MP 40 with papers

MarkC · 06-02-2013, 07:27 PM

I know it is not a Luger but I had the great luck of finding an MP40 with the capture papers and on a Treasury form 6 a while back so I decided I post a photo of the gun here.

Mark

rhinemann · 06-02-2013, 08:03 PM

Mark,
Wow, very nice fine. It doesn't get any better than that. Its what collectors dream about adding to their collections.

Best Regards,

Jeffrey

lugerholsterrepair · 06-02-2013, 08:20 PM

Mark, WOW! What a beauty. I have fired many rounds through one of these and they are a joy to shoot. Robust, accurate, never jam..you would think John Browning had a hand in designing them!
I would dearly love to find one of my own..

MarkC · 06-02-2013, 08:41 PM

I have Russian capture parts from a parts kit for the bolt and recoil spring so I shoot it with the mismatched parts. I don't want to risk breaking a numbered part since the gun is all matched numbered. I figure you can't ruin the receiver and barrel shooting factory 115g rounds.

The gun was in the attic of a house since the vet brought it back so it was left alone for all those long years and in the exact configuration from the battle field. The sling was pretty dried out so I treated it with Connolly's Hide care but it is still not right. Too much high heat over the years which will never bring the leather back.

Mark

lugerholsterrepair · 06-02-2013, 08:55 PM

Mark..Yes..that's what I have shot..man hundred round boxes of Winchester white box! These are quite accurate offhand at 200 yards. I wouldn't want someone shooting at me with one! Fold out the stock and aim and at 400 yards they would make a squad dive for cover! The 9MM round is pretty effective shot out of an MP40.

DavidJayUden · 06-02-2013, 10:31 PM

What is the Form 6?
dju

alanint · 06-03-2013, 07:13 AM

A Treasury Form 6 was a pre 1968 form of Amnesty document. It was more than likely issued to the vet himself. I trust that you have transferred the MP40 from the Vet's estate to you via a current ATF/NFA Form 4.

Simply having the gun and the original form does not make your possesion legal.

sheepherder · 06-03-2013, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkC

I have Russian capture parts from a parts kit for the bolt and recoil spring so I shoot it with the mismatched parts.

You probably already know, but a Portuguese FBP bolt & recoil spring assembly will fit & work - Several other parts will work as well, although they might not look like MP40 parts [barrel]. The Parts Kits are fairly cheap on GB.

MarkC · 06-03-2013, 09:25 AM

The gun is on a form 4 in my name. Originally they had only found the capture papers which is not an actual treasury form, then the form 6 dated 1946 turned up and I had no problem getting it on a form 4.

I wish I had known about the FBP kits before I bought my spare WWII parts!

alanint · 06-03-2013, 12:31 PM

Good News.

Yes, the following FBP parts are interchangeable with the MP40:
- Complete bolt and spring tube.
- Barrel w/two barrel half moon retainers
- Barrel Nut
- Barrel locking shim
- Front Sling mount
Sadly, the magazines are not interchangeable.
I made a suppressed barrel assembly for my MP40 once from a complete FBP unit.

sheepherder · 06-03-2013, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanint

Yes, the following FBP parts are interchangeable with the MP40:
- Complete bolt and spring tube.
- Barrel w/two barrel half moon retainers
- Barrel Nut
- Barrel locking shim
- Front Sling mount
Sadly, the magazines are not interchangeable.

The trunnion is the same also, but it is a bear to get apart from the receiver tube...It's brazed in place...

(The barrel in the pic is from a GB auction and shows a bayonet lug/sleeve on the barrel...most don't have the lug/sleeve)

alanint · 06-03-2013, 02:26 PM

My kit had no bayonet lug. The trunion is indeed similar, but as you said, difficult to make useful.
FBP kits were less than $50 dollars when they were first imported, until the MP40 spare parts connection was made. Today just the bolt and springtube can bring over $250-$300

MarkC · 06-03-2013, 02:36 PM

Hmmm that's a little more than I paid for my bolt and spring tube

I wish we could have suppressed firearms in Massachusetts but they are not allowed. I suppose I should be happy we can own class 3 firearms with a special license issued by the State via the local PD. (That is in addition to having the form 4 approved by the chief)

Edward Tinker · 06-03-2013, 02:58 PM

Mark, cool, enough of a story for vol IV?

I am originally from WA state, no Class 3 is allowed...

MarkC · 06-03-2013, 03:21 PM

Sure Ed!

I suppose we will never know how Major Kennedy got all the guns but the capture papers are dated 30 May 1945.

I have an Astra 900, P.38 and "Gestapo" pistol which is actually a Browning HP. They all have the same type capture papers.

Contact me via my private email and I'll send you 300 dpi photos.

Mark (at) P38guns (dot) com

Douglas Jr. · 06-03-2013, 04:31 PM

Mark,
That's a nice find! Congratulations!
Impossible not to like the red-brownish bakelite handguard.
I still need to find one (for a good price) to pair with my M1A1 Thompson...
Douglas

DavidJayUden · 06-03-2013, 04:57 PM

I'm amazed that the Vet had the foresight to Amnesty a gun that was stuffed away in the trunk. All too many such weapons can never again see the light of day. A shame.
A very nice MP40!
dju

alanint · 06-03-2013, 06:39 PM

It looks like a mid war Erma or Haenel made MP40. Could you share the code and date from the back of the receiver?

MarkC · 06-04-2013, 09:46 AM

It is an ayf43 with subcontracted parts.

The story from the vets wife was that Treasury agents visited his house after he returned from the war and spoke with Maj Kennedy. Since the form 6 is dated 1946 I suppose he registered the guns then? The form 6 is an application for the importation of firearms so it is a slightly different form from the 1968 amnesty registration. (My Thompson was on that form when I found it)

alanint · 06-04-2013, 04:48 PM

An Erma, (the original designers and manufacturers) made MP, produced in 1943.

