1918 Erfurt value?

JDH · 05-08-2002, 06:06 PM

I've been offered a 1918 dated Erfurt with 95% original blue and 80% straw. It's all matching, with the exception of the nickle plated aluminum base mag. The bore and the grips are in excellent condition. It also comes with a '42 dated holster in excellent condition. I've not seen the pistol but if it's in the condition listed, would $800 be a realistic price? High? Low? Desirable piece? Thanx for your help.

Regards,

JDH

05-08-2002, 06:15 PM

I would pay that for it if the condition was as listed (not to mention the extra goodies). It's a pretty common WWI peice. We have been discussing Erfurts lately so you might want to scroll down and have a look. I would get some advice from some of the experts here at the forum (One of which I am not)! But I would buy it if it's as listed!

Hope This Helps!,Brandon

Lonnie Zimmerman · 05-08-2002, 06:23 PM

If it is as listed, it is a bargain!!

Lonnie

05-08-2002, 06:48 PM

you'd be lucky to get it under $1000. all matching at 90% with holster will run it up there.

tom · 05-08-2002, 08:50 PM

Hi JDH,

The *critical* component in this all matching Erfurt is, believe it or not, the grip screws. Erfurt grip screws were proofed on the exterior rounded surface parallel to the screw driver slot. If the grip screws ain't proofed, the gun is not matching and it becomes a garden variety Erfurt.

The good news is that at $ 550 or so, which is what the piece costs when you back out the holster and mag, its still a pretty attractive offer.

Hope this helps,

Tom

Roadkill · 05-08-2002, 08:51 PM

If you don't want it send it my way. I paid $625 for a 1918 Erfurt, non matching, non import, no holster, decent ++ condition, took a lot of work to get it to shoot at all, I've probably got $725 in it counting a repo holster.

RK

Roadkill · 05-08-2002, 08:55 PM

Grip screws proofed? That's a new one for me. I know you are serious about collecting or there would be a question in my mind. Are Erfurts the only ones? Let me know what the proofs look like.

RK

tom · 05-08-2002, 09:00 PM

The *correct, matching* grip screws for ALL Erfurt pieces is a Gothic W (Wilhelm) with a surmounted crown. If these ain't there, your Erfurt is not a matching gun...and most AIN'T there.

Tom

Roadkill · 05-08-2002, 09:14 PM

Thanks, as time goes on I feel the need to leave the collecting to folks like you and stay in the shooter arena. Too many ways to go wrong. One of the biggest things I see consistently is that most dealers either are not informed about Lugers or are purposely misleading in their sales advertisements. Mr John Smith at pawnshop AAA in Redbank Ala has no idea how to disassemble & verify what he will call "matching" when he puts it up on GA or AA or in the paper. Are Erfurts the only ones so marked?

RK

RK

05-08-2002, 09:20 PM

someone out there is willing to pay $1000 plus for that all matching, 90% plus original erfurt and holster....with or without the matched screws. trust me.

Johnny Peppers · 05-08-2002, 09:25 PM

The scan doesn't show the grip screw good enough to make out the inspection stamp, but you get the idea.

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/Erfurt.jpg

John D. · 05-08-2002, 09:30 PM

Yea - Erfurts were the only ones with grip screws that were so marked.

As for collecting vs. shooting - hmmmm... Find a variation that you want to focus on - then read, read some more, read a little more, then research (yes - actually "research" ) and ask a lot of questions. There are still a lot of "gems" out there waiting to be discovered by the collector.... It's an interesting time in Luger collecting, as many original VET Lugers are showing up, offered by the surviving families and their estates.

Just MHO....

Roadkill · 05-08-2002, 09:45 PM

Its amazing to me that there are mint, ALL matching w/2 magazines and holster pre WWI,WWI, Interim, & WWII Lugers out there after two World Wars and 10,000 people swapping parts on them. Collectors, you must be either focused to the degree of a laser in your diligence or completely out of your heads in this non ending search for the holy grail. I understand your lack of tolerance for parts doctors.

RK

Greg · 05-08-2002, 10:11 PM

Simson's also have their distinctive proofs on the screws.

