1902 Carbine - Page 4

Hueydriver · 01-22-2008, 04:21 PM

I'd get perty boring if all we did was agree.

A little spicy disagreement makes for more fun than a barrel o monkey's.

Also thanks for the great lesson's on the functions of the luger action.

Jesse

Pete Ebbink · 01-22-2008, 04:29 PM

I think if 2 collectors are going to roll in the mud about some gun disagreement, they should at least be in bikini's...

Knowing both Albert and Ron...that would be something to behold...

Imperial Arms · 01-22-2008, 04:50 PM

Pete,

Big boys would need to wear those skimpy underwear (what male strippers wear) if we are going to 'roll in the mud', and not bikini's. I'm talking about those G-strings (?) that can 'behold' an 8" barrel!!!

ROTF,
Albert

StarOfTheWest · 01-22-2008, 08:48 PM

*shakes imaginary Etch a Sketch to remove mental image of Albert in a G string*

There, that's better.

Y'know, years ago, some rather stuffy folks protested about the babes in skimpy bikinis posed next to the gorgeous hot rods in the car magazines.
They said the babes had nothing to do with the cars and had no place in the photo layouts.
Someone else suggested that next month, the actual owners of the cars pose next to the cars instead.
They did.
In swimsuits.
Bad idea.

The babes were back in the following issue, much to the relief of all.

I think this may apply to gun collectors as well.

cirelaw · 01-23-2008, 07:07 PM

Even Doctors can disagee on a prognosis!!

cirelaw · 01-23-2008, 07:10 PM

'Albert in a 'G' string' I never came up with more scary images while in my coma !!

Edward Tinker · 01-23-2008, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tom A
"No name calling, hair pulling, or rolling about in the mud"

Shucks, that takes 95% of the fun out of it.

Tom A

Saturday night at the Armstrong house

Pete Ebbink · 01-24-2008, 07:04 PM

9 mm M1906 carbine with reported Spanish markings on this old auction site...about 1/3 down the page....with a C suffix after the SN :

http://www.scotarms.co.uk/catalogues/656.htm

Here is the text :

" Lot No. 500 An IMPORTANT and probably UNIQUE Presentation 9mm Model 1906 (New Model) Luger carbine, Serial No. 26506C (matching) with exceptional matching number shoulder stock. The heavy tapered barrel with ramped foresight, standard 300M tangent rearsight and gold inlaid in the German "Jugendstil" (Art Nouveau) pattern with an angel surrounded by scrolling foliage and inscribed in Spanish - RECUERDO DEL INVENTOR Y DE LA MANUFACTURA D.W.M. BERLIN 9 JULIO 1912 - (Souverier of the inventor and the manufacturer D.W.M. Berlin 9 July 1912) over the chamber. The toggle with D.W.M. motif grip safety and chequered walnut grips. Complete with its original superbly figured stock being cut out of the heart of a burr walnut showing a magnificent flame pattern on both sides. The crown over 'N' German commercial proofing shows the gun to have been finished after this new nitro proof mark was introduced in 1911, despite the serial number indicating production, possibly originally as a prototype ca.1906. Accompanied by a letter from the Argentine Ministry of Justice stating the pistol to have been the personal property of Dr. Roque Sanez Pena (President of Argentina 1910-1914), and confirming no State interest in the weapon. This is both a mechanically exceptionally rare carbine variant and an historically important presentation piece from Georg Luger himself to the President of Argentina. "

(Sorry...this is the best I could do with the small, single jpeg the auction site offered...)

Imperial Arms · 01-24-2008, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cirelaw
'Albert in a 'G' string' I never came up with more scary images while in my coma !!

Eric, you look very funny yourself in some of the images you had previously sent me during your "Wild on E! (Eric)" celebrations!! What a frightening sight for me!

You came out of a coma, I fell into one!!

Albert

Navy · 01-24-2008, 07:36 PM

Pete,

I think you will agree with me that this was NOT a production line piece.

Tom A

Imperial Arms · 01-24-2008, 07:54 PM

Pete,

Anything coming out of South America and going via the UK should be taken with a grain of salt.

It is interesting to note that this carbine is a new model carbine (with normal toggles) which I would have expected to appear later (maybe around the 1920 period) instead of 1911-12 bearing in mind that other reported 9 mm carbines have dished toggles. If this carbine would be considered authentic, it would mean that the 9 mm carbines were offered in two random configurations. Can this be true while the original M1902 carbines had a standard configuration?

It is also interesting that this 'presentation' carbine (from the inventor) has a C-suffix serial number without a 'GL' hallmark. In addition, the golden decoration on the barrel and better wood without a 'GL' is somewhat unusual, but I would not count it out completely.

Whoever bought this carbine should obtain a second or third opinion.

Albert

Ron Wood · 01-24-2008, 08:43 PM

Did you look at some of the other Lugers in that auction? Lugers with chamber crests from Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay and Serbia, and a presentation short-frame Navy! The mother lode of ultra rare Lugers. It boggles the mind. It brings to mind the series of articles in Gun Report by Charlie Kenyon on the South American crested Lugers. Boy, wouldn't I like to have a case full of those.

Heinz · 01-24-2008, 09:00 PM

Ron, What crest can I put on them for you?

Ron Wood · 01-24-2008, 10:36 PM

How about channeling Al Capp and pulling up the royal crest of Lower Slobbovia?

alvin · 02-08-2008, 06:31 PM

One paragraph in "Luger Story" (Walter, 2001) captured my attention. Page 128:

"Old Models had stopped in the region of 25500. They reached the low 70000s by August 1914; after 1909, however, a few 9mm carbines and commercial derivatives of the Pistole 1908 were also included."