You will often find parts made by fxo, (Haenel), cos, (Merz-Werke) and jvd, (Erste Nordbohemishe Metall) on any given MP40.

06-02-2013, 07:27 PM	#1
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	MP 40 with papers I know it is not a Luger but I had the great luck of finding an MP40 with the capture papers and on a Treasury form 6 a while back so I decided I post a photo of the gun here. Mark Attached Thumbnails

06-02-2013, 08:20 PM	#3
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Mark, WOW! What a beauty. I have fired many rounds through one of these and they are a joy to shoot. Robust, accurate, never jam..you would think John Browning had a hand in designing them! I would dearly love to find one of my own.. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-02-2013, 08:55 PM	#5
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,760 Thanks: 4,848 Thanked 3,099 Times in 1,426 Posts	Mark..Yes..that's what I have shot..man hundred round boxes of Winchester white box! These are quite accurate offhand at 200 yards. I wouldn't want someone shooting at me with one! Fold out the stock and aim and at 400 yards they would make a squad dive for cover! The 9MM round is pretty effective shot out of an MP40. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-02-2013, 08:03 PM	#2
rhinemann User Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: S. Calif. Posts: 66 Thanks: 14 Thanked 21 Times in 12 Posts	Mark, Wow, very nice fine. It doesn't get any better than that. Its what collectors dream about adding to their collections. Best Regards, Jeffrey

06-02-2013, 08:41 PM	#4
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	I have Russian capture parts from a parts kit for the bolt and recoil spring so I shoot it with the mismatched parts. I don't want to risk breaking a numbered part since the gun is all matched numbered. I figure you can't ruin the receiver and barrel shooting factory 115g rounds. The gun was in the attic of a house since the vet brought it back so it was left alone for all those long years and in the exact configuration from the battle field. The sling was pretty dried out so I treated it with Connolly's Hide care but it is still not right. Too much high heat over the years which will never bring the leather back. Mark

06-02-2013, 10:31 PM	#6
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	What is the Form 6? dju

06-03-2013, 07:13 AM	#7
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	A Treasury Form 6 was a pre 1968 form of Amnesty document. It was more than likely issued to the vet himself. I trust that you have transferred the MP40 from the Vet's estate to you via a current ATF/NFA Form 4. Simply having the gun and the original form does not make your possesion legal.

06-03-2013, 09:25 AM	#9
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	The gun is on a form 4 in my name. Originally they had only found the capture papers which is not an actual treasury form, then the form 6 dated 1946 turned up and I had no problem getting it on a form 4. I wish I had known about the FBP kits before I bought my spare WWII parts!

06-03-2013, 12:31 PM	#10
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	Good News. Yes, the following FBP parts are interchangeable with the MP40: - Complete bolt and spring tube. - Barrel w/two barrel half moon retainers - Barrel Nut - Barrel locking shim - Front Sling mount Sadly, the magazines are not interchangeable. I made a suppressed barrel assembly for my MP40 once from a complete FBP unit.

06-03-2013, 02:26 PM	#12
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	My kit had no bayonet lug. The trunion is indeed similar, but as you said, difficult to make useful. FBP kits were less than $50 dollars when they were first imported, until the MP40 spare parts connection was made. Today just the bolt and springtube can bring over $250-$300

06-03-2013, 02:36 PM	#13
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	Hmmm that's a little more than I paid for my bolt and spring tube I wish we could have suppressed firearms in Massachusetts but they are not allowed. I suppose I should be happy we can own class 3 firearms with a special license issued by the State via the local PD. (That is in addition to having the form 4 approved by the chief)

06-03-2013, 02:58 PM	#14
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,909 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,500 Times in 2,076 Posts	Mark, cool, enough of a story for vol IV? I am originally from WA state, no Class 3 is allowed...

06-03-2013, 03:21 PM	#15
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	Sure Ed! I suppose we will never know how Major Kennedy got all the guns but the capture papers are dated 30 May 1945. I have an Astra 900, P.38 and "Gestapo" pistol which is actually a Browning HP. They all have the same type capture papers. Contact me via my private email and I'll send you 300 dpi photos. Mark (at) P38guns (dot) com

06-03-2013, 04:31 PM	#16
Douglas Jr. User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South America Posts: 948 Thanks: 598 Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts	Mark, That's a nice find! Congratulations! Impossible not to like the red-brownish bakelite handguard. I still need to find one (for a good price) to pair with my M1A1 Thompson... Douglas

06-03-2013, 04:57 PM	#17
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	I'm amazed that the Vet had the foresight to Amnesty a gun that was stuffed away in the trunk. All too many such weapons can never again see the light of day. A shame. A very nice MP40! dju

06-03-2013, 06:39 PM	#18
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	It looks like a mid war Erma or Haenel made MP40. Could you share the code and date from the back of the receiver?

06-04-2013, 09:46 AM	#19
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 478 Thanks: 1 Thanked 109 Times in 26 Posts	It is an ayf43 with subcontracted parts. The story from the vets wife was that Treasury agents visited his house after he returned from the war and spoke with Maj Kennedy. Since the form 6 is dated 1946 I suppose he registered the guns then? The form 6 is an application for the importation of firearms so it is a slightly different form from the 1968 amnesty registration. (My Thompson was on that form when I found it)

06-04-2013, 04:48 PM	#20
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	An Erma, (the original designers and manufacturers) made MP, produced in 1943. You will often find parts made by fxo, (Haenel), cos, (Merz-Werke) and jvd, (Erste Nordbohemishe Metall) on any given MP40.