Russian Lugers at Phoenix Investment Arms - Page 3

sheepherder · 11-12-2009, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imperial Arms

Rich,

You need to read up on the Bulgarian variations:

Well, it's really the Russian Contract Lugers I'm interested in right now...

There's a gun show in three weeks; I'll keep my eyes open...and my MasterCard handy...

sheepherder · 11-12-2009, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by postino

I...took a look at Phoenix, and they have...a 1906 Russian with Tula Arsenal proofs...

http://www.phoenixinvestmentarms.com.../827Russ06.htm

Josef at Phoenix writes - "...we will accept layaways of up to one year with at least 20% down and some activity occurring monthly to insure that after one year the sale is completed."

Hmmmm...That is enticing...

Ron Wood · 11-12-2009, 10:24 PM

Postino,
That may be enticing but you don’t get gun in hand until it is paid off and if you are not satisfied with the gun when you receive it, sorry about that …you are stuck with it. This is not exclusive to Phoenix, most if not all dealers have this policy for layaways.

Albert,
I will be brief. I will address our differences regarding the Russian Lugers at a later time. But for right now I want to remark about your repeated abuse of this and Jan Still’s forums. It is totally obvious that you have severe personal issues with Geoff Sturgess and Chuck Whittaker; you have repeatedly made that abundantly loud and clear. Regardless of what you think, I am not in allegiance with them and I owe them nothing. I possess the capacity to make my own decisions and observations. As a matter of fact I have been an object of their disapproval, but I do not persist in dredging it up time after time with off topic retribution. It is becoming tiresome that you use the forum venues to bad mouth these individuals. Get over it. It is particularly disturbing when you, perhaps inadvertantly, place your own comment "The owner of LOB is Charles Whittacker who is a loyal believer and supporter of Geoff Sturgess, who (GS) wants to be recognized as the 'Pope'", in a quote from Ed Tinker. You should, first of all, make sure you insert a quote correctly without editorial comment, and secondly keep your comments civil. If you have ordained Sturgess as "Pope", your attitude would then seem to infer that you hold yourself in an even higher position. Kindly address the individuals with whom you have a disagreement directly, not on these forums, and spare the members your personal grief and bad manners. Members that do not know about your personal hate of these individuals will take your unbridled disparagement of their opinions as fact when in truth they are mostly reflections of your problems and are only marginally objective at best. I will no longer stand idly by and let you vent your anger with terms like “morons” and “Land of Bull****”. Both the slanderous connotations and foul language are not appropriate for the discussions here. I am not the only one that finds your personal tirades objectionable, and I would hope that you can clean up your act and keep your reasoned arguments on track and leave personalities out of the discussion.

Vlim · 11-13-2009, 06:43 AM

Ron,

Well said. Let's try to keep our discussions civil and to the point. Personal grudges only help to cloud one's judgement.

What all theories (yes, theories) lack so far is proper, documented period evidence. I will suggest that those involved put more effort into obtaining more proof and less in their grumpy old men acts

Imperial Arms · 11-13-2009, 07:53 AM

Ron,

You are an excellent and intelligent writer and speaker as well as being a good 'politician'. Not every body in the collectors society understands what is going on in the background, and sadly some of these new collectors are becoming victims caused by the unethical acts and arrogance of a few. Some of these fools decide to make alliances to boost their recognition without realizing the stupidity of their mistakes. If they think that they can attack/condemn any item in my collection without any apparent reason, justification or strong proof, they better prepare for a storm. Those peasants have had their chance over the years to issue an apology to me, which would have made everything afterwards cool and friendly, but instead they decide to ignore their mistake which is fine with me. Any time I am wrong, I shall give an apology without it affecting my reputation. Collectors who know me well enjoy my friendship and I consider myself a pleasant gentleman. Using hard work and endless hours on the telephone since 25+ years, I have been able to build a modest collection without being rich, and I did not use titles, brains or 'flash/animation' to become an expert in the field.

I shall answer later the rest of your remarks. As far as I am concerned, we collectors are all the same and I do not need any titles such as 'Moderator', 'Patron' 'Life Time Member' etc to share my knowledge and enjoyment with other fellow collectors who may value or appreciate my input.

Respectively,
Albert

sheepherder · 11-13-2009, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imperial Arms

... As far as I am concerned, we collectors are all the same...

