Explain this 1920 over AE Stamp?

Hugo Borchardt · 02-12-2011, 08:18 PM

This receiver/barrel is very interesting to me. Weimar 1920 property stamp over an American Eagle.

- captured GI WW1 personal gun?
- unshipped factory inventory converted for Weimar use?

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...=215290811#PIC

Any comments?

drbuster · 02-12-2011, 08:20 PM

Clark, most likely the latter of the two possibilities you mention. The 1920, of course, is a property stamp of the Weimar Republic and not a date.

Ron Wood · 02-12-2011, 09:22 PM

Since it is a 1906 AE, it could have been shipped to the US and then found its way back to Europe (possibly a GI personal gun, but not likely since GIs weren't permitted personal weapons unless their name happend to be Patton!

). Years ago an acquaintance of mine came into possession of a really minty early 1900 AE that had a reinforced Swiss extractor and the rear sight was modified to a "U" notch complete with the small Swiss federal cross stamp on the toggle in front of the rear sight. Who knows how many of those early guns made it back and forth across the puddle?

MFC · 02-13-2011, 01:35 AM

On page 232 of Still's Weimar Lugers, there is an 06 AE that has military style numbering added. The S# falls within a range of commercials that was sent to the military before the begining of WWI. After WWI it had a sear safety added and has police unit marks on the front grip strap.

Hugo Borchardt · 02-13-2011, 09:33 AM

Thanks, guys. For some reason, I can picture a Weimar police officer being very proud to own that gun.

It didn't sell and is relisted. If it was an entire gun I would like to have had it. I'm not one to collect the other parts and build a mismatching gun around it, though. Just isn't the same. You can build a shooter, or something to sell, but IMO I can't build my own collector piece.

Edward Tinker · 02-13-2011, 09:54 AM

I would not mind owning it, but with the worn condition and high price, its just a bit much for a conversation piece

ed

Lugerdoc · 02-19-2011, 11:34 AM

Ron W, Here's an alternative theory (or at least a good story) on how a 1906AE could end up in the German Military inventory after WW1: My German born Grandfather was a member of the American Bund and had purchased a M1906AE luger, that he took back to German in 1914 to volunteer for Army sercive as an officer during WW1. He was tragicly killed and the pistol ended up in the military inventory, to be stamped 1920 at the end of the war. TH PS: It was actually a grand mother who was a Bund member, but she didn't go back to Germany or own a luger, that I know of.

Ron Wood · 02-19-2011, 11:49 AM

Tom,
Those AEs got back to the Fatherland somehow, and that is as good of a senario as any

.

Mike B · 02-19-2011, 02:19 PM

For what it's worth, I have a "like new" '06 AE with no "GERMANY" and the extractor is marked "GELADEN". My thinking is, even though it was built to be shipped to the US, somehow it was cut short and sold in Europe.

Mike

Douglas Jr. · 02-23-2011, 09:36 AM

Simpsons once had a rare Mauser C96 from the Persian Contract (only 1,000 made) with the "1920". According to what I could find out, some of these guns had not been delivered by the WWI outbreak and was pressed into military service and was marked with the "1920" property mark after the war.

In my humble opinion this is was most probably happened to this gun. Interesting piece.

Edward Tinker · 02-23-2011, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike B

For what it's worth, I have a "like new" '06 AE with no "GERMANY" and the extractor is marked "GELADEN". My thinking is, even though it was built to be shipped to the US, somehow it was cut short and sold in Europe.

Mike

Mike, either I read it or someone told me that there were AE's destined for Canada, and although they came to NY where Tauscher was located, some folks liked the AE but since it was going to Canada, no germany stamp was required?

I have heard that the stamp was not stamped till they arrived here??

Ed

Mike B · 02-23-2011, 06:09 PM

Thanks Ed,
But what about the extractor being marked "GELADEN" instead of " LOADED".

Mike

Dwight Gruber · 02-23-2011, 07:28 PM

Note that the serial number has been stamped on the left side of the receiver, further evidence that this gun ended up as property of the Reichswehr (probably). It makes sense that the extractor could have been replaced during its service life.

--Dwight

Ben M. · 03-17-2011, 10:26 AM

How about an American working and living in Germany in the early 1900's.

He wanted to buy a Luger in Germany but with some attachment to his homeland, the USA. So he special-ordered it from a local sporting good store in Germany.

Gun stayed in Germany with several Owners and was eventually inventoried/stamped 1920 after WWI.

