To refinish or not that is my question? TED!

Doug G. · 08-01-2002, 11:27 AM

Ok, I have as you can see a 1918 Erfurt that has been reworked into a Police issued gun. The blue that is on it is obviously not original as it is blued inside. The only real bad parts are the reciever ring and barrel. The question then is due to the circle S rework mark should I mess with it? Gun is all matching including one mag. No pitting just thin old nasty blue. Comments. [img]confused.gif[/img]

Johnny Peppers · 08-01-2002, 12:33 PM

Doug,
I have a 1921/1920 that has had the sear safety and magazine safety added. It too has the circle S on the left side of the receiver. The pistol is in the original rust blue, in the white inside, and nice halos on the barrel serial number. I know the circle S has been attributed to being a Simson rework mark, but my pistol has no other proofs or acceptance marks other than what was applied at the time of manufacture. Does your pistol have any additional marks other than the circle S?
Just my opinion, but I would leave the finish of the pistol just as it is. Even though it has been refinished, it is a part of the pistols history.

Thor · 08-01-2002, 12:34 PM

I think this is a candidate due to the poor condition, it appears to have been restrawed (thumb safety too good) I can preserve the marking and make this gun look way better. Some books say Circle S meaning not known, some say Simson Rework. I am afraid my opinion may be biased so get more opinions before you leap. Let me know, I will watch this string to see others opinions.

Herb · 08-01-2002, 12:55 PM

According to Costanzo, page 190, example 110, says that the circled S indicates an early Simpson rework proof of DWM and Erfurt. It was used to indicate repair or rework of the pistol. Most were reworked for police use and are found on Lugers dated 1910 to 1918. Locations found are on the left barrel chamber, left breech block, right barrel and top of barrel.

Lugerlover · 08-01-2002, 03:52 PM

Doug,
I sent my 1918 Erfurt to Thor a few weeks ago, and it came back looking new. If you want a good looking shooter that you can be proud of, you can't go wrong with Thor.

Greg · 08-01-2002, 07:16 PM

Doug,

Just another vote for Thor! I'm sending him my 1913 Erfurt shooter tomorrow. I'm truly amazed at the work he has done and look forward to my "new" Erfurt when completed.

Greg

Don · 08-01-2002, 11:52 PM

I agree about Thor! There's no describing the sensation of seeing your gun when she comes back TRANSFORMED INTO A THING OF BEAUTY! He's done two for me so far, a 1917 DWM and a 1915 DWM Arty, and I'm hooked. I've been looking for several months for a suitable G Date or similar for him, and I've just bought one from Hugh Clark. Can hardly wait to send her off to Ted!

Thor · 08-05-2002, 08:11 PM

Starting on Greg and Doug's Erfurt LUGERS today!
A tale of two Lugers!! Hammer.....Hammer... <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" /> Blue..... <img src="graemlins/sleep.gif" border="0" alt="[sleep]" /> zzzzz.......Blue!! <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

unspellable · 08-05-2002, 08:33 PM

I have a 1936 Mauser VOPO that appears to be all matching and in very nice shape aside from the usual VOPO finish and grips. Doesn't look as if it needed refinishing, just the bureaucratic mindset, "We're supposed to refinish em so we refinish em."

How does this strike you guys as a candidate for one of Thor's beautification jobs? Or better left as is? It has two VOPO magazines numbered to the gun.

Thor · 08-05-2002, 09:04 PM

Two views on that one! It is......what it is...a VOPO! Some will say to keep it that way and I really cant argue with that! The other view is to make it look more like it did when it was made. Do you want it to look like a VOPO or like a Mauser. I have never turned down reworking on VOPOs but do consider them part of history! Your choice! I reworked a VOPO for one of the Luger forum members and it also had two matching mags. It is up to you! Let me know if I can help!

TBeardmore · 08-11-2002, 08:49 PM

Pardon my ignorance (I'm still the new guy on the block, so to speak). Would someone kindly define what a VOPO is?

(Very Old Perabellum Original?)

Thanks!
Tom

Frank · 08-11-2002, 09:22 PM

Hi Tom, welcome to the Luger Forum. VOPO is a short hand for Volkspolizei, or "Peoples Police". Usually used in reference to the East Germany and their rework of Lugers for use in the "VOPO".

Roadkill · 08-11-2002, 09:28 PM

VOPO is an abbreviation for Volkspolezi, the prior East German police. The East Germans took WWI/II Lugers and dip blued,rematched, and reissued them for police use until replaced by modern firearms. These were imported about five years ago and have almost reached a semi collector status in their own right. Most are considered prime candidates for restoration or kept as shooters. Initally they were about $325 - $400 but now are bringing higher prices. Welcome to the forum.

RK

Edward Tinker · 08-11-2002, 10:06 PM

Roadkill, good to see your name on the forum, I wish those VOPO's were coming in truckloads again! I was overseas when they came over, so I just caught the stories about them.

