The Good, the Bad and the Ugly - M.1908 Navy

grapppa · 11-09-2008, 09:21 AM

Well I came across this M.1908 and I couldnt pass it up. Serial number 1112b - correct for this variation. It is all matching - grips included. Firing pin is not numbered. The good - it is all matching and bought it very reasonable - the bad - came without the clip - the ugly... see pics. These pics are AFTER I gently cleaned it up. The bore is surprisingly good. Based on my evaluation of the wear, this gun was not used that much, suffers from improper storage I guess, but I wonder why the pitting is on the locations that it is...who knows. This gun is a great educational example - IMHO - because of the proper location and fonts of the markings - they are all very crisp. If only this gun could talk ! Good candidate for restoration? - not that this is my choice. How would you rate it and what do you think its worth. Thanks. Paul

Mauser720 · 11-09-2008, 09:28 AM

Paul -

I'm not sure what you mean by "restoration"; however, in my opinion, if you re-blue this pistol you will destroy its collector value.

Mauser720 - Ron

grapppa · 11-09-2008, 09:34 AM

I agree; I have no intention to restore it, but would like to know others opinions.

drbuster · 11-09-2008, 10:22 AM

It's in much better shape than if it was salvaged from the ocean bottom, where most 1908 (and other) Navy lugers probably reside!

Ron Wood · 11-09-2008, 11:33 AM

I am not totally against restoration. There are some items that are so rare/unique and in such deplorable condition that restoration is warranted (I remember years ago reading an article about a 20-shot Conehammer that looked like it had spent some time on the ocean floor that was restored to like new). However, this Luger doesn't fall into that category. It is not particularly unique and I think it would be impossible to restore without destroying some of the proof marks. They would have to be re-cut (I shudder to think that there are counterfeit dies of sufficient quality that the marks could be re-struck) and that would place a cloud of suspicion about authenticity that would always stay with the gun. Best to enjoy it for what it is, which isn't a bad thing.

lugerholsterrepair · 11-09-2008, 04:13 PM

Paul, Any authentic Navy is a treasure. My shooter Navy has a mismatched top and I paid $1500 for it 5 years ago. I really enjoy shooting a stocked Navy.
This one being all matched..It's a shooter condition but who would want to break a part?
Like some others... I would not want to restore this one for the reasons given.
I would value this one at least in the $1500+ range.

Jerry Burney

wlyon · 11-09-2008, 04:25 PM

Good advise from the experts. I have a 1906 Navy in simular condition which I am very happy to own. Bill

Navy · 11-10-2008, 10:59 AM

Paul,

The folks are giving you good advice. Another factor to consider isthis: Who is available and qualified to do a correct restoration?

I don't think Gale Morgan is taking any new work and he is far from a spring chicken.

Tom A

Dwight Gruber · 11-10-2008, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lugerholsterrepair
...It's a shooter condition but who would want to break a part?

Jerry,

With respect, in my opinion there is not a hard line separating collectible and shootable Lugers. Navys seem to me to fall into the category of collection-worthy guns regardless of condition. They may be in fine condition, they may be pretty beat up, they may be in relic condition; but they are still in demand, and they still can command a price greater than their condition may represent. Placing such a gun in deliberate jeopardy by regular firing seems to me to be a bit reckless.

Indeed, you allude to the point yourself: "...who would want to break a part?"

--Dwight

lugerholsterrepair · 11-10-2008, 02:47 PM

Dwight, We are of the same mind on shooting collectables. That's why I shoot a mismatched Navy. If a part breaks..and they do..I can replace it.

It seems like very few people want to assign values when people ask for them for some reason..I thought this one would bring around 1500 or better. Hard to say actually as the condition turns off many who want a Navy.
I have a half dozen Navy & Artillery's that will never chamber a round while I own them. I have shooters of all types and why shoot a $5000 dollar pistol? I am losing enough money in the stock market...

Jerry Burney

GerColctor · 11-16-2008, 05:59 PM

I never shoot any of my all matching Lugers. Have one mismatch just for that purpose. Put quite a number of rounds thru my mismatched 9mm commerical and as "expected" a part on the toggle eventually broke. Not a big problem.

grapppa
Nice looking old Navy "war horse". Don't do anything that might damage it. They don't make anymore of these Navy Lugers.

