A Visit With John Martz

Dwight Gruber · 07-26-2004, 03:43 AM

When I went to the April Reno gun show I made the trip from Portland to Reno in one marathon drive. I vowed that I would take a much kinder, gentler trip home. After talking to a couple of collectors at the show I made a phone call, and two days later I found myself driving into the wooded hills north of Lincoln, California. After turning into a long driveway off a single-track lane, I parked my car and was met at the garage door by a tall, smiling, older gentleman--the legendary Lugersmith, John V. Martz.

After brief introductions he ushered me into his workshop where we spent the next hour or so in an enthusiastic discussion about Lugers.

This was the place where his magic all happens. A workbench, not more than six or seven feet long, festooned with tools and jigs, some of them professionally made and some of them hand-made from his earliest production. A TIG welder on a shelf in the corner. A drill press. Nothing fancy, just the well-used tools of a fine hand-craftsman.

A 9mm Luger carbine, in the white and partially worked, was in a bench vise. He handed me a finished "1900 Navy", an 8" pencil barreled Luger in .30 with a Navy sight, and also showed me a P-38 carbine. In addition he pulled out several stainless-steel trays, one after the other, each with a differnt project in various stages of manufacture.

He apologised for not having a .45 Luger in the shop to show me, but we did talk some about how he makes them. He had several barrels to show me, and said that he has a barrel maker who fabricates all his custom barrels. He had a .45 frame he was working on, two Lugers split unevenly back-to-front down the grip to give enough length for the .45 magazine. He works the interior of the magazine well to expand its overall dimensions, and demonstrated the sizing guage he uses to determine proper fit. The rear frame was finished, a slip-fit, but the front frame had yet to be worked on.

The frame is not the only part of a .45 conversion which needs to be lengthened. In addition to the two Lugers necessary for the frame, it also takes two toggle trains, to lengthen both toggle pieces. He cuts the rear "ears" off the receiver extension and welds on steel stock to lengthen this as well. He noted that he fabricates new breechblocks from scratch himself.

The magazine is the most difficult part to fabricate and he showed me one he was just beginning to make from thin steel sheet, bent, folded and welded. He recounted that when he first decided to make a .45 Luger he perfected a magazine first, and engineered the rest of the gun around it.

He also pulled out an Erfurt which was sitting by itself on a shelf, and noted that he couldn't use this right away to make a .45 with, as Erfurt frame rails are different from DWM, and don't match when put together. Doesn't change the function, just looks bad. He has friends who search out inexpensive Alphabet Commercial Lugers for him to convert.

In addition to a barrel-maker Martz also engages a woodworker for custom stocks. He showed me a finished stock, the finest woodworking and finishing one can imagine. He also pulled out a tray of assorted magazine bases to show me, all crafted by Gerry Tomek.

Around the walls of the shop, near the ceiling, are covers of a Japanese magazine with photos of many of his conversions. I asked him which was the most difficult conversion to make work, and he replied that it was the Luger in .22 Magnum (!). He showed me a cartirdge he is currently working on a Luger design for, a .45 case necked down to 10mm.

We walked around the corner into another room and he pulled out a fine wooden presentation box. In it was his .380 prototype #1, beautifully crafted and lovingly engraved to his wife. He mentioned that it had a particularly fine trigger pull, and allowed me to dry-fire it. The slightest trigger slack to take up, firm pressure, and the crispest release imaginable. I never believed that a Luger could have a trigger pull this good, and told him--he was very pleased, and proud of it.

As the .45 requires two Lugers in order to lengthen it, the .380 needs to be shortened, frame, toggles, and receiver extensions. In addition, it must be converted into an unlocked blowback, as the cartridge doesn't have enough energy to cycle the locked Luger mechanism (I wonder how the Italians do it?).

During the visit he took a phone call from a customer who was looking for an Artillery sight, which he fabricates as well.

John Martz is an enthusiastic and gracious host, who loves to talk about Lugers. He accepts visitors happily, and I enjoyed the time I spent with him greatly. I recommend a visit to anyone who might be in his neck of the woods, call him first.