Maybe they'll discover a arms room full of Persian Artillerys and send them over to us? [img]wink.gif[/img]

crgkstnr · 08-13-2002, 05:12 PM

Thor · 08-13-2002, 11:22 PM

Doug, please see TLSS OUTGOING on your Erfurt Police. <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

08-01-2002, 11:27 AM	#1
Doug G. User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 713 Thanks: 1 Thanked 53 Times in 17 Posts	To refinish or not that is my question? TED! Ok, I have as you can see a 1918 Erfurt that has been reworked into a Police issued gun. The blue that is on it is obviously not original as it is blued inside. The only real bad parts are the reciever ring and barrel. The question then is due to the circle S rework mark should I mess with it? Gun is all matching including one mag. No pitting just thin old nasty blue. Comments. [img]confused.gif[/img] __________________ Suppose you were an idiot.....and suppose you were a member of Congress.....But I repeat myself" ~~ Mark Twain

08-01-2002, 12:34 PM	#3
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	I think this is a candidate due to the poor condition, it appears to have been restrawed (thumb safety too good) I can preserve the marking and make this gun look way better. Some books say Circle S meaning not known, some say Simson Rework. I am afraid my opinion may be biased so get more opinions before you leap. Let me know, I will watch this string to see others opinions. __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

08-01-2002, 12:55 PM	#4
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	According to Costanzo, page 190, example 110, says that the circled S indicates an early Simpson rework proof of DWM and Erfurt. It was used to indicate repair or rework of the pistol. Most were reworked for police use and are found on Lugers dated 1910 to 1918. Locations found are on the left barrel chamber, left breech block, right barrel and top of barrel. __________________ Utah, where gun control means a steady trigger pull

08-05-2002, 08:11 PM	#8
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Starting on Greg and Doug's Erfurt LUGERS today! A tale of two Lugers!! Hammer.....Hammer... <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" /> Blue..... <img src="graemlins/sleep.gif" border="0" alt="[sleep]" /> zzzzz.......Blue!! <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" /> __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

08-05-2002, 09:04 PM	#10
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Two views on that one! It is......what it is...a VOPO! Some will say to keep it that way and I really cant argue with that! The other view is to make it look more like it did when it was made. Do you want it to look like a VOPO or like a Mauser. I have never turned down reworking on VOPOs but do consider them part of history! Your choice! I reworked a VOPO for one of the Luger forum members and it also had two matching mags. It is up to you! Let me know if I can help! __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

08-01-2002, 12:33 PM	#2
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Doug, I have a 1921/1920 that has had the sear safety and magazine safety added. It too has the circle S on the left side of the receiver. The pistol is in the original rust blue, in the white inside, and nice halos on the barrel serial number. I know the circle S has been attributed to being a Simson rework mark, but my pistol has no other proofs or acceptance marks other than what was applied at the time of manufacture. Does your pistol have any additional marks other than the circle S? Just my opinion, but I would leave the finish of the pistol just as it is. Even though it has been refinished, it is a part of the pistols history.

08-01-2002, 03:52 PM	#5
Lugerlover User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 78 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Doug, I sent my 1918 Erfurt to Thor a few weeks ago, and it came back looking new. If you want a good looking shooter that you can be proud of, you can't go wrong with Thor.

08-01-2002, 07:16 PM	#6
Greg User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southern U.S. Posts: 181 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Doug, Just another vote for Thor! I'm sending him my 1913 Erfurt shooter tomorrow. I'm truly amazed at the work he has done and look forward to my "new" Erfurt when completed. Greg

08-01-2002, 11:52 PM	#7
Don User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 146 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I agree about Thor! There's no describing the sensation of seeing your gun when she comes back TRANSFORMED INTO A THING OF BEAUTY! He's done two for me so far, a 1917 DWM and a 1915 DWM Arty, and I'm hooked. I've been looking for several months for a suitable G Date or similar for him, and I've just bought one from Hugh Clark. Can hardly wait to send her off to Ted!

08-05-2002, 08:33 PM	#9
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 18 Times in 10 Posts	I have a 1936 Mauser VOPO that appears to be all matching and in very nice shape aside from the usual VOPO finish and grips. Doesn't look as if it needed refinishing, just the bureaucratic mindset, "We're supposed to refinish em so we refinish em." How does this strike you guys as a candidate for one of Thor's beautification jobs? Or better left as is? It has two VOPO magazines numbered to the gun.

08-11-2002, 08:49 PM	#11
TBeardmore User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 18 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pardon my ignorance (I'm still the new guy on the block, so to speak). Would someone kindly define what a VOPO is? (Very Old Perabellum Original?) Thanks! Tom

08-11-2002, 09:22 PM	#12
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	Hi Tom, welcome to the Luger Forum. VOPO is a short hand for Volkspolizei, or "Peoples Police". Usually used in reference to the East Germany and their rework of Lugers for use in the "VOPO".

08-11-2002, 09:28 PM	#13
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	VOPO is an abbreviation for Volkspolezi, the prior East German police. The East Germans took WWI/II Lugers and dip blued,rematched, and reissued them for police use until replaced by modern firearms. These were imported about five years ago and have almost reached a semi collector status in their own right. Most are considered prime candidates for restoration or kept as shooters. Initally they were about $325 - $400 but now are bringing higher prices. Welcome to the forum. RK

08-11-2002, 10:06 PM	#14
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	Roadkill, good to see your name on the forum, I wish those VOPO's were coming in truckloads again! I was overseas when they came over, so I just caught the stories about them. Maybe they'll discover a arms room full of Persian Artillerys and send them over to us? [img]wink.gif[/img] __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-13-2002, 05:12 PM	#15
crgkstnr User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 26 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

08-13-2002, 11:22 PM	#16
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Doug, please see TLSS OUTGOING on your Erfurt Police. <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" /> __________________ Thor's Luger Clinic http://members.rennlist.com/lugerman/ Ted Green (Thor Yaller Boots) 725 Western Hills Dr SE, Rio Rancho, NM 87124 915-526-8925 Email thor340@aol.com ----------------------------------- John3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."