Why Are There so Fewew imports Markings on our Lugers

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 02:47 PM

I had at one time over 30 and never Seen one, except on my Russian Nagant!! Why do so few occur! How do the affect the guns value lately? ~ Eric

spangy · 06-09-2021, 03:18 PM

Myself I don't like guns with import marks ... turns me off big time.

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 04:10 PM

Its a useless luger tattoo that Lasts Forever!!

mrerick · 06-09-2021, 05:49 PM

Since collectible Lugers are as close to original factory state as possible, I don't like import marking on my Luger either.

I do have some Swiss Lugers that have import markings - mainly because most of these became available after the import laws required them. They are thankfully discrete.

Early on, some were marked under the grips. ATF eventually forced them to be marked in a visible place.

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 06:21 PM

Brad Simpson purchased a laser machine that engraves the info in a small less obvious place!

Edward Tinker · 06-09-2021, 06:55 PM

I would say that import marked lugers are not uncommon, but remember, most of what you bought Eric were all collector grade.
I have bought a couple of Simson's that are import marked, I simply wanted them and dated Simsons are harder to find. I knew what I was buying and it was ok.

In the big picture, I think hating import markings is silly, its another step in that lugers history, but like said above, I prefer them not having import markings, as their value will always be less.

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 07:28 PM

We said and explained!

schutzen-jager · 06-09-2021, 07:29 PM

many were vet bring backs from two world wars + others were imported prior to Dec. 1968 - size = position of import marks were changed by ATF regulation many times over the years - import marks do not bother me much , they are a p[art of guns history + are not looked down on as much now as in years gone by -

sdmark777 · 06-09-2021, 07:56 PM

I call bullsh*&! When it comes to collector quality Lugers, importer marks are definitely a killer. Sure, if you can't find it any other way and want it anyway like Ed stated, or it is a shooter, you may choose one with importer marks. But then that is exactly what you have and nothing will bring that to the value or desirability of an original unmolested collector Luger, period. IMHO if it has an importer mark it IS definitely looked down upon.

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 08:15 PM

Why not place a marker on our arm that hold the gun?

cirelaw · 06-09-2021, 08:57 PM

I must admit I bought a Russian Negant with import dealer markings the same as below~! Does this apply to rifles? There was a time that this certficate would do!

sdmark777 · 06-09-2021, 09:54 PM

Well, Russian SKS rifles were imported in bulk with importer marks by the boatload. But like your Nagant revolver, that is how most got to the USA in more recent post 1968 times. Different story with most of the collector Lugers, other than VOPO's and 70's Mausers.
In fact when they brought boat loads of Chinese SKS rifles of Vietnam vintage into the USA a few years back, it had a negative effect on those Vet bring back SKS's that were already here. Why? Because they brought in so many at once, that numerous SKS's were not stamped with the importer as they were supposed to be. The importers and distributors caught on to this and culled out all the unmarked SKS rifles. So now, it is only certain to be a Vet bring back SKS if you have the GI bring back paper. This lowered the value of Vet bring backs that don't have papers. I know, because I acquired two SKS Vet bring backs long before the mass importation. But I have no papers.

One was even captured unissued! I bought it from the Marine who took it out of the crate after they hit an enemy convoy.

Heinz · 06-11-2021, 06:53 PM

IF you want to avoid import marks you are restricting yourself to the pool of guns imported before 1969. We, luger collectors, are an odd bunch and put a lot of evaluation into marks that were applied well after the luger was manufactured. Some of the marks are even applied in a god-awful haphazard fashion, yet we value them. We are now faced with a new government-required marking and some want to say that mark takes it completely out of the collector category. But this does not apply to British proof marks? Finish unit marks? Abercrombie and Fitch? Strange. I could understand a slight decrease in value. I recently bought two S&W revolvers with discreet import marks from Simpson Ltd. I paid a little less and I find them interesting, along with their german proof marks.

Stu · 06-13-2021, 09:09 AM

I've had a couple so discrete they're almost invisible. CAI 'billboard' markings destroy the aesthetics of any gun, in my opinion.

The reality is that some peoples budgets make 'collector' grade guns unobtainable, so I won't look down on a fellow enthusiast just because his guns have import marks.

cirelaw · 06-13-2021, 10:56 AM

What was the REAL reason for these markings?

schutzen-jager · 06-13-2021, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cirelaw

What was the REAL reason for these markings?

gun control act of 1968 - ATF wanted to know which importers sold the most firearms being used in crimes so they could be targeted for violations -

06-09-2021, 02:47 PM	#1
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Why Are There so Fewew imports Markings on our Lugers I had at one time over 30 and never Seen one, except on my Russian Nagant!! Why do so few occur! How do the affect the guns value lately? ~ Eric

06-09-2021, 03:18 PM	#2
spangy Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 607 Thanks: 2,984 Thanked 1,047 Times in 422 Posts	Myself I don't like guns with import marks ... turns me off big time. __________________ Whoever said that "money can't buy you happiness" never bought a Luger. WTB - Take Down Lever & Trigger Plate (#90) for an Imperial Artillery.

