LugerForum Discussion Forums my profile | register | faq | search
upload photo | donate | calendar

Go Back   LugerForum Discussion Forums > Luger Discussion Forums > Swiss Lugers

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 08-24-2011, 03:46 AM   #1
Mike B
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Mike B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: South Louisiana
Posts: 979
Thanks: 1
Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts
Default Swiss alphabet commercial

Greetings,
I have had this Luger for a couple of years now and have wanted to share it with the forum members for sometime. Seems every time I sit down to make some sort of a presentation, something gets in the way. So now at 1:00 AM I have decided to show off one of my prize Lugers.
This is a seldom seen Swiss alphabet commercial with a 3 3/4 inch 7.65mm barrel, a grip safety and a "Cross in Sunburst" chamber marking. This Luger is in pristine condition. It is a bit unusual to have the grips and the hold open numbered on a commercial Luger, but they are numbered to the gun as is all the other numbers. According to Mr.Still in his book "Weimar Lugers", he states that these Swiss found in the "i" block are few reported and few manufactured. If you take a look at Dwights commercial data, you will see that this Luger is one of first in the "i" block. It is the same run as the very rare Abercrombie & Fitch model. Here are a few photos,
Mike
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss8.JPG
Views:	269
Size:	69.1 KB
ID:	20890  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss7.JPG
Views:	253
Size:	74.5 KB
ID:	20891  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss10.JPG
Views:	241
Size:	92.6 KB
ID:	20893  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss4.JPG
Views:	249
Size:	61.6 KB
ID:	20895  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss3.JPG
Views:	253
Size:	66.2 KB
ID:	20896  

Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss12.JPG
Views:	231
Size:	60.7 KB
ID:	20897  

Attached Images
   
Mike B is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to Mike B for your post:
Unread 08-24-2011, 08:39 AM   #2
sheepherder
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
sheepherder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal...
Posts: 8,183
Thanks: 1,400
Thanked 4,442 Times in 2,330 Posts
Default

Very nice!!!

I'm curious as to the area of the grip frame where the thumb safety is...Is that a milled-out area, or just where there's no blue???

And I see it has the export "Germany" stamp...Does this indicate it was never delivered to the Swiss???
__________________
I like my coffee the
way I like my women...
...Cold and bitter...
sheepherder is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 09:49 AM   #3
alanint
User
 
alanint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Marco Island, Florida
Posts: 4,867
Thanks: 1,685
Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts
Default

It appears milled out to me...
alanint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 10:05 AM   #4
sheepherder
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
sheepherder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal...
Posts: 8,183
Thanks: 1,400
Thanked 4,442 Times in 2,330 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alanint View Post
It appears milled out to me...
...Which would seem to indicate the safety was reversed...but why??? Is this an unsold Swiss that was changed to "German" safety specs for resale???
__________________
I like my coffee the
way I like my women...
...Cold and bitter...
sheepherder is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 10:47 AM   #5
Ron Wood
Moderator
2010 LugerForum
Patron
 
Ron Wood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso
Posts: 7,022
Thanks: 1,090
Thanked 5,178 Times in 1,703 Posts
Default

It is milled, but not to remove any markings. It is just a bright polished area to indicate that the gun is on "safe". It is the same feature that is found on Model 1900 and 1906 Lugers. So although this gun was made in/around 1920 it is of the 1906 pattern.
__________________
If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction
Ron Wood is offline   Reply With Quote
The following 5 members says Thank You to Ron Wood for your post:
Unread 08-24-2011, 10:53 AM   #6
Mike B
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Mike B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: South Louisiana
Posts: 979
Thanks: 1
Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts
Default

Here is a better picture of that area.
Attached Images
 
Mike B is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 11:38 AM   #7
Lugerdoc
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
Lugerdoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302
Posts: 5,089
Thanks: 6
Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts
Default

Ron et al, I suspect that DWM was using up their left over M1906 frames on this early post WW1 run, rather than modifing new PO8 frames. TH
__________________
Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302
Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net
Lugerdoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 11:44 AM   #8
alanint
User
 
alanint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Marco Island, Florida
Posts: 4,867
Thanks: 1,685
Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts
Default

This has always been a curious solution to my eyes. Why leave an area exposed they must have known would tarnish versus stamping or enameling a visual aid, as they did in later years?
alanint is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 12:19 PM   #9
FNorm
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
FNorm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Colorado
Posts: 978
Thanks: 68
Thanked 127 Times in 108 Posts
Default

The Swiss carried it over too. Here's a 6/24 Bern.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Swiss 6:24-1.jpg
Views:	229
Size:	84.1 KB
ID:	20906  

FNorm is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 10:03 PM   #10
MFC
User
 
MFC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,237
Thanks: 183
Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts
Default

Hi Mike,
Thanks for showing your M1906 Swiss Alphabet commercial. It’s one of my favorites. According to Still's Weimar Lugers it was made in 1921 at the beginning of the Alphabet commercial series which began with #2000i. Your Luger #2049i is a very scarce example with a factory original barrel.