Just to clarify...I am not a collector...A "collection" by definition has a theme...The sub-forum heads here and better still [pun], the sub-forums at Jan Still's site are all excellent themes..."WW I Lugers"..."Imperial Lugers"..."Weimar Lugers"..."Artillery Lugers"...

I don't have a theme...I accumulate what I feel is an interesting item...Whether cigarette case lighters; knobbly looking pistols, prototype AR-15 clones; or Buck knives...If it looks interesting to me, I'll try to get at least one...(the closest I have to a "collection" is my 12 cigarette case lighters)...

I've owned 5 Lugers...Pretty much all different...No "theme"...

So I really don't care if it is called a "Russian Luger" or a "Bulgarian Luger" as long as we're all talking about the same thing...I would be interested in a "crossed rifles" crest Luger the same as I would a Portuguese Navy crest Luger, or American Eagle Luger...My interest would be in the crest...and whether it was a commercial contract or a military contract would not impact my interest...

Now it seems that anything with crossed rifles on the chamber is called a "Russian [Contract] Luger"...That is fine with me...I buy Kleenex that is not made by Kimberly-Clark, but everyone knows what it is...

Someone here has an avatar of three different chamber crests...Now that is cool...I would consider those three Lugers to be a "collection"...A small one, but with great potential...

Some day I may start a collection of chamber crested Lugers...Starting with a Russian Contract Luger...

Checking some of the prices from earlier in the year with what is being asked right now, it would seem that Albert's thesis on Russian Lugers has driven the prices up...for "Russian Lugers"...

Vlim · 11-13-2009, 09:13 AM

I'm still looking for a Mosin-Nagant with Crossed Lugers on the chamber

Imperial Arms · 11-13-2009, 10:19 AM

Well, at least, we all have a something that turns us on - starting with a 'Russian Luger', I guess.

S***, I still want one! - but I am going to call it by a better name - a M1906 Bulgarian Infantry Officers Luger. You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger'

Cheers,
Albert

Ron Smith · 11-13-2009, 10:33 AM

"Collectors who know me well enjoy my friendship and I consider myself a pleasant gentleman."

"You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger'"

gen·tle·man [jént’lmən]
(plural gen·tle·men [jént’lmən])
n
1. polite and cultured man: a cultured man who behaves with courtesy and thoughtfulness.

????

sheepherder · 11-13-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imperial Arms

...but I am going to call it by a better name - a M1906 Bulgarian Infantry Officers Luger. You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger'

A guy over in this discussion calls it a "Russian Luger"...Sounds like a knowledgeable gent...

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showpost...7&postcount=47

"...like what we see with the M1906 Portuguese Navy Lugers and the 'M1906 Russian Luger'..."

Imperial Arms · 11-13-2009, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Smith

"Collectors who know me well enjoy my friendship and I consider myself a pleasant gentleman."

"You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger'"

gen·tle·man [jént’lmən] - Bulgarian ?
(plural gen·tle·men [jént’lmən]) - Russian ?
n
1. polite and cultured man: a cultured man who behaves with courtesy and thoughtfulness.

????

HuntMaster · 11-13-2009, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlim

I'm still looking for a Mosin-Nagant with Crossed Lugers on the chamber

cirelaw · 11-13-2009, 07:51 PM

Man This is a corpse that needs to be buried!!

sheepherder · 11-13-2009, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cirelaw

Man This is a corpse that needs to be buried!!

The Russian Luger will live forever!!!

Decades after we all are dead, there will still be Russian Lugers on GB, GA, AA, Phoenix, LOB, RIA, etc...

Just as there are Enfield "Jungle Carbines", Mauser "Broomhandles", and "Schmeisser" MP-40's...

Doesn't matter if it's correct or not...It's what it's known as...to the world...

So we all might as well get used to it...

worldoftone · 11-13-2009, 08:49 PM

HA HA HA I have a "Broomhandle" downstairs, I had an Enfield "Jungle Carbine" in college and my dream as a kid was to get "Big Schmeisser" (my nickname for the MP-40)

WHADDAYA MEAN THEY DON'T EXIST?????????

