my first Luger - Page 2

ithacaartist · 08-23-2016, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Tinker

whoa, whoa, lets not get crazy here.

This is a WW1 era holster (LZA) that is police modified! The 5722 on the back helps substantiate that and the strap is not un known to occur like this. But let me look again

I also merged the photos, at least the first ones to make it easier on my old eyes

Too late for that, Ed!

WWI with mag pouch appended... Thanks for the LZA info. And in the latest shots, an extra stitch-hole is visible for the former military configuration closure, on the lid. I think I can barely make out the evidence on the body, in the right place for the original strap's buckle end, but it's there. If anybody knows police holsters, Ed surely does!

DavidJayUden · 08-23-2016, 08:05 PM

I'm guessing a retail pricetag of around $1250 for the rig IF it matches.
dju

GKITCH · 08-23-2016, 10:23 PM

Yes, all numbers match and the bore is good. Mechanics are sound. The sunlight in the photos make the finish look more faded, yet there is some clear finish wear. All markings are very crisp.

Mac Cat · 08-24-2016, 10:23 AM

Thanks for sharing your new acquisition with us!
It's a nice piece!

And, your photos are pretty good, as well!

The holster is very interesting to me - it's definitely different than any of I seen before and so worn that it's hard to believe the closing strap is placed wrong. The "L Z A" code is for "Mauser-Werke, Karlshule plant" (per The Standard Directory of Proof Marks - Wirnsberger).

It looks so much like my own 1942 holster, but that closing flap isn't right!?
That is exactly how the longer artillery luger holsters are made (LP08).
Also, I've never seen a holster stamp under the belt straps - very odd.

Store you gun in a nice cloth lined pistol case, not the holster!

(in the Technical Information section on this site (left sidebar), you'll find the suffix code charts and a lot of information that may help you understand more about it.)

Mac Cat · 08-24-2016, 10:45 AM

This is my 1942 P08 holster "DLU" "1942" and an eagle over "WaA 641" (corrected, earlier I said it was 841, my bad)

The "P08" stamp is very faint, but it's in large letters on the back right side.

Also, I found a similar holster to yours, in Bender's "Lugers and Holsters" that was a cut-down LP08 holster (p.198) There are several variations displayed, including conversations to a P-38 holster from a P08.

mrerick · 08-24-2016, 03:57 PM

They used up the parts on hand pretty much as they were produced. Typically first in, first out unless there was some issue that delayed them in process. The production areas tended to be structured as batch processes so parts were somewhat grouped.

There was an overlap of toggles at the beginning of 1941 with the two different concealment codes used in the "o" and "p" blocks. About 5,000 were made with "42" toggles, and 15,000 with "byf" toggles.

Of course, once a part was made it could end up in use on a gun anytime after that.

Marc

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurusu

Marc

I was under the impression that during January and February 1941 Lugers were still being produced with the manufacturer code "42".

I think I was told somewhere that my 41 BYF 8024o had been
produced around May.

I've been wrong before.

wlyon · 08-24-2016, 11:24 PM

I have only seen the LZA stamp on 1918 dated holsters. From the pictures and my old eyes I can not see where a buckle strap was removed. So my guess a converted 1918 artillery holster. Bill

ithacaartist · 08-25-2016, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wlyon

I have only seen the LZA stamp on 1918 dated holsters. From the pictures and my old eyes I can not see where a buckle strap was removed. So my guess a converted 1918 artillery holster. Bill

Bill, I don't see what I imagined I saw the other day in terms of buckle strap's former location. Now it looks more like a stain. Wouldn't a pic of the area on the side below the mag pouch show where the stitching for a cleaning rod's longer pouch used to be? Such a pic might solve this. What bugs me is the lack of holes in between the belt loops--shouldn't' there be a square of holes there?

Eugen · 08-25-2016, 07:58 AM

There is nothing better than the introduction of an unusual holster on this forum to get the blood flowing and the opinions flying.

I love it.