The story of this very interesting Luger variation as told to me by Bob Simpson…

These lugers were made for the Swiss commercial market. Most of the Lugers in this series were sent to Switzerland without barrels. The Swiss installed Hammerli made barrels which included the Abercrombie & Fitch marked barrels. Very few had factory original barrels installed.

I own #2381i which I purchased from Simpson’s. The ‘Cross in Sunburst’ is in my avatar. It is the same configuration as Mike’s, but doesn’t have the ‘Germany’ export stamp.
__________________
Mike C.
MFC is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to MFC for your post:
Unread 08-24-2011, 11:11 PM   #11
Mike B
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Mike B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: South Louisiana
Posts: 979
Thanks: 1
Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts
Default

If my understanding is correct, the "GERMANY" stamp, whether on a firearm or a dinner plate, signifies that the item was being exported from Germany and bound for the United States or some other country. That being the case, it seems resonable to me to assume that this Luger was manufactured in Germany and had originally been destined for Switzerland. For reasons unknown and will probably never be known, it was diverted to the United States. My guess is that the order for the Stoeger Lugers was oversold, and this was an easy subsitute. This is only a guess, but as good as any.
Mike B is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-24-2011, 11:52 PM   #12
MFC
User
 
MFC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,237
Thanks: 183
Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts
Default

Ben,
The example from your link at Simpson's has one of the more common Swiss replacement barrels.
This is another example with a factory original barrel...
http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...3750ac0192882f
It also has the 'Germany' export stamp.
__________________
Mike C.
MFC is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-04-2013, 09:25 AM   #13
Jerry
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Jerry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Default

I have SN 2274i and was just trying to research it...This was a very helpful thread but need to read some more. I'll try and post some pictures later today.

Just looked at the barrel and it has c/n proofs only. Also, has no Germany stamp.
__________________
Jerry
Jerry is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-04-2013, 09:03 PM   #14
Jerry
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Jerry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Default

Not as nice but still a Swiss...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCN1148.jpg
Views:	231
Size:	84.2 KB
ID:	34310  

Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCN1149.jpg
Views:	233
Size:	90.1 KB
ID:	34311  

__________________
Jerry
Jerry is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-04-2013, 09:25 PM   #15
lugersrkewl
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ussr
Posts: 425
Thanks: 198
Thanked 75 Times in 58 Posts
Default

any swiss is a good swiss in my book.
Nice pistols fellas , I coudnt be any more jealous
lugersrkewl is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-04-2013, 10:17 PM   #16
Jerry
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Jerry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Default

Any thoughts on why no Germany on mine?
__________________
Jerry
Jerry is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-05-2013, 01:36 AM   #17
Mike B
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Mike B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: South Louisiana
Posts: 979
Thanks: 1
Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts
Default

Hi Jerry,
I am happy that you were able to gain a little insight about your Swiss. I still have the Swiss in this thread.
NO GERMANY. Probably because it never made it to an export firm. Likely sold somewhere in Europe.

Mike
Mike B is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-05-2013, 07:18 AM   #18
Jerry
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Jerry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Default

Thanks Mike!
__________________
Jerry
Jerry is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-05-2013, 10:06 AM   #19
Lugerdoc
Patron
LugerForum
Patron
 
Lugerdoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302
Posts: 5,089
Thanks: 6
Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts
Default

Jerry et al, Speaking of books --- you might want to consider adding Fred Datig's "The Swiss Variations 1897-1947" (the definative book on Swiss lugers) to your library @$25 + $5 S&H. TH
__________________
Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302
Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net
Lugerdoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-05-2013, 11:47 AM   #20
Jerry
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
Jerry's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 6 Posts
Default

Tom...actually that book should be here today...Thanks!
__________________
Jerry
Jerry is offline   Reply With Quote
The following member says Thank You to Jerry for your post:
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1998 - 2024, Lugerforum.com