New (to me) Erfurt 1918 shoots high

Margana · 11-01-2008, 04:42 PM

Hello, I bought this Erfurt 1918 to add to my collection of military sidearms and long guns. I enjoy shooting these arms and not just storing them. I bought this with matching SNs as I figured it was not that much more than paying for a mix-master and who knows, maybe I will have to sell this one day (although my collection of guns numbers in the 40 odd range so that's not likely to happen anytime soon).

I took this gun out and from bench rest, at 50 feet using 115 gr and 124 gr RN ammo found that it would shoot about 6 inches high. Doing a search on this forum I found that shooting high for the P08 seems to be the norm. I guess the P08 is "old school" where you took shots at the enemy from a distance (hence the rifle stock and long barrelled artillary versions) whereas now the military sidearm is the last weapon of choice (next to your knife).

Anyway, I would like to shoot this without holding the point of aim so gosh darn low. The front sight measured .22 inches above the top base of the dove tail. I added a bit of epoxy and it measures now .24 inches which has corrected the POI considerably (the idea of epoxy is so I could burn it off to restore the original configuration).

I noticed Numrich has P.38 sights in a variety of sizes (I read the dovetail is the same with the P08). So I ordered a .23 height and a .255 height P.38 sight). I suppose I could always simply replace the original Luger sight should I wish to sell it (or give the sight to the buyer).

Has anyone else swapped out a P08 sight for a P.38?

I read that there were 3 sizes to the Luger front blade, but under Luger parts I see only one blade listed.

Anybody with a taller P08 front sight for sale?

Karl · 11-01-2008, 07:44 PM

Margana,

You are on track. If I recall, the Luger sights were designed for a 50 meter point of aim. I don't know anything about the "three sizes" of Luger front sights. I have heard/read that the taller P-38 front sight has the same dovetail size as the Luger and will be interested in your follow up experience with it. I have used a Brownell's front sight blank to fabricate sights for two of my Luger shooters. It is a lot of work to start with a blank and if the P-38 sight is a satisfactory solution I will be glad to know. As long as you keep the original front sight I do not think that this will detract from the collector value of your Luger. However, the general wear and possible breakage of numbered parts is another matter. KFS

Margana · 11-01-2008, 09:03 PM

OK I went to my (handgun) safe and fetched out the New Model P-38/P-1 which has a modern 2 dot (one over the other) sight. The front blade is much thicker than the P-38 1942 Spreewerk that my Dad brought back from WW2. The original P-38 still has a thicker blade than the P08 and a more "U" shaped rear sight than the "V" notch of the P08. the modern P-1 has a square rear sight.

I did order the "non white dot" blade for the P08 from Numrich. I will likely need to grind the blade to a sharper point, but possibly I could use the blade as is. The P-38 front blade does not have quite the pyramid shape of the P08.

Sieger · 11-02-2008, 04:48 PM

Hi:

A six o'clock hold at a standard 25 yard pistol target gets me right in the X ring with standard velocity ammo with a Luger.

I shoot a lot and don't mind the low hold, as actually, it allows for better sight alignment, etc.

Sieger

alanint · 11-02-2008, 06:42 PM

I am a little confused as adding height to a front sight LOWERS the point of impact of the bullet, not raises it.
There are only two options to raise the point of impact on a fixed sight firearm;
Raise the rear sight
Lower the front sight

alanint · 11-02-2008, 06:45 PM

Duh,

Never mind, you ARE trying to lower point of impact.
Sorry

Margana · 11-03-2008, 01:40 AM

That's OK one of the stupid mistakes I made was to grind the shoulder of the rear sight of a 1917 US Army rifle down on the RIGHT as it shot too far RIGHT. For some stupid reason, I was thinking RIGHT when I know LEFT. As it turns out one of the most common law suits in Orthopedics is operating on the wrong side extremity....So being "smart" has nothing to do with knowing your right from your left!

Vlim · 11-03-2008, 11:36 AM

Margana, you are almost left, eh, right

Problems establishing left from right, as well as other little comparison problems (like short and long hands on a clock) are some of the perculiarities that go together with a high IQ.

So actually being "smart" HAS to do with confusing your right from your left...Just not in a way one would expect

Margana · 11-26-2008, 02:17 AM

Well, I finally got the P-38 sights from e-gun parts....I found that the P.38 (non white dot) front sight was the best to bring the POI to the desired setting. I did use a grinder to make the front sight narrower. I also had to gently file the front sight at the dove tail contact area a very light amount in order to drift it in without damage....I also used my grinder to shape the blade to look a bit closer to the P 08....