K.Wilhelm · 08-25-2016, 08:50 AM

I love the last of the Mauser Lugers, byf41 & byf42). I have several. From the limited pictures we have of yours it appears to be in about 70% condition, and if all matching, I think David's estimate for your rig is spot on. Enjoy your new Luger and welcome to the forum. Bill

alanint · 08-25-2016, 11:34 AM

I just don't see ANY indication that this holster is a converted artillery.

sheepherder · 08-25-2016, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurusu

One thing I can tell you. It has been shot frequently.

The toggle dusktail print doesn't look all that bad...

The finish shows wear but doesn't look hammered...

kurusu · 08-25-2016, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheepherder

The toggle dusktail print doesn't look all that bad...

The finish shows wear but doesn't look hammered...

Didn't say it was hammered, only well used. Looks more or less like my BYF. And my BYF has been well used.

Check also the base of the ears.

GKITCH · 08-29-2016, 08:43 AM

Located a faint set of markings on the inside of the flap. Yes, 1918 is certainly clear. Here are the closeups of the muzzle end too.

08-24-2016, 10:45 AM	#25
Mac Cat Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 675 Thanks: 2,021 Thanked 545 Times in 294 Posts	This is my 1942 P08 holster "DLU" "1942" and an eagle over "WaA 641" (corrected, earlier I said it was 841, my bad) The "P08" stamp is very faint, but it's in large letters on the back right side. Also, I found a similar holster to yours, in Bender's "Lugers and Holsters" that was a cut-down LP08 holster (p.198) There are several variations displayed, including conversations to a P-38 holster from a P08. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Mac Cat; 08-24-2016 at 07:54 PM. Reason: correction

08-24-2016, 11:24 PM	#27
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,619 Thanks: 3,144 Thanked 2,530 Times in 943 Posts	I have only seen the LZA stamp on 1918 dated holsters. From the pictures and my old eyes I can not see where a buckle strap was removed. So my guess a converted 1918 artillery holster. Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

08-25-2016, 07:58 AM	#29
Eugen User Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Newburgh,IN Posts: 768 Thanks: 370 Thanked 602 Times in 320 Posts	There is nothing better than the introduction of an unusual holster on this forum to get the blood flowing and the opinions flying. I love it. __________________ “God created war so that Americans would learn geography.” ― Mark Twain

08-25-2016, 08:50 AM	#30
K.Wilhelm User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: South Central Colorado Posts: 215 Thanks: 45 Thanked 109 Times in 66 Posts	I love the last of the Mauser Lugers, byf41 & byf42). I have several. From the limited pictures we have of yours it appears to be in about 70% condition, and if all matching, I think David's estimate for your rig is spot on. Enjoy your new Luger and welcome to the forum. Bill __________________ NRA Endowment Life member Proud veteran of the Naval Security Group

08-29-2016, 08:43 AM	#34
GKITCH User Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 9 Thanks: 14 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	found another marking Located a faint set of markings on the inside of the flap. Yes, 1918 is certainly clear. Here are the closeups of the muzzle end too.

08-23-2016, 08:05 PM	#22
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	I'm guessing a retail pricetag of around $1250 for the rig IF it matches. dju

08-23-2016, 10:23 PM	#23
GKITCH User Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 9 Thanks: 14 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Yes, all numbers match and the bore is good. Mechanics are sound. The sunlight in the photos make the finish look more faded, yet there is some clear finish wear. All markings are very crisp.

08-24-2016, 10:23 AM	#24
Mac Cat Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 675 Thanks: 2,021 Thanked 545 Times in 294 Posts	Thanks for sharing your new acquisition with us! It's a nice piece! And, your photos are pretty good, as well! The holster is very interesting to me - it's definitely different than any of I seen before and so worn that it's hard to believe the closing strap is placed wrong. The "L Z A" code is for "Mauser-Werke, Karlshule plant" (per The Standard Directory of Proof Marks - Wirnsberger). It looks so much like my own 1942 holster, but that closing flap isn't right!? That is exactly how the longer artillery luger holsters are made (LP08). Also, I've never seen a holster stamp under the belt straps - very odd. Store you gun in a nice cloth lined pistol case, not the holster! (in the Technical Information section on this site (left sidebar), you'll find the suffix code charts and a lot of information that may help you understand more about it.)

08-25-2016, 11:34 AM	#31
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	I just don't see ANY indication that this holster is a converted artillery.