Another Need Help ID'ing Post

HookMech · 03-16-2009, 11:00 PM

I thought I'd use my first post wisely. I have the opportunity to purchase a luger, my first. So I did a little research and figured out that this might be a Navy. But that's where it starts to get cloudy. I'm not sure exactly which model I'm looking at. Outside of the obvious: ser#97@; grip safety; gesichert marked; 6" bbl; Navy proofed; DWM; GELADEN marked extractor; adj rear sight; 80-85% finish; all but one nunmber matches the ser#. Can someone lend a helping hand?

Thank you for your consideration,

~Joe

Navy · 03-17-2009, 10:03 AM

You got a Navy all right. First issue altered. An old sea dog that looks like he has seen some service. If the rusting has not developed into pits, it should clean up pretty nicely.

What part is mis-matched?

Tom A

lugerholsterrepair · 03-17-2009, 10:53 AM

Tom asked the question I would have...It's not the most important part, the sideplate. I can see that serial# or the takedown lever.
Nice early magazine...
Even with one part not matching I would be all over that pistol like white on rice. If it's 3 grand or less you better buy it and if you don't let me know.

Jerry Burney

HookMech · 03-17-2009, 02:16 PM

The toggle is numbered 100. And the mag is 616 I think, it's a little distorted. When you say "1st issue, altered." what does that mean? I'm used to US martial arms. This is my first forray into Pre-WWI foreign arms. NEWB!

Ingvarg · 03-17-2009, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HookMech

The toggle is numbered 100. And the mag is 616 I think, it's a little distorted. When you say "1st issue, altered." what does that mean? I'm used to US martial arms. This is my first forray into Pre-WWI foreign arms. NEWB!

The 100 mark on the toggle is not the serial number. ItÃ?Â´s for the 100 meter settings on the rear sight. If you pull it back and up, you will see the 200 metes mark.
1. issue means its the first version of Luger issued for the German navy and altered means the safety was later changed from "safe up" (gesichert) to "safe down" like on the later made P08.

btw. Nice and interesting pistol.

Ingvarg · 03-17-2009, 02:51 PM

Does anybody know this unit mark (MA 23) on the back strap.

luger11 · 03-17-2009, 03:37 PM

The M.A. mark is open for discussion as there are at least two theory's . One is Matrosen Artillery ( Marine Artillery section) and another is Minenabteilung ( Mines detachment ) I believe in the first suggestion Marine Artillery. The number 23 is the number assigned to the weapon. This is a grip strap mark not often encounted.
As Tom suggested hopefully the rust has not taken over this "Old Sailor" I would also be very interested in this gun as I collect grip strap marks.
Leo

Ron Wood · 03-17-2009, 05:45 PM

Here is another possibility: Munitions Arsenal, weapon #23. I kind of favor the Matrosen Artillery myself.

Navy · 03-18-2009, 07:40 AM

I tend to believe it stands for Matrosen Abteilung (Sailors Section/Detachment-a holding unit for sailors not assigned to a vessel or other unit) as I have a number of imperial navy soldbuchs so marked and have never seen any documentation indicating any other meaning for such abbreviation in a naval document.
Tom A

Ron Wood · 03-18-2009, 12:52 PM

That was my second choice

!

HookMech · 03-21-2009, 07:40 PM

Thank you gentlemen for your thoroughly helpful replies. I may end up with a luger in my collection soon.

03-16-2009, 11:00 PM	#1
HookMech New User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Another Need Help ID'ing Post I thought I'd use my first post wisely. I have the opportunity to purchase a luger, my first. So I did a little research and figured out that this might be a Navy. But that's where it starts to get cloudy. I'm not sure exactly which model I'm looking at. Outside of the obvious: ser#97@; grip safety; gesichert marked; 6" bbl; Navy proofed; DWM; GELADEN marked extractor; adj rear sight; 80-85% finish; all but one nunmber matches the ser#. Can someone lend a helping hand? Thank you for your consideration, ~Joe

03-17-2009, 10:53 AM	#3
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,850 Thanked 3,100 Times in 1,426 Posts	Tom asked the question I would have...It's not the most important part, the sideplate. I can see that serial# or the takedown lever. Nice early magazine... Even with one part not matching I would be all over that pistol like white on rice. If it's 3 grand or less you better buy it and if you don't let me know. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

03-17-2009, 02:51 PM	#6
Ingvarg User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Iceland Posts: 103 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Does anybody know this unit mark (MA 23) on the back strap. __________________ Regards: Ingvar

03-17-2009, 05:45 PM	#8
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	Here is another possibility: Munitions Arsenal, weapon #23. I kind of favor the Matrosen Artillery myself. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-18-2009, 12:52 PM	#10
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	That was my second choice! __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-17-2009, 10:03 AM	#2
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	You got a Navy all right. First issue altered. An old sea dog that looks like he has seen some service. If the rusting has not developed into pits, it should clean up pretty nicely. What part is mis-matched? Tom A

03-17-2009, 02:16 PM	#4
HookMech New User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The toggle is numbered 100. And the mag is 616 I think, it's a little distorted. When you say "1st issue, altered." what does that mean? I'm used to US martial arms. This is my first forray into Pre-WWI foreign arms. NEWB!

03-17-2009, 03:37 PM	#7
luger11 User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 149 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The M.A. mark is open for discussion as there are at least two theory's . One is Matrosen Artillery ( Marine Artillery section) and another is Minenabteilung ( Mines detachment ) I believe in the first suggestion Marine Artillery. The number 23 is the number assigned to the weapon. This is a grip strap mark not often encounted. As Tom suggested hopefully the rust has not taken over this "Old Sailor" I would also be very interested in this gun as I collect grip strap marks. Leo

03-18-2009, 07:40 AM	#9
Navy RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dc 'burbs in Virginia Posts: 2,482 Thanks: 0 Thanked 16 Times in 10 Posts	I tend to believe it stands for Matrosen Abteilung (Sailors Section/Detachment-a holding unit for sailors not assigned to a vessel or other unit) as I have a number of imperial navy soldbuchs so marked and have never seen any documentation indicating any other meaning for such abbreviation in a naval document. Tom A

03-21-2009, 07:40 PM	#11
HookMech New User Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thank you gentlemen for your thoroughly helpful replies. I may end up with a luger in my collection soon.