--Dwight

John Sabato · 07-26-2004, 11:41 AM

Dwight, I certainly hope that you were not so "high" on the visit that you left your camera in the car? Any photos to share of this envious visit and the unique things that you saw?

Dwight Gruber · 07-26-2004, 09:31 PM

John,

'Fraid it was just a 'friendly' visit, I didn't want to impose that much.

--Dwight

Dean · 07-26-2004, 10:45 PM

"If a man build a better mousetrap or write a better book, though he move to the wilderness the world will beat a path to his door."

John Sabato · 07-27-2004, 10:38 AM

Too bad Dwight... your story above could have been a Dynamite short article for one of the shooting sports rags if you had a couple of photos to go with it!

Edward Tinker · 07-27-2004, 12:21 PM

But, I can understand the not wanting to impose! I would love to mett Mr. Martz, he is THE grand master in my eyes!~

Ed

Lugerdoc · 07-27-2004, 05:03 PM

Dwight, Thanks for your very descriptive comments. It brings back fond memories of my visit to John's work shop. Did you have an opportunity to fire one of his creations from the picnic table, just outside his shop, over the lake? I really should take my Martz Baby P38 & Navy 45 out to the range more to shoot, but they're so beautiful, I hate risking any damage.

Dwight Gruber · 07-27-2004, 11:07 PM

Tom,

I remember seeing the picnic table, but he didn't offer and it didn't seem like the kind of thing to ask. Might have been different if he'd had a .45 at hand. Maybe next time.

--Dwight

policeluger · 07-27-2004, 11:46 PM

Dwight...did John still have that original German WW2 tool room poster above his work bench?

Dwight Gruber · 07-28-2004, 12:36 AM

"Dwight...did John still have that original German WW2 tool room poster above his work bench?"

Erm...couldn't tell you, if he did I didn't take particular note of it...

Lodi Jim · 07-30-2004, 06:09 AM

Dwight, thanks for the report. John will be 80 the middle of August and still going strong (with an occational nap). He's crafting a Baby 357 Sig for me now that hopefully will be done in time for Reno show. It's in the white and I think it's #1 in this series. He's a neat guy and fun to visit. A must do trip if you're anywhere close to Sacramento.

Jim

mauro · 07-30-2004, 09:52 AM

Jim,
please look at your private message.
Ciao

Big Norm · 08-01-2004, 07:52 PM

Dwight,
I have to agree with the others here. You should have taken a camera. Once I had the pleasure to meet the great Fred Bear of Bear Archery. Like Martz, he also was a real gentleman. I didn't have my camera with me either and I now kick myself.
Big Norm

Lugerdoc · 08-03-2004, 08:52 AM

Yesterday I spoke to Neila, John's wife, and found out that his 80th birthday is coming up on 19 Aug. So anyone wishing to send him greetings can do so @ John Martz 8060 Lakeview Lane, Lincoln, Ca. 95648. TH

Pete Ebbink · 06-05-2005, 10:31 PM

MARTZ CUSTOM GERMAN LUGERS AND P-38s
John V.Martz
8060 Lakeview Ln.,Lincoln,CA 95648
(916)645-2250
FAX(916)645-3815

Hub · 06-05-2005, 11:29 PM

Maybe I can help as I spent some time with John last August. I believe that it will be his 81st birthday unless he is planning on staying 80 as he told us it was his 80th last year. What a fine gentleman.

Hub · 06-05-2005, 11:40 PM

photos

Hub · 06-05-2005, 11:41 PM

photo

Hugh · 06-07-2005, 01:02 AM

I'm posting these pictures for Neil Keller:
John Martz & Neil Keller

John's Favorite:

John's Wife's Baby :

Baby 380:

Baby P38:

thegundude · 06-07-2005, 07:54 AM

80... 81... at that age, does it matter anymore? I'm only 42 and I feel like I might as well be 60.

May he live to be 120.

