Erma .22 conversion for P 08; FIRING update post #21

[DonVoigt]

Firing update on 7-14-15

It works!

Doesn't like standard velocity .22 LR ammo, but feed it "high speed" .22 LR and it goes!
I didn't try any of the stingers or super velocity loads, as the "normal" high speed .22 LR worked fine.
To be specific it was Peter's brand and maybe 15 years old!

Both magazines work fine and it extracts and ejects straight up and out!

It is for sure the "horns" on the back of the magazine are the "ejectors" in this design.

Happy day for sure!

And the lower works fine too!

[ithacaartist]

Good show, Don. Mine was a little cranky, but found to work best on Aguila Golden Eagle Match--no, it couldn't like anything in an econo-box! Sounds like yours is actually going to be a bit of fun!

[hayhugh]

What is the difference between standard velocity ammo, and .22 LR? Is not .22 LR the standard load?

[alanint]

.22 long is the standard load, followed by Long Rifle, then high, then hyper velocity loads.

[John Sabato]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

What is the difference between standard velocity ammo, and .22 LR? Is not .22 LR the standard load?

I think HayHugh left the words "Hi-velocity" out of his post...

Sometimes my fingers type a lot slower than my mind thinks they are typing...

[hayhugh]

No, I was questioning " Doesn't like standard velocity ammo, but feed it .22 LR and it goes!" If .22 long is the standard velocity, then I now understand. I also took it as a given that these adapters were only intended to use .22 LR...

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

No, I was questioning " Doesn't like standard velocity ammo, but feed it .22 LR and it goes!" If .22 long is the standard velocity, then I now understand. I also took it as a given that these adapters were only intended to use .22 LR...

I'm the one that left the ".22 LR" off after the standard velocity or high speed off befoer . 22 LR.

Yes of course it only shoots .22 LR correctly , and it does not like standard velocity or some call it target loads, it likes the regular,
common, what you usually get- "high speed" loading.

I hope this is clear!

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

What is the difference between standard velocity ammo, and .22 LR? Is not .22 LR the standard load?

From the first link,

The variety of .22 LR loads are often divided into four distinct categories, based on nominal velocity:

Subsonic, which also includes "target" or "match" loads, at nominal speeds below 1,100 ft/s (340 m/s)
Standard-velocity: 1,000–1,135 ft/s (305–346 m/s), common velocities are around 1,125 ft/s (343 m/s)
High-velocity: 1,200–1,310 ft/s (370–400 m/s) per second
Hyper-velocity, or ultra-velocity: over 1,400 ft/s (430 m/s)

The following sorts out the basics for each round.


.22 lr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Long_Rifle

.22 long https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Long

.22 extra long https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Extra_Long

.22 short https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_short

.22 rimfire is a big category, there are cartridges of all sort. Some are entirely proprietary. They're all rather interesting!

[hayhugh]

My only reference to proper ammo is attached:

[ithacaartist]

The SE 08/2, being the last model of kit made, apparently could handle high speed loads, the ones that are the next notch up from Standard Velocity on the list above. Early, mostly-zinc alloy .22's they made in the 60's were made before the higher velocity was so common, and might likely not have have been designed to use it. The later KGP 69, made mostly of steel, had notes included with the gun that recommended high velocity rounds. But there is a limit. When initially testing mine as I acquired them, finding the ammo each one liked best, I made the mistake of using Stingers by CCI. You could hear the difference when firing, and their excessive energy broke three separate cast Zamak front toggle links in mine. So, though the stinger rounds are .22lr, they are hyper-velocity ~1600 fps and should be avoided in semi-auto pistols if there is any doubt about whether they can handle this load.

[DonVoigt]

If one reads in Sturgess, they find that the period German .22 lr ammo was marginal in the pistol sub caliber kit- explanation is the ammo was designed for the rifle and didn't build sufficient pressure for the pistol to have a 'normal' barrel length.

hence the extended about 8" barrel which then supposedly worked with the ammo in the German army system.

That is why I started with standard velocity .22 LR, then Eley rifle target; neither of which worked. The Peters high speed did.

One can see from reading the post above that standard and high speed actually can overlap a little, so even the brand and maybe the lot will make a difference.

Your results will likely vary, but it is not at all unusual to have to select .22 LR ammo that functions well or better in any particular pistol- not just model- but individual pistols can vary significantly.

The same is true for other caliber pistols.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

My only reference to proper ammo is attached:

Do you know the date or period of the statement shown?

Obviously it is not for the SE 08/2 as it says just SE 08.

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

If one reads in Sturgess, they find that the period German .22 lr ammo was marginal in the pistol sub caliber kit- explanation is the ammo was designed for the rifle and didn't build sufficient pressure for the pistol to have a 'normal' barrel length.

Makes sense.

That is why I started with standard velocity .22 LR, then Eley rifle target; neither of which worked. The Peters high speed did.

What's the muzzle velocity of the Peters?

One can see from reading the post above that standard and high speed actually can overlap a little, so even the brand and maybe the lot will make a difference.

I think the speed ratings are pretty nominal; the only clear line is the 1100 fps, below which rounds are sub-sonic, by definition.

Your results will likely vary, but it is not at all unusual to have to select .22 LR ammo that functions well or better in any particular pistol- not just model- but individual pistols can vary significantly.

The same is true for other caliber pistols.

You said a mouthful there! Before the ammo panic, I picked up several boxes each of just about anything I could find in 40 gr RN, up to about the velocity rating of CCI Mini Mags, so I could offer this selection to each of my .22 Ermas. Some like a load a little hot, some do not.

[hayhugh]

Do you know the date or period of the statement shown?

Not sure when published.

[DonVoigt]

"What's the muzzle velocity of the Peters?"

I have no idea, that box just came to the top of my "pile" and I grabbed it with the eley rounds.

It is at least 15 years old, maybe older.

I don't have, never had a chronograph. Reloaded in the distant past, found my time was worth more than the ammo I created. It was a good learning experience, but I got rid of my loading stuff in 1970!

[rhuff]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

"What's the muzzle velocity of the Peters?"

I have no idea, that box just came to the top of my "pile" and I grabbed it with the eley rounds.

It is at least 15 years old, maybe older.!

I believe that you will find that Peters ammo is quite a bit older than 15 years. I still have some of it from back in the 1950s. I don't know exactly when it was dropped. Wow, this is really making me feel old!!

[ithacaartist]

I did a search last night. I don't think it's made any more. Peters developed the.22 lr round at the turn of the last century

[hayhugh]

Here is some from the 20's

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

Here is some from the 20's

My box is not that old.

I'll have to take a photo and post it!
Who would have thought anyone would care?

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

Who would have thought anyone would care?

Old ammunition boxes are cool...'Specially if them gots boolits in they's...