02-12-2011, 08:18 PM	#1
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 338 Thanked 131 Times in 47 Posts	Explain this 1920 over AE Stamp? This receiver/barrel is very interesting to me. Weimar 1920 property stamp over an American Eagle. - captured GI WW1 personal gun? - unshipped factory inventory converted for Weimar use? http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...=215290811#PIC Any comments? __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

02-12-2011, 09:22 PM	#3
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	Since it is a 1906 AE, it could have been shipped to the US and then found its way back to Europe (possibly a GI personal gun, but not likely since GIs weren't permitted personal weapons unless their name happend to be Patton!). Years ago an acquaintance of mine came into possession of a really minty early 1900 AE that had a reinforced Swiss extractor and the rear sight was modified to a "U" notch complete with the small Swiss federal cross stamp on the toggle in front of the rear sight. Who knows how many of those early guns made it back and forth across the puddle? __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

02-13-2011, 01:35 AM	#4
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	On page 232 of Still's Weimar Lugers, there is an 06 AE that has military style numbering added. The S# falls within a range of commercials that was sent to the military before the begining of WWI. After WWI it had a sear safety added and has police unit marks on the front grip strap. __________________ Mike C.

02-13-2011, 09:33 AM	#5
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 338 Thanked 131 Times in 47 Posts	Thanks, guys. For some reason, I can picture a Weimar police officer being very proud to own that gun. It didn't sell and is relisted. If it was an entire gun I would like to have had it. I'm not one to collect the other parts and build a mismatching gun around it, though. Just isn't the same. You can build a shooter, or something to sell, but IMO I can't build my own collector piece. __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

02-13-2011, 09:54 AM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,911 Thanks: 1,986 Thanked 4,502 Times in 2,077 Posts	I would not mind owning it, but with the worn condition and high price, its just a bit much for a conversation piece ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

02-12-2011, 08:20 PM	#2
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Clark, most likely the latter of the two possibilities you mention. The 1920, of course, is a property stamp of the Weimar Republic and not a date.

02-19-2011, 11:34 AM	#7
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Ron W, Here's an alternative theory (or at least a good story) on how a 1906AE could end up in the German Military inventory after WW1: My German born Grandfather was a member of the American Bund and had purchased a M1906AE luger, that he took back to German in 1914 to volunteer for Army sercive as an officer during WW1. He was tragicly killed and the pistol ended up in the military inventory, to be stamped 1920 at the end of the war. TH PS: It was actually a grand mother who was a Bund member, but she didn't go back to Germany or own a luger, that I know of. __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

02-19-2011, 11:49 AM	#8
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,987 Thanks: 1,065 Thanked 5,090 Times in 1,675 Posts	Tom, Those AEs got back to the Fatherland somehow, and that is as good of a senario as any . __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

02-19-2011, 02:19 PM	#9
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	For what it's worth, I have a "like new" '06 AE with no "GERMANY" and the extractor is marked "GELADEN". My thinking is, even though it was built to be shipped to the US, somehow it was cut short and sold in Europe. Mike

02-23-2011, 09:36 AM	#10
Douglas Jr. User Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: South America Posts: 948 Thanks: 598 Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts	Simpsons once had a rare Mauser C96 from the Persian Contract (only 1,000 made) with the "1920". According to what I could find out, some of these guns had not been delivered by the WWI outbreak and was pressed into military service and was marked with the "1920" property mark after the war. In my humble opinion this is was most probably happened to this gun. Interesting piece.

02-23-2011, 06:09 PM	#12
Mike B Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 979 Thanks: 1 Thanked 271 Times in 99 Posts	Thanks Ed, But what about the extractor being marked "GELADEN" instead of " LOADED". Mike

02-23-2011, 07:28 PM	#13
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	Note that the serial number has been stamped on the left side of the receiver, further evidence that this gun ended up as property of the Reichswehr (probably). It makes sense that the extractor could have been replaced during its service life. --Dwight

03-17-2011, 10:26 AM	#14
Ben M. User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Retired to Naples, FL. Posts: 475 Thanks: 83 Thanked 117 Times in 79 Posts	How about an American working and living in Germany in the early 1900's. He wanted to buy a Luger in Germany but with some attachment to his homeland, the USA. So he special-ordered it from a local sporting good store in Germany. Gun stayed in Germany with several Owners and was eventually inventoried/stamped 1920 after WWI.