Assuming that...

Roadkill · 10-13-2003, 09:52 PM

Assuming that this is an original bring back what about the clips? Is good example though of WWII bring home personalization of souvenirs.

http://www.auctionarms.com/search/di...temNum=5065229

rk

Edward Tinker · 10-13-2003, 10:11 PM

Stamped Germany on the front above the grip?

Import, had military serial numbering?

Ed

drbuster · 10-13-2003, 10:30 PM

Doubt that this is a vet bring back. I've seen several post WW1 reworks imported into this country with "GERMANY" stamped in front of the frame, on the right side of the receiver and on the frame above the safety lever. A 1917 dated Erfurt, rebarreled to 7.65mm and stamped "GERMANY" on the frame above the safety lever is for sale at a loacl gun shop here.

Lyn Islaub · 10-13-2003, 10:38 PM

Ed,
Guess it could be a 9mm, but the serial number and "o" suffix make it more likely a 1920 Commercial in 7.65mm. Could also be a late 1914 9mm military DWM with the chamber shaved. Some of those, I have a couple, escaped having a sear safety installed before they were issued.
Lyn

Dwight Gruber · 10-13-2003, 11:06 PM

"Germany" sez its an exmport. A bit of image processing brings out what may be a Crown/N on the left receiver, also the C/N is fairly clear on the left breechblock. Bottom picture--muzzle view--of barrel shows pretty clearly that its .30 cal.

So what we have here is a "1920 Commercial"/Alphabet Commercial. At the moment it seems to be going for a pretty reasonable price.

--Dwight

Roadkill · 10-13-2003, 11:25 PM

Agree completely its an commercial, but was it commercial imported or Vet bring back? Possible that a .30 could have been in use in WWII? And what about the clips? To me this is a classic vet bring back that most likely wasn't. Or was it? More specifically, what are the chances of this item with holster & accessories being a bring home from Germany post war?

rk

Hugh · 10-13-2003, 11:44 PM

I believe a commercial import, with fantasy holster added much later. The white mag bottoms are the Franzite white plastic made during the 50's & 60's. They were to match the white grips made by the same company. The grips are not original, check the fit at the top and front grip strap. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" />

drbuster · 10-13-2003, 11:54 PM

Doubt very much that a "GERMANY" stamped exported piece after WW1 would have found itself back in Germany for WW2. Possible, but not probable.

Doubs · 10-13-2003, 11:59 PM

IMO, Hugh is correct..... a commercial "alphabet" Luger of the mid-1920's. The letter suffix which I believe to be "o" would be correct and the lack of military serial numbers on the sideplate and locking bolt plus the commercial C/N proof on the left and no military proofs on the right side all point to it being exactly what Hugh says it is. Not to mention the "GERMANY" stamp. The grips are replacements as Hugh points out and I also think the holster is a later addition. Finally, even though the ad says 9mm, I'm willing to bet that it's a .30 caliber.

At best it's a good shooter-grade pistol.

Pete Ebbink · 10-14-2003, 01:50 AM

Gotta love that holster "ornamentation"...though... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Roadkill · 10-14-2003, 06:24 AM

Ref the holster, we've heard of those guys who dumped their pistols in the harbor upon arriving at the US due to custom threats. Vet brought back a rig, dumped pistol, then found another a gun to replace it and made the story match. Then we have another "Vet Bring Back".

rk

Doubs · 10-14-2003, 12:36 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Roadkill:
Ref the holster, we've heard of those guys who dumped their pistols in the harbor upon arriving at the US due to custom threats. rk<hr /></blockquote>A friend of my father's once told him that before leaving Europe he had accumulated a duffle bag full of Leica cameras and accessories and a large number of Lugers, P-38's etc. The word was put out that all bags would be inspected and any soldier caught with more than "X amount" of anything would be courts martialed so he sold, gave away or threw away almost everything. They didn't look at any bags whatsoever!

I've mentioned this particular soldier before. He carried a BAR and was in the first wave at Normandy where he knocked the front sight off. He carried the BAR like that through to the war's end. He said that when something happened it was so quick and close that using the sight wasn't normally required.

He died 2 Oct., this year; age 81.