07-26-2004, 11:41 AM	#2
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Dwight, I certainly hope that you were not so "high" on the visit that you left your camera in the car? Any photos to share of this envious visit and the unique things that you saw? __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

07-26-2004, 10:45 PM	#4
Dean User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: PA Posts: 132 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	"If a man build a better mousetrap or write a better book, though he move to the wilderness the world will beat a path to his door." __________________ Carpe Diem, Parabellum

07-27-2004, 10:38 AM	#5
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,150 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Too bad Dwight... your story above could have been a Dynamite short article for one of the shooting sports rags if you had a couple of photos to go with it! __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

07-27-2004, 12:21 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,987 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	But, I can understand the not wanting to impose! I would love to mett Mr. Martz, he is THE grand master in my eyes!~ Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

07-27-2004, 05:03 PM	#7
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Dwight, Thanks for your very descriptive comments. It brings back fond memories of my visit to John's work shop. Did you have an opportunity to fire one of his creations from the picnic table, just outside his shop, over the lake? I really should take my Martz Baby P38 & Navy 45 out to the range more to shoot, but they're so beautiful, I hate risking any damage. __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

07-26-2004, 03:43 AM	#1
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	A Visit With John Martz When I went to the April Reno gun show I made the trip from Portland to Reno in one marathon drive. I vowed that I would take a much kinder, gentler trip home. After talking to a couple of collectors at the show I made a phone call, and two days later I found myself driving into the wooded hills north of Lincoln, California. After turning into a long driveway off a single-track lane, I parked my car and was met at the garage door by a tall, smiling, older gentleman--the legendary Lugersmith, John V. Martz. After brief introductions he ushered me into his workshop where we spent the next hour or so in an enthusiastic discussion about Lugers. This was the place where his magic all happens. A workbench, not more than six or seven feet long, festooned with tools and jigs, some of them professionally made and some of them hand-made from his earliest production. A TIG welder on a shelf in the corner. A drill press. Nothing fancy, just the well-used tools of a fine hand-craftsman. A 9mm Luger carbine, in the white and partially worked, was in a bench vise. He handed me a finished "1900 Navy", an 8" pencil barreled Luger in .30 with a Navy sight, and also showed me a P-38 carbine. In addition he pulled out several stainless-steel trays, one after the other, each with a differnt project in various stages of manufacture. He apologised for not having a .45 Luger in the shop to show me, but we did talk some about how he makes them. He had several barrels to show me, and said that he has a barrel maker who fabricates all his custom barrels. He had a .45 frame he was working on, two Lugers split unevenly back-to-front down the grip to give enough length for the .45 magazine. He works the interior of the magazine well to expand its overall dimensions, and demonstrated the sizing guage he uses to determine proper fit. The rear frame was finished, a slip-fit, but the front frame had yet to be worked on. The frame is not the only part of a .45 conversion which needs to be lengthened. In addition to the two Lugers necessary for the frame, it also takes two toggle trains, to lengthen both toggle pieces. He cuts the rear "ears" off the receiver extension and welds on steel stock to lengthen this as well. He noted that he fabricates new breechblocks from scratch himself. The magazine is the most difficult part to fabricate and he showed me one he was just beginning to make from thin steel sheet, bent, folded and welded. He recounted that when he first decided to make a .45 Luger he perfected a magazine first, and engineered the rest of the gun around it. He also pulled out an Erfurt which was sitting by itself on a shelf, and noted that he couldn't use this right away to make a .45 with, as Erfurt frame rails are different from DWM, and don't match when put together. Doesn't change the function, just looks bad. He has friends who search out inexpensive Alphabet Commercial Lugers for him to convert. In addition to a barrel-maker Martz also engages a woodworker for custom stocks. He showed me a finished stock, the finest woodworking and finishing one can imagine. He also pulled out a tray of assorted magazine bases to show me, all crafted by Gerry Tomek. Around the walls of the shop, near the ceiling, are covers of a Japanese magazine with photos of many of his conversions. I asked him which was the most difficult conversion to make work, and he replied that it was the Luger in .22 Magnum (!). He showed me a cartirdge he is currently working on a Luger design for, a .45 case necked down to 10mm. We walked around the corner into another room and he pulled out a fine wooden presentation box. In it was his .380 prototype #1, beautifully crafted and lovingly engraved to his wife. He mentioned that it had a particularly fine trigger pull, and allowed me to dry-fire it. The slightest trigger slack to take up, firm pressure, and the crispest release imaginable. I never believed that a Luger could have a trigger pull this good, and told him--he was very pleased, and proud of it. As the .45 requires two Lugers in order to lengthen it, the .380 needs to be shortened, frame, toggles, and receiver extensions. In addition, it must be converted into an unlocked blowback, as the cartridge doesn't have enough energy to cycle the locked Luger mechanism (I wonder how the Italians do it?). During the visit he took a phone call from a customer who was looking for an Artillery sight, which he fabricates as well. John Martz is an enthusiastic and gracious host, who loves to talk about Lugers. He accepts visitors happily, and I enjoyed the time I spent with him greatly. I recommend a visit to anyone who might be in his neck of the woods, call him first. --Dwight