- WOT

11-12-2009, 10:24 PM	#43
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,986 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,088 Times in 1,674 Posts	Postino, That may be enticing but you don’t get gun in hand until it is paid off and if you are not satisfied with the gun when you receive it, sorry about that …you are stuck with it. This is not exclusive to Phoenix, most if not all dealers have this policy for layaways. Albert, I will be brief. I will address our differences regarding the Russian Lugers at a later time. But for right now I want to remark about your repeated abuse of this and Jan Still’s forums. It is totally obvious that you have severe personal issues with Geoff Sturgess and Chuck Whittaker; you have repeatedly made that abundantly loud and clear. Regardless of what you think, I am not in allegiance with them and I owe them nothing. I possess the capacity to make my own decisions and observations. As a matter of fact I have been an object of their disapproval, but I do not persist in dredging it up time after time with off topic retribution. It is becoming tiresome that you use the forum venues to bad mouth these individuals. Get over it. It is particularly disturbing when you, perhaps inadvertantly, place your own comment "The owner of LOB is Charles Whittacker who is a loyal believer and supporter of Geoff Sturgess, who (GS) wants to be recognized as the 'Pope'", in a quote from Ed Tinker. You should, first of all, make sure you insert a quote correctly without editorial comment, and secondly keep your comments civil. If you have ordained Sturgess as "Pope", your attitude would then seem to infer that you hold yourself in an even higher position. Kindly address the individuals with whom you have a disagreement directly, not on these forums, and spare the members your personal grief and bad manners. Members that do not know about your personal hate of these individuals will take your unbridled disparagement of their opinions as fact when in truth they are mostly reflections of your problems and are only marginally objective at best. I will no longer stand idly by and let you vent your anger with terms like “morons” and “Land of Bull***”. Both the slanderous connotations and foul language are not appropriate for the discussions here. I am not the only one that finds your personal tirades objectionable, and I would hope that you can clean up your act and keep your reasoned arguments on track and leave personalities out of the discussion. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction Last edited by Ron Wood; 11-13-2009 at 12:22 AM.*

11-13-2009, 10:33 AM	#49
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	"Collectors who know me well enjoy my friendship and I consider myself a pleasant gentleman." "You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger'" gen·tle·man [jént’lmən] (plural gen·tle·men [jént’lmən]) n 1. polite and cultured man: a cultured man who behaves with courtesy and thoughtfulness. ???? __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

11-13-2009, 06:43 AM	#44
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	Ron, Well said. Let's try to keep our discussions civil and to the point. Personal grudges only help to cloud one's judgement. What all theories (yes, theories) lack so far is proper, documented period evidence. I will suggest that those involved put more effort into obtaining more proof and less in their grumpy old men acts

11-13-2009, 07:53 AM	#45
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Ron, You are an excellent and intelligent writer and speaker as well as being a good 'politician'. Not every body in the collectors society understands what is going on in the background, and sadly some of these new collectors are becoming victims caused by the unethical acts and arrogance of a few. Some of these fools decide to make alliances to boost their recognition without realizing the stupidity of their mistakes. If they think that they can attack/condemn any item in my collection without any apparent reason, justification or strong proof, they better prepare for a storm. Those peasants have had their chance over the years to issue an apology to me, which would have made everything afterwards cool and friendly, but instead they decide to ignore their mistake which is fine with me. Any time I am wrong, I shall give an apology without it affecting my reputation. Collectors who know me well enjoy my friendship and I consider myself a pleasant gentleman. Using hard work and endless hours on the telephone since 25+ years, I have been able to build a modest collection without being rich, and I did not use titles, brains or 'flash/animation' to become an expert in the field. I shall answer later the rest of your remarks. As far as I am concerned, we collectors are all the same and I do not need any titles such as 'Moderator', 'Patron' 'Life Time Member' etc to share my knowledge and enjoyment with other fellow collectors who may value or appreciate my input. Respectively, Albert

11-13-2009, 09:13 AM	#47
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,032 Thanks: 1,018 Thanked 3,873 Times in 1,184 Posts	I'm still looking for a Mosin-Nagant with Crossed Lugers on the chamber

11-13-2009, 10:19 AM	#48
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Well, at least, we all have a something that turns us on - starting with a 'Russian Luger', I guess. S***, I still want one! - but I am going to call it by a better name - a M1906 Bulgarian Infantry Officers Luger. You fairies can still call it a 'Russian Luger' Cheers, Albert

11-13-2009, 07:51 PM	#53
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Man This is a corpse that needs to be buried!!

11-13-2009, 08:49 PM	#55
worldoftone User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 81 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	HA HA HA I have a "Broomhandle" downstairs, I had an Enfield "Jungle Carbine" in college and my dream as a kid was to get "Big Schmeisser" (my nickname for the MP-40) WHADDAYA MEAN THEY DON'T EXIST????????? - WOT