value and be easier to sell.

There is one seller that has a lot of a VT company imports and I have not seen any of them sell. It is a matter of how we appreciate the difference and it seems that we tend to prefer the unmarked ones.


Brit. stamps are more like proof house stamps than "import stamps" as are the Belgium stamps I've seen, for these are proof tested weapons to make sure theyw ere safe for use in that country. But to answer your question.... the post 68 importation US laws made importers place their names on weapons and in some cases the stamping are very very deep and large, in others light and shallow. I've read that some deep ones weaken the weapons and remember bad stories about Blue Sky that imported a lot of arms from Korea

In all of my collecting I purchased one Canadian marked US Reminton M1917 Enfield. I use it as a shooter although the only two items it has to identify it are a very small circle C and its serial number on its bolt and it was 1/2 the cost of a pure US M1917 and it had all of its original WWI blue and a very nice stock.

I asked this same question some time ago and no one replied, but after watching sales the above is the best answer I can come up with for you.

Jon

[cirelaw]

The way I look at is, is if I like the gun for all is qualities, Its further proof that its legit and lend to its History, Its just another stamp in my guns passport of owner ship, My friend owned it for some time and never notice, Your a gentleman, and a scholar.

[cirelaw]

Jon, I welcome you abourd,I love a gentleman with intelligece and objectivity,

[Edward Tinker]

Well, this is the reason you have to look close at every gun before you buy. Although I too think it is a part of the guns history, the fact is, count on it devaluing your pistol by 25-50% or even more. Much depends on the type of import stamp; i.e. older "germany" export/import stamp, affects much less and is expected. British import stamp, less than a 1980's / 1990's import stamp in my view of luger values...


Ed

[cirelaw]

Its a perfect Moot Court scenario, In most all jurisdiction, a seller has a duty to disclose those unknown defects or latent difects, but not patent or visable to a resonable buyer, The litigation occurs when there is disagreement whether an import mark is a defect at all, .thou not in this case, especially where there is an agreed upon, inspection period, If the buyer insists they want it then, there, write up a sales contract, even on a cocktail napkin, writing out the terms and whether your selling as is, Any defects that you alone are aware must be delinated, No lawyer, just common sence, I would advise my client and friends to pick up a simple purchase agreement at staples or a legal form site, REMEMBER AS IS, BOTH PATENT OR LATENT DEFECTS OR WEAR.

[Ron Smith]

Originally posted by tacfoley
We acquired many of our .50cal Brownings from Argentina in a recent war, but all were UK-proofed before they were accepted into service, never mind that quite a few of us had seen them working very well.

tac

Terry, Terry, Terry,

You can't allow experienced combat troops to make a capital decision of the magnitude. It requires a qualified "desk pilot" to determine these things. Besides, what would they do between coffee and cigarette breaks to justify their positions. This is pretty heady stuff to leave to mere amatures. You obviously don't see the big picture.

Ron

[cirelaw]

SEE WHAT I STARTED!!

[cirelaw]

What does all this have to do withh the subject, PROOF MARKS?

[Ron Smith]

Eric,

We were just ambling on. Old people tend to do that. I assumed that your question had been answered.

In my opinion, import marks do detract from the value somewhat, because they are contemporary. The only exception would be a very rare or otherwise desirable piece.

And even then, the fact that they are there, tends to wear on me. It's kind of like seeing a beautiful woman only to get closer and discover that she has a large, hairy wart on the end of her nose.

I believe it is pretty much a choice of personal preferrence . Some don't mind, some do.

I would also add that they are pointless. They don't serve any purpose that I can determine. If a gun is used in a crime, what does it tell the authorities?

"AHA! It's an import. We have the evidence! Yes yer honor, they were robbed with an imported gun! That's all that we know at this point. However, with this evidence, we know that they were robbed with an imported gun."

Ron

[cirelaw]

Yes, as always,My deference to the Pillars of the Universal Hobby for Men and Boys all over. A sincere, Thank You All! My Mother used to say, "If you cant carry it in one arm, You can't afford it!' I often wondered if the same included Exwives?

[cirelaw]

MY TURN, 'For the rightous, will one day rise in a rightous wave of mass indigation, and sweep the lackies, back into into an eternal world of indignation and proclaim, that they shall forever wander a desert of shattured dreams,, with their Shadow, as their only companion, GUESS WHO? C_______ M__!

[cirelaw]

My Late Mother, Never Marry A Woman, you cant carry over the threshold

[Aaron]

A gun with an import mark should be fairly easy to trace, expecially to the first buyer. I believe that bring back weapons are virtually impossible to trace unless marked with a social security or driver license number or some such personal ID.

[minigun]

Judging from the one pic of a small part of the gun, it looks like a nicely finished Luger. Unfortunately it has the dreaded import mark. I'm just throwing in what others have told you, it definitley de-values it around the 50% mark I'd say. That one little crappy stamp will do that.

I'd also say that the ultimate burdeon would lie on the buyer to make sure that before he hands over the $, he understands and knows what he is getting (unless there is some prior arrangement, written agreement or inspection period, etc.). Some imprort marks are so small and in the most smallest hidden places that it's scary to say the least.

[cirelaw]

Your absolutly right, Whale owns the pretty rig, original holster and all, Its his absolute finest, We guard each others' firearms and I got them when he left for Bike Week in Daytona, What a bummer. It woulnt bother me in an otherwise pristene Luger

[cirelaw]

The Law is clear in most jurisdictions, unless there is an expressed guarentee, that the gun is legit, you bought it as is. The only implied warrentee, is the right to sell it and and that he either owns it, or has permission by the owner to pass title. The only exception,is if the firearm had ever been stolen, or used in the commision of a crime, One more caveat, firearms are, like your automobile considered a 'dangerous instrumentality, making the owner stricly liable for any acts committed whether intentionaly or not, Watch Peoples' Court Eric Bruning, JD Villanova Law School, Dooctorite Of Law, 1981