sideplate shape

jeffs · 09-15-2008, 10:27 PM

The sideplate on my 1918 Erfurt Luger has a ridge on the left side that runs from top to bottom of the sideplate, rather than stopping before the top. Since I have not seen this on any other Luger, it seems reasonable that this is not an original part. Has anyone else seen one of these, and if so, know anything about it?

THanks!

wlyon · 09-15-2008, 10:32 PM

Jeffs
The sideplate on a couple of the Swiss models had this type sideplate. My guess it came from one of these. Is the sideplate matching?

alanint · 09-15-2008, 10:35 PM

This sounds like the typical machining mark for Lugers which have had the sideplate "forced matched" to the rest of the gun.
If you examine your sideplate, you may find that the area to the right of this ridge is shallower, or lower than the balance of the sideplate. By removing all this material, they are able to obliterate the original sideplate serial number without simply "dishing out" the area of the original serial number and thus providing an even, smooth surface to re stamp.
They did the machining in this fashion to avoid contact with the raised trigger bar recess on the sideplate.

jeffs · 09-16-2008, 07:23 AM

Hi again

Thank you for this information! I am nothing near an expert, but the sideplate seems to match the appearance of the rest of the pistol. It is a shooter; the barrel and receiver match, but the barrel and toggle and other small parts do not, though all appear to be Erfurt parts. Interestingly, this is a CAI import from the 1990's, and there are no post WWI proof marks. CAI said that they got it from the the former East Germany or Eastern Europe after the wall fell. It seems as if it was not touched from 1918 until the 1990's

Lugerdoc · 09-16-2008, 09:04 AM

Jeff, In addition to the M1929 Swiss side plates mentioned above, the Swiss model Mauser Parabellums had a similar looking one, and I've also seen some cheap repros of that type. Tom

alanint · 09-16-2008, 09:10 PM

Please post a photograph so the issue can be made clearer. The "Forced Match" possibility I posted above is typical of a great number of East German put together pistols, which were imported into this country. The guns were uniformely dip blued prior to export so the finish on an altered sideplate will appear to match the balance of the gun.

Only a photo will help here.

MFC · 09-17-2008, 03:18 AM

I took this photo from Simpson's Ltd. I hope they don't mind.
Swiss Bern 1929

Mike C.

alanint · 09-17-2008, 05:04 AM

Disregard my comments. Your photo makes clear that this is not a re machining issue, but a Swiss side plate on your gun.

jeffs · 09-17-2008, 07:11 AM

Here are two pictures of the 1918 Erfurt Luger in question.

Thanks,
Jeff

jeffs · 09-17-2008, 07:18 AM

More: I forgot to mention that on the back of the sideplate there is a capital "Z," and also a bit removed and at 90 degrees, an "N."

Lugerdoc · 09-17-2008, 10:30 AM

Jeff, If it were an original M29 Swiss side plate, it would have a Swiss cross somewhere inside. TH

jeffs · 09-17-2008, 06:28 PM

TH-

You are absolutely right! I found a faint Swiss cross on the backside of the plate, along with the Bernerprobe mark. Thanks for figuring all this out!

Sincerely,
Jeff Showell

09-15-2008, 10:27 PM	#1
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	sideplate shape The sideplate on my 1918 Erfurt Luger has a ridge on the left side that runs from top to bottom of the sideplate, rather than stopping before the top. Since I have not seen this on any other Luger, it seems reasonable that this is not an original part. Has anyone else seen one of these, and if so, know anything about it? THanks!

09-15-2008, 10:32 PM	#2
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,625 Thanks: 3,165 Thanked 2,544 Times in 949 Posts	Jeffs The sideplate on a couple of the Swiss models had this type sideplate. My guess it came from one of these. Is the sideplate matching? __________________ Bill Lyon

09-16-2008, 09:04 AM	#5
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Jeff, In addition to the M1929 Swiss side plates mentioned above, the Swiss model Mauser Parabellums had a similar looking one, and I've also seen some cheap repros of that type. Tom __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

09-17-2008, 03:18 AM	#7
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	I took this photo from Simpson's Ltd. I hope they don't mind. Swiss Bern 1929 Mike C. __________________ Mike C.

09-17-2008, 07:11 AM	#9
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Here are two pictures of the 1918 Erfurt Luger in question. Thanks, Jeff Attached Thumbnails

09-15-2008, 10:35 PM	#3
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	This sounds like the typical machining mark for Lugers which have had the sideplate "forced matched" to the rest of the gun. If you examine your sideplate, you may find that the area to the right of this ridge is shallower, or lower than the balance of the sideplate. By removing all this material, they are able to obliterate the original sideplate serial number without simply "dishing out" the area of the original serial number and thus providing an even, smooth surface to re stamp. They did the machining in this fashion to avoid contact with the raised trigger bar recess on the sideplate.

09-16-2008, 07:23 AM	#4
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi again Thank you for this information! I am nothing near an expert, but the sideplate seems to match the appearance of the rest of the pistol. It is a shooter; the barrel and receiver match, but the barrel and toggle and other small parts do not, though all appear to be Erfurt parts. Interestingly, this is a CAI import from the 1990's, and there are no post WWI proof marks. CAI said that they got it from the the former East Germany or Eastern Europe after the wall fell. It seems as if it was not touched from 1918 until the 1990's

09-16-2008, 09:10 PM	#6
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Please post a photograph so the issue can be made clearer. The "Forced Match" possibility I posted above is typical of a great number of East German put together pistols, which were imported into this country. The guns were uniformely dip blued prior to export so the finish on an altered sideplate will appear to match the balance of the gun. Only a photo will help here.

09-17-2008, 05:04 AM	#8
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Disregard my comments. Your photo makes clear that this is not a re machining issue, but a Swiss side plate on your gun.

09-17-2008, 07:18 AM	#10
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	More: I forgot to mention that on the back of the sideplate there is a capital "Z," and also a bit removed and at 90 degrees, an "N."

09-17-2008, 10:30 AM	#11
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Jeff, If it were an original M29 Swiss side plate, it would have a Swiss cross somewhere inside. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

09-17-2008, 06:28 PM	#12
jeffs User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	TH- You are absolutely right! I found a faint Swiss cross on the backside of the plate, along with the Bernerprobe mark. Thanks for figuring all this out! Sincerely, Jeff Showell