The book did not reveal the source of the information. Nor the detail of those carbines. Sounds like New Model 9mm in the context.

01-22-2008, 08:48 PM	#64
StarOfTheWest User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: East Texas, CSA Posts: 208 Thanks: 81 Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts	shakes imaginary Etch a Sketch to remove mental image of Albert in a G string There, that's better. Y'know, years ago, some rather stuffy folks protested about the babes in skimpy bikinis posed next to the gorgeous hot rods in the car magazines. They said the babes had nothing to do with the cars and had no place in the photo layouts. Someone else suggested that next month, the actual owners of the cars pose next to the cars instead. They did. In swimsuits. Bad idea. The babes were back in the following issue, much to the relief of all. I think this may apply to gun collectors as well. __________________ Sorry, I take that back. I have no problem with the horse you rode in on.

01-24-2008, 08:43 PM	#72
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Did you look at some of the other Lugers in that auction? Lugers with chamber crests from Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay and Serbia, and a presentation short-frame Navy! The mother lode of ultra rare Lugers. It boggles the mind. It brings to mind the series of articles in Gun Report by Charlie Kenyon on the South American crested Lugers. Boy, wouldn't I like to have a case full of those. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-24-2008, 10:36 PM	#74
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	How about channeling Al Capp and pulling up the royal crest of Lower Slobbovia? __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-22-2008, 04:21 PM	#61
Hueydriver User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: North Dakota Posts: 66 Thanks: 7 Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts	I'd get perty boring if all we did was agree. A little spicy disagreement makes for more fun than a barrel o monkey's. Also thanks for the great lesson's on the functions of the luger action. Jesse

01-22-2008, 04:29 PM	#62
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	I think if 2 collectors are going to roll in the mud about some gun disagreement, they should at least be in bikini's... Knowing both Albert and Ron...that would be something to behold...

01-22-2008, 04:50 PM	#63
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Pete, Big boys would need to wear those skimpy underwear (what male strippers wear) if we are going to 'roll in the mud', and not bikini's. I'm talking about those G-strings (?) that can 'behold' an 8" barrel!!! ROTF, Albert

01-23-2008, 07:07 PM	#65
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Even Doctors can disagee on a prognosis!!

01-23-2008, 07:10 PM	#66
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	'Albert in a 'G' string' I never came up with more scary images while in my coma !!

01-24-2008, 07:04 PM	#68
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	9 mm M1906 carbine with reported Spanish markings on this old auction site...about 1/3 down the page....with a C suffix after the SN : http://www.scotarms.co.uk/catalogues/656.htm Here is the text : " Lot No. 500 An IMPORTANT and probably UNIQUE Presentation 9mm Model 1906 (New Model) Luger carbine, Serial No. 26506C (matching) with exceptional matching number shoulder stock. The heavy tapered barrel with ramped foresight, standard 300M tangent rearsight and gold inlaid in the German "Jugendstil" (Art Nouveau) pattern with an angel surrounded by scrolling foliage and inscribed in Spanish - RECUERDO DEL INVENTOR Y DE LA MANUFACTURA D.W.M. BERLIN 9 JULIO 1912 - (Souverier of the inventor and the manufacturer D.W.M. Berlin 9 July 1912) over the chamber. The toggle with D.W.M. motif grip safety and chequered walnut grips. Complete with its original superbly figured stock being cut out of the heart of a burr walnut showing a magnificent flame pattern on both sides. The crown over 'N' German commercial proofing shows the gun to have been finished after this new nitro proof mark was introduced in 1911, despite the serial number indicating production, possibly originally as a prototype ca.1906. Accompanied by a letter from the Argentine Ministry of Justice stating the pistol to have been the personal property of Dr. Roque Sanez Pena (President of Argentina 1910-1914), and confirming no State interest in the weapon. This is both a mechanically exceptionally rare carbine variant and an historically important presentation piece from Georg Luger himself to the President of Argentina. " (Sorry...this is the best I could do with the small, single jpeg the auction site offered...)

01-24-2008, 07:36 PM	#70
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	Pete, I think you will agree with me that this was NOT a production line piece. Tom A

01-24-2008, 07:54 PM	#71
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Pete, Anything coming out of South America and going via the UK should be taken with a grain of salt. It is interesting to note that this carbine is a new model carbine (with normal toggles) which I would have expected to appear later (maybe around the 1920 period) instead of 1911-12 bearing in mind that other reported 9 mm carbines have dished toggles. If this carbine would be considered authentic, it would mean that the 9 mm carbines were offered in two random configurations. Can this be true while the original M1902 carbines had a standard configuration? It is also interesting that this 'presentation' carbine (from the inventor) has a C-suffix serial number without a 'GL' hallmark. In addition, the golden decoration on the barrel and better wood without a 'GL' is somewhat unusual, but I would not count it out completely. Whoever bought this carbine should obtain a second or third opinion. Albert

01-24-2008, 09:00 PM	#73
Heinz User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Greenville SC Posts: 1,004 Thanks: 377 Thanked 410 Times in 180 Posts	Ron, What crest can I put on them for you?

02-08-2008, 06:31 PM	#75
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	One paragraph in "Luger Story" (Walter, 2001) captured my attention. Page 128: "Old Models had stopped in the region of 25500. They reached the low 70000s by August 1914; after 1909, however, a few 9mm carbines and commercial derivatives of the Pistole 1908 were also included." The book did not reveal the source of the information. Nor the detail of those carbines. Sounds like New Model 9mm in the context.