06-09-2021, 05:49 PM	#4
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,900 Thanks: 1,370 Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts	Since collectible Lugers are as close to original factory state as possible, I don't like import marking on my Luger either. I do have some Swiss Lugers that have import markings - mainly because most of these became available after the import laws required them. They are thankfully discrete. Early on, some were marked under the grips. ATF eventually forced them to be marked in a visible place. __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

06-09-2021, 07:29 PM	#8
schutzen-jager User Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: peoples republic of New Jersey Posts: 187 Thanks: 208 Thanked 187 Times in 86 Posts	Jmho many were vet bring backs from two world wars + others were imported prior to Dec. 1968 - size = position of import marks were changed by ATF regulation many times over the years - import marks do not bother me much , they are a p[art of guns history + are not looked down on as much now as in years gone by -

06-09-2021, 08:57 PM	#11
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	I must admit I bought a Russian Negant with import dealer markings the same as below~! Does this apply to rifles? There was a time that this certficate would do! Attached Thumbnails Attached Images

06-09-2021, 04:10 PM	#3
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Its a useless luger tattoo that Lasts Forever!!

06-09-2021, 06:21 PM	#5
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Brad Simpson purchased a laser machine that engraves the info in a small less obvious place!

06-09-2021, 06:55 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	I would say that import marked lugers are not uncommon, but remember, most of what you bought Eric were all collector grade. I have bought a couple of Simson's that are import marked, I simply wanted them and dated Simsons are harder to find. I knew what I was buying and it was ok. In the big picture, I think hating import markings is silly, its another step in that lugers history, but like said above, I prefer them not having import markings, as their value will always be less.

06-09-2021, 07:28 PM	#7
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	We said and explained!

06-09-2021, 07:56 PM	#9
sdmark777 User Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 281 Thanks: 656 Thanked 663 Times in 169 Posts	I call bullsh*&! When it comes to collector quality Lugers, importer marks are definitely a killer. Sure, if you can't find it any other way and want it anyway like Ed stated, or it is a shooter, you may choose one with importer marks. But then that is exactly what you have and nothing will bring that to the value or desirability of an original unmolested collector Luger, period. IMHO if it has an importer mark it IS definitely looked down upon.

06-09-2021, 08:15 PM	#10
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Why not place a marker on our arm that hold the gun?

06-09-2021, 09:54 PM	#12
sdmark777 User Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 281 Thanks: 656 Thanked 663 Times in 169 Posts	Well, Russian SKS rifles were imported in bulk with importer marks by the boatload. But like your Nagant revolver, that is how most got to the USA in more recent post 1968 times. Different story with most of the collector Lugers, other than VOPO's and 70's Mausers. In fact when they brought boat loads of Chinese SKS rifles of Vietnam vintage into the USA a few years back, it had a negative effect on those Vet bring back SKS's that were already here. Why? Because they brought in so many at once, that numerous SKS's were not stamped with the importer as they were supposed to be. The importers and distributors caught on to this and culled out all the unmarked SKS rifles. So now, it is only certain to be a Vet bring back SKS if you have the GI bring back paper. This lowered the value of Vet bring backs that don't have papers. I know, because I acquired two SKS Vet bring backs long before the mass importation. But I have no papers. One was even captured unissued! I bought it from the Marine who took it out of the crate after they hit an enemy convoy. Attached Thumbnails

06-11-2021, 06:53 PM	#13
Heinz User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greenville SC Posts: 1,004 Thanks: 377 Thanked 410 Times in 180 Posts	IF you want to avoid import marks you are restricting yourself to the pool of guns imported before 1969. We, luger collectors, are an odd bunch and put a lot of evaluation into marks that were applied well after the luger was manufactured. Some of the marks are even applied in a god-awful haphazard fashion, yet we value them. We are now faced with a new government-required marking and some want to say that mark takes it completely out of the collector category. But this does not apply to British proof marks? Finish unit marks? Abercrombie and Fitch? Strange. I could understand a slight decrease in value. I recently bought two S&W revolvers with discreet import marks from Simpson Ltd. I paid a little less and I find them interesting, along with their german proof marks.

06-13-2021, 09:09 AM	#14
Stu User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Atlanta GA Posts: 451 Thanks: 4 Thanked 25 Times in 16 Posts	I've had a couple so discrete they're almost invisible. CAI 'billboard' markings destroy the aesthetics of any gun, in my opinion. The reality is that some peoples budgets make 'collector' grade guns unobtainable, so I won't look down on a fellow enthusiast just because his guns have import marks.

06-13-2021, 10:56 AM	#15
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	What was the REAL reason for these markings?