Ron Wood · 05-08-2002, 10:12 PM

Probably shouldn't wade in on this one...but. Not having proofed grip screws does not reduce and otherwise matching Erfurt to "garden variety". Come on guys, these are warhorses. A nice matching Erfurt with replaced grip screws might,and I emphasize might,reduce the price by $20 or so IMO. Would you pass up a bargan on a new car because the floor mats were dirty?

John D. · 05-08-2002, 10:15 PM

You are right - I forgot all about those..!!! Sorry about that (can you tell I don't have any Simson Lugers?? )..

Great catch!

Lonnie Zimmerman · 05-08-2002, 11:37 PM

I believe a lot of the 1917-18 Erfurts did not have the grip screws proofed.

Lonnie

Aaron · 05-08-2002, 11:50 PM

My 99% 1917 Erfurt rig with TWO MATCHING MAGS, near mint brown holster and proofed tool is proofed in every conceivable place except the grip screws.

Marvin · 05-09-2002, 07:47 AM

What John said is so right; that if a person is going to collect Lugers, they should concentrate on one type, and READ anyhthing they can find on that variety! There are so many variations, time period variations, police, military, navy, etc. it is almost impossible to keep up with them all.

I try to stay with the WWI pistols, but I have recently gotten interested in the Weimar Police Lugers. I have a couple, but still need to read more and learn from others on this Forum that know more than I do.

Being armed with knowledge, you won't get taken. I also stay with the more common Lugers; the rare stuff is the ones you can get taken on very quick unless you know what you are doing. Just an opinion.

Marvin

AMMOMAN

05-09-2002, 09:35 AM

Most Erfurt PO8s prior to 1917 with have the crown over a letter INSPECTORS mark on the grip screws that you find on all other Erfurt parts. This pratice will discontinued sometime around 1917. Most all Simson PO8s will also have the E/6 or E/33 inspectors markings on their grip screws. Tom h

05-08-2002, 06:06 PM	#1
JDH New User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Washington State Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1918 Erfurt value? I've been offered a 1918 dated Erfurt with 95% original blue and 80% straw. It's all matching, with the exception of the nickle plated aluminum base mag. The bore and the grips are in excellent condition. It also comes with a '42 dated holster in excellent condition. I've not seen the pistol but if it's in the condition listed, would $800 be a realistic price? High? Low? Desirable piece? Thanx for your help. Regards, JDH

05-08-2002, 06:15 PM	#2
Brandon Metcalf Guest Posts: n/a	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? I would pay that for it if the condition was as listed (not to mention the extra goodies). It's a pretty common WWI peice. We have been discussing Erfurts lately so you might want to scroll down and have a look. I would get some advice from some of the experts here at the forum (One of which I am not)! But I would buy it if it's as listed! Hope This Helps!,Brandon

05-08-2002, 06:23 PM	#3
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? If it is as listed, it is a bargain!! Lonnie

05-08-2002, 06:48 PM	#4
tom collins Guest Posts: n/a	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? you'd be lucky to get it under $1000. all matching at 90% with holster will run it up there.

05-08-2002, 08:50 PM	#5
tom User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 269 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Hi JDH, The critical component in this all matching Erfurt is, believe it or not, the grip screws. Erfurt grip screws were proofed on the exterior rounded surface parallel to the screw driver slot. If the grip screws ain't proofed, the gun is not matching and it becomes a garden variety Erfurt. The good news is that at $ 550 or so, which is what the piece costs when you back out the holster and mag, its still a pretty attractive offer. Hope this helps, Tom

05-08-2002, 08:51 PM	#6
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? If you don't want it send it my way. I paid $625 for a 1918 Erfurt, non matching, non import, no holster, decent ++ condition, took a lot of work to get it to shoot at all, I've probably got $725 in it counting a repo holster. RK

05-08-2002, 08:55 PM	#7
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Grip screws proofed? That's a new one for me. I know you are serious about collecting or there would be a question in my mind. Are Erfurts the only ones? Let me know what the proofs look like. RK

05-08-2002, 09:00 PM	#8
tom User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 269 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? The correct, matching grip screws for ALL Erfurt pieces is a Gothic W (Wilhelm) with a surmounted crown. If these ain't there, your Erfurt is not a matching gun...and most AIN'T there. Tom