07-26-2004, 09:31 PM	#3
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	John, 'Fraid it was just a 'friendly' visit, I didn't want to impose that much. --Dwight

07-27-2004, 11:07 PM	#8
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	Tom, I remember seeing the picnic table, but he didn't offer and it didn't seem like the kind of thing to ask. Might have been different if he'd had a .45 at hand. Maybe next time. --Dwight

07-27-2004, 11:46 PM	#9
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Dwight...did John still have that original German WW2 tool room poster above his work bench?

07-28-2004, 12:36 AM	#10
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	"Dwight...did John still have that original German WW2 tool room poster above his work bench?" Erm...couldn't tell you, if he did I didn't take particular note of it...

07-30-2004, 06:09 AM	#11
Lodi Jim User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: California Posts: 65 Thanks: 5 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Dwight, thanks for the report. John will be 80 the middle of August and still going strong (with an occational nap). He's crafting a Baby 357 Sig for me now that hopefully will be done in time for Reno show. It's in the white and I think it's #1 in this series. He's a neat guy and fun to visit. A must do trip if you're anywhere close to Sacramento. Jim

07-30-2004, 09:52 AM	#12
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Jim, please look at your private message. Ciao __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

08-01-2004, 07:52 PM	#13
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Dwight, I have to agree with the others here. You should have taken a camera. Once I had the pleasure to meet the great Fred Bear of Bear Archery. Like Martz, he also was a real gentleman. I didn't have my camera with me either and I now kick myself. Big Norm

08-03-2004, 08:52 AM	#14
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Yesterday I spoke to Neila, John's wife, and found out that his 80th birthday is coming up on 19 Aug. So anyone wishing to send him greetings can do so @ John Martz 8060 Lakeview Lane, Lincoln, Ca. 95648. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

06-05-2005, 10:31 PM	#15
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	MARTZ CUSTOM GERMAN LUGERS AND P-38s John V.Martz 8060 Lakeview Ln.,Lincoln,CA 95648 (916)645-2250 FAX(916)645-3815

06-05-2005, 11:29 PM	#16
Hub User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Decatur, IN Posts: 61 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Martz Maybe I can help as I spent some time with John last August. I believe that it will be his 81st birthday unless he is planning on staying 80 as he told us it was his 80th last year. What a fine gentleman. Attached Thumbnails

06-05-2005, 11:40 PM	#17
Hub User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Decatur, IN Posts: 61 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	photos Attached Thumbnails

06-05-2005, 11:41 PM	#18
Hub User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Decatur, IN Posts: 61 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	photo

06-07-2005, 01:02 AM	#19
Hugh RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeast Texas Swamp Posts: 2,460 Thanks: 2 Thanked 165 Times in 64 Posts	Photos of John and Neil I'm posting these pictures for Neil Keller: John Martz & Neil Keller John's Favorite: John's Wife's Baby : Baby 380: Baby P38:

06-07-2005, 07:54 AM	#20
thegundude User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Western NC Posts: 1,137 Thanks: 3 Thanked 16 Times in 3 Posts	80... 81... at that age, does it matter anymore? I'm only 42 and I feel like I might as well be 60. May he live to be 120. __________________ Keep your knees in the breeze and your iron in the air. ~Steve