10-13-2003, 09:52 PM	#1
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Assuming that... Assuming that this is an original bring back what about the clips? Is good example though of WWII bring home personalization of souvenirs. http://www.auctionarms.com/search/di...temNum=5065229 rk

10-13-2003, 10:11 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,912 Thanks: 1,989 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	Stamped Germany on the front above the grip? Import, had military serial numbering? Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

10-13-2003, 11:44 PM	#7
Hugh RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeast Texas Swamp Posts: 2,460 Thanks: 2 Thanked 165 Times in 64 Posts	I believe a commercial import, with fantasy holster added much later. The white mag bottoms are the Franzite white plastic made during the 50's & 60's. They were to match the white grips made by the same company. The grips are not original, check the fit at the top and front grip strap. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" /> __________________ *TRUMP FOR PREZ IN '20!*

10-14-2003, 12:36 PM	#12
Doubs User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Byron, Georgia Posts: 1,670 Thanks: 770 Thanked 1,614 Times in 525 Posts	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Roadkill: <strong>Ref the holster, we've heard of those guys who dumped their pistols in the harbor upon arriving at the US due to custom threats. rk</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">A friend of my father's once told him that before leaving Europe he had accumulated a duffle bag full of Leica cameras and accessories and a large number of Lugers, P-38's etc. The word was put out that all bags would be inspected and any soldier caught with more than "X amount" of anything would be courts martialed so he sold, gave away or threw away almost everything. They didn't look at any bags whatsoever! I've mentioned this particular soldier before. He carried a BAR and was in the first wave at Normandy where he knocked the front sight off. He carried the BAR like that through to the war's end. He said that when something happened it was so quick and close that using the sight wasn't normally required. He died 2 Oct., this year; age 81.

10-13-2003, 10:30 PM	#3
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Doubt that this is a vet bring back. I've seen several post WW1 reworks imported into this country with "GERMANY" stamped in front of the frame, on the right side of the receiver and on the frame above the safety lever. A 1917 dated Erfurt, rebarreled to 7.65mm and stamped "GERMANY" on the frame above the safety lever is for sale at a loacl gun shop here.

10-13-2003, 10:38 PM	#4
Lyn Islaub Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 435 Thanks: 3 Thanked 152 Times in 72 Posts	Ed, Guess it could be a 9mm, but the serial number and "o" suffix make it more likely a 1920 Commercial in 7.65mm. Could also be a late 1914 9mm military DWM with the chamber shaved. Some of those, I have a couple, escaped having a sear safety installed before they were issued. Lyn

10-13-2003, 11:06 PM	#5
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	"Germany" sez its an exmport. A bit of image processing brings out what may be a Crown/N on the left receiver, also the C/N is fairly clear on the left breechblock. Bottom picture--muzzle view--of barrel shows pretty clearly that its .30 cal. So what we have here is a "1920 Commercial"/Alphabet Commercial. At the moment it seems to be going for a pretty reasonable price. --Dwight

10-13-2003, 11:25 PM	#6
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Agree completely its an commercial, but was it commercial imported or Vet bring back? Possible that a .30 could have been in use in WWII? And what about the clips? To me this is a classic vet bring back that most likely wasn't. Or was it? More specifically, what are the chances of this item with holster & accessories being a bring home from Germany post war? rk

10-13-2003, 11:54 PM	#8
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Doubt very much that a "GERMANY" stamped exported piece after WW1 would have found itself back in Germany for WW2. Possible, but not probable.

10-13-2003, 11:59 PM	#9
Doubs User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Byron, Georgia Posts: 1,670 Thanks: 770 Thanked 1,614 Times in 525 Posts	IMO, Hugh is correct..... a commercial "alphabet" Luger of the mid-1920's. The letter suffix which I believe to be "o" would be correct and the lack of military serial numbers on the sideplate and locking bolt plus the commercial C/N proof on the left and no military proofs on the right side all point to it being exactly what Hugh says it is. Not to mention the "GERMANY" stamp. The grips are replacements as Hugh points out and I also think the holster is a later addition. Finally, even though the ad says 9mm, I'm willing to bet that it's a .30 caliber. At best it's a good shooter-grade pistol.

10-14-2003, 01:50 AM	#10
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Gotta love that holster "ornamentation"...though... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

10-14-2003, 06:24 AM	#11
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Ref the holster, we've heard of those guys who dumped their pistols in the harbor upon arriving at the US due to custom threats. Vet brought back a rig, dumped pistol, then found another a gun to replace it and made the story match. Then we have another "Vet Bring Back". rk