05-08-2002, 09:14 PM	#9
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Thanks, as time goes on I feel the need to leave the collecting to folks like you and stay in the shooter arena. Too many ways to go wrong. One of the biggest things I see consistently is that most dealers either are not informed about Lugers or are purposely misleading in their sales advertisements. Mr John Smith at pawnshop AAA in Redbank Ala has no idea how to disassemble & verify what he will call "matching" when he puts it up on GA or AA or in the paper. Are Erfurts the only ones so marked? RK RK

05-08-2002, 09:20 PM	#10
tom collins Guest Posts: n/a	screwed or not screwed... someone out there is willing to pay $1000 plus for that all matching, 90% plus original erfurt and holster....with or without the matched screws. trust me.

05-08-2002, 09:25 PM	#11
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: screwed or not screwed... The scan doesn't show the grip screw good enough to make out the inspection stamp, but you get the idea. http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/Erfurt.jpg

05-08-2002, 09:30 PM	#12
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 477 Thanked 515 Times in 128 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Yea - Erfurts were the only ones with grip screws that were so marked. As for collecting vs. shooting - hmmmm... Find a variation that you want to focus on - then read, read some more, read a little more, then research (yes - actually "research" ) and ask a lot of questions. There are still a lot of "gems" out there waiting to be discovered by the collector.... It's an interesting time in Luger collecting, as many original VET Lugers are showing up, offered by the surviving families and their estates. Just MHO....

05-08-2002, 09:45 PM	#13
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Re: screwed or not screwed... Its amazing to me that there are mint, ALL matching w/2 magazines and holster pre WWI,WWI, Interim, & WWII Lugers out there after two World Wars and 10,000 people swapping parts on them. Collectors, you must be either focused to the degree of a laser in your diligence or completely out of your heads in this non ending search for the holy grail. I understand your lack of tolerance for parts doctors. RK

05-08-2002, 10:11 PM	#14
Greg User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southern U.S. Posts: 181 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Simson's also have their distinctive proofs on the screws.

05-08-2002, 10:12 PM	#15
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,020 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,173 Times in 1,701 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? Probably shouldn't wade in on this one...but. Not having proofed grip screws does not reduce and otherwise matching Erfurt to "garden variety". Come on guys, these are warhorses. A nice matching Erfurt with replaced grip screws might,and I emphasize might,reduce the price by $20 or so IMO. Would you pass up a bargan on a new car because the floor mats were dirty?

05-08-2002, 10:15 PM	#16
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 477 Thanked 515 Times in 128 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? You are right - I forgot all about those..!!! Sorry about that (can you tell I don't have any Simson Lugers?? ).. Great catch!

05-08-2002, 11:37 PM	#17
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? I believe a lot of the 1917-18 Erfurts did not have the grip screws proofed. Lonnie

05-08-2002, 11:50 PM	#18
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	I agree with Lonnie My 99% 1917 Erfurt rig with TWO MATCHING MAGS, near mint brown holster and proofed tool is proofed in every conceivable place except the grip screws.

05-09-2002, 07:47 AM	#19
Marvin User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Upstate S.C. Posts: 1,132 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: 1918 Erfurt value? What John said is so right; that if a person is going to collect Lugers, they should concentrate on one type, and READ anyhthing they can find on that variety! There are so many variations, time period variations, police, military, navy, etc. it is almost impossible to keep up with them all. I try to stay with the WWI pistols, but I have recently gotten interested in the Weimar Police Lugers. I have a couple, but still need to read more and learn from others on this Forum that know more than I do. Being armed with knowledge, you won't get taken. I also stay with the more common Lugers; the rare stuff is the ones you can get taken on very quick unless you know what you are doing. Just an opinion. Marvin AMMOMAN

05-09-2002, 09:35 AM	#20
Tom Heller Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Proofed grip screws Most Erfurt PO8s prior to 1917 with have the crown over a letter INSPECTORS mark on the grip screws that you find on all other Erfurt parts. This pratice will discontinued sometime around 1917. Most all Simson PO8s will also have the E/6 or E/33 inspectors markings on their grip screws. Tom h