Joe

11-09-2008, 09:21 AM	#1
grapppa User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hillsborough, NJ Posts: 147 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The Good, the Bad and the Ugly - M.1908 Navy Well I came across this M.1908 and I couldnt pass it up. Serial number 1112b - correct for this variation. It is all matching - grips included. Firing pin is not numbered. The good - it is all matching and bought it very reasonable - the bad - came without the clip - the ugly... see pics. These pics are AFTER I gently cleaned it up. The bore is surprisingly good. Based on my evaluation of the wear, this gun was not used that much, suffers from improper storage I guess, but I wonder why the pitting is on the locations that it is...who knows. This gun is a great educational example - IMHO - because of the proper location and fonts of the markings - they are all very crisp. If only this gun could talk ! Good candidate for restoration? - not that this is my choice. How would you rate it and what do you think its worth. Thanks. Paul Attached Thumbnails

11-09-2008, 09:28 AM	#2
Mauser720 User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 535 Thanks: 18 Thanked 49 Times in 33 Posts	Paul - I'm not sure what you mean by "restoration"; however, in my opinion, if you re-blue this pistol you will destroy its collector value. Mauser720 - Ron __________________ Mauser720 - Ron "Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it."

11-09-2008, 11:33 AM	#5
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	I am not totally against restoration. There are some items that are so rare/unique and in such deplorable condition that restoration is warranted (I remember years ago reading an article about a 20-shot Conehammer that looked like it had spent some time on the ocean floor that was restored to like new). However, this Luger doesn't fall into that category. It is not particularly unique and I think it would be impossible to restore without destroying some of the proof marks. They would have to be re-cut (I shudder to think that there are counterfeit dies of sufficient quality that the marks could be re-struck) and that would place a cloud of suspicion about authenticity that would always stay with the gun. Best to enjoy it for what it is, which isn't a bad thing. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

11-09-2008, 04:13 PM	#6
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	Paul, Any authentic Navy is a treasure. My shooter Navy has a mismatched top and I paid $1500 for it 5 years ago. I really enjoy shooting a stocked Navy. This one being all matched..It's a shooter condition but who would want to break a part? Like some others... I would not want to restore this one for the reasons given. I would value this one at least in the $1500+ range. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

11-09-2008, 04:25 PM	#7
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,615 Thanks: 3,140 Thanked 2,522 Times in 940 Posts	Good advise from the experts. I have a 1906 Navy in simular condition which I am very happy to own. Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

11-09-2008, 09:34 AM	#3
grapppa User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hillsborough, NJ Posts: 147 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I agree; I have no intention to restore it, but would like to know others opinions.

11-09-2008, 10:22 AM	#4
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	It's in much better shape than if it was salvaged from the ocean bottom, where most 1908 (and other) Navy lugers probably reside!

11-10-2008, 10:59 AM	#8
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Paul, The folks are giving you good advice. Another factor to consider isthis: Who is available and qualified to do a correct restoration? I don't think Gale Morgan is taking any new work and he is far from a spring chicken. Tom A

11-10-2008, 02:47 PM	#10
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	Dwight, We are of the same mind on shooting collectables. That's why I shoot a mismatched Navy. If a part breaks..and they do..I can replace it. It seems like very few people want to assign values when people ask for them for some reason..I thought this one would bring around 1500 or better. Hard to say actually as the condition turns off many who want a Navy. I have a half dozen Navy & Artillery's that will never chamber a round while I own them. I have shooters of all types and why shoot a $5000 dollar pistol? I am losing enough money in the stock market... Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

11-16-2008, 05:59 PM	#11
GerColctor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: CT & FL Posts: 308 Thanks: 2 Thanked 40 Times in 27 Posts	I never shoot any of my all matching Lugers. Have one mismatch just for that purpose. Put quite a number of rounds thru my mismatched 9mm commerical and as "expected" a part on the toggle eventually broke. Not a big problem. grapppa Nice looking old Navy "war horse". Don't do anything that might damage it. They don't make anymore of these Navy Lugers. Joe __________________ It is better to have lived a day as a tiger, then a thousand years as a lamb.