11-01-2008, 04:42 PM	#1
Margana User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Portland, OR Metro Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	New (to me) Erfurt 1918 shoots high Hello, I bought this Erfurt 1918 to add to my collection of military sidearms and long guns. I enjoy shooting these arms and not just storing them. I bought this with matching SNs as I figured it was not that much more than paying for a mix-master and who knows, maybe I will have to sell this one day (although my collection of guns numbers in the 40 odd range so that's not likely to happen anytime soon). I took this gun out and from bench rest, at 50 feet using 115 gr and 124 gr RN ammo found that it would shoot about 6 inches high. Doing a search on this forum I found that shooting high for the P08 seems to be the norm. I guess the P08 is "old school" where you took shots at the enemy from a distance (hence the rifle stock and long barrelled artillary versions) whereas now the military sidearm is the last weapon of choice (next to your knife). Anyway, I would like to shoot this without holding the point of aim so gosh darn low. The front sight measured .22 inches above the top base of the dove tail. I added a bit of epoxy and it measures now .24 inches which has corrected the POI considerably (the idea of epoxy is so I could burn it off to restore the original configuration). I noticed Numrich has P.38 sights in a variety of sizes (I read the dovetail is the same with the P08). So I ordered a .23 height and a .255 height P.38 sight). I suppose I could always simply replace the original Luger sight should I wish to sell it (or give the sight to the buyer). Has anyone else swapped out a P08 sight for a P.38? I read that there were 3 sizes to the Luger front blade, but under Luger parts I see only one blade listed. Anybody with a taller P08 front sight for sale?

11-01-2008, 07:44 PM	#2
Karl Lifer - Twice Over Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Savannah Posts: 514 Thanks: 0 Thanked 239 Times in 111 Posts	Margana, You are on track. If I recall, the Luger sights were designed for a 50 meter point of aim. I don't know anything about the "three sizes" of Luger front sights. I have heard/read that the taller P-38 front sight has the same dovetail size as the Luger and will be interested in your follow up experience with it. I have used a Brownell's front sight blank to fabricate sights for two of my Luger shooters. It is a lot of work to start with a blank and if the P-38 sight is a satisfactory solution I will be glad to know. As long as you keep the original front sight I do not think that this will detract from the collector value of your Luger. However, the general wear and possible breakage of numbered parts is another matter. KFS

11-01-2008, 09:03 PM	#3
Margana User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Portland, OR Metro Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	OK I went to my (handgun) safe and fetched out the New Model P-38/P-1 which has a modern 2 dot (one over the other) sight. The front blade is much thicker than the P-38 1942 Spreewerk that my Dad brought back from WW2. The original P-38 still has a thicker blade than the P08 and a more "U" shaped rear sight than the "V" notch of the P08. the modern P-1 has a square rear sight. I did order the "non white dot" blade for the P08 from Numrich. I will likely need to grind the blade to a sharper point, but possibly I could use the blade as is. The P-38 front blade does not have quite the pyramid shape of the P08.

11-02-2008, 04:48 PM	#4
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,575 Thanks: 2,124 Thanked 400 Times in 249 Posts	Hi: A six o'clock hold at a standard 25 yard pistol target gets me right in the X ring with standard velocity ammo with a Luger. I shoot a lot and don't mind the low hold, as actually, it allows for better sight alignment, etc. Sieger

11-02-2008, 06:42 PM	#5
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	I am a little confused as adding height to a front sight LOWERS the point of impact of the bullet, not raises it. There are only two options to raise the point of impact on a fixed sight firearm; Raise the rear sight Lower the front sight

11-02-2008, 06:45 PM	#6
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Duh, Never mind, you ARE trying to lower point of impact. Sorry

11-03-2008, 01:40 AM	#7
Margana User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Portland, OR Metro Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	That's OK one of the stupid mistakes I made was to grind the shoulder of the rear sight of a 1917 US Army rifle down on the RIGHT as it shot too far RIGHT. For some stupid reason, I was thinking RIGHT when I know LEFT. As it turns out one of the most common law suits in Orthopedics is operating on the wrong side extremity....So being "smart" has nothing to do with knowing your right from your left!

11-03-2008, 11:36 AM	#8
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,034 Thanks: 1,020 Thanked 3,882 Times in 1,186 Posts	Margana, you are almost left, eh, right Problems establishing left from right, as well as other little comparison problems (like short and long hands on a clock) are some of the perculiarities that go together with a high IQ. So actually being "smart" HAS to do with confusing your right from your left...Just not in a way one would expect

11-26-2008, 02:17 AM	#9
Margana User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Portland, OR Metro Posts: 10 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Well, I finally got the P-38 sights from e-gun parts....I found that the P.38 (non white dot) front sight was the best to bring the POI to the desired setting. I did use a grinder to make the front sight narrower. I also had to gently file the front sight at the dove tail contact area a very light amount in order to drift it in without damage....I also used my grinder to shape the blade to look a bit closer to the P 08....