Semi-Auto Thompson Stock Adapter...

[alanint]

The issue is that they stopped offering this item years ago. What is the date on your catalogue?

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by alanint

The issue is that they stopped offering this item years ago. What is the date on your catalogue?

Quite old - 70's probably (they didn't date them back then, but it's No 10).

I can't see any machinist charging $180 for this work. Sorry. Just my opinion.

Originally Posted by John Sabato

You have a combo Mill/Lathe in your basement. Some of us are not that fortunate, and have to pay the going rate to those who are equipped for the work...

The whole idea behind 90% of my posts is that you CAN get that equipment, for about what a 1937 S/42 in 90% shape or better costs...And you CAN take a course in metal working at your local trade school, at night...

It's not a question of FORTUNATE...

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

...It's not a question of FORTUNATE...

Correct. It's a question of priorities. I'll take one of each. every size and every color! In this case, I could have done it the low tech way, as described, and saved my money for a basic mill or cheap combo, which I could also use for my Erma extractor project. But I know this guy up in Rochester...maybe he can help with that.

[John Sabato]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

I had posted this scan from the Numrich catalog to someone's thread here once before...But here it is again...

That Numrich adapter item would be handy at twice or three times that price, but what the catalogue never told you was that it doesn't include the machine work necessary to whack at least .25" of metal off the flat surface of the lower receiver to make it "look" right. If you just drill and tap the two holes, The 1928 removable stock would not fit properly, it would just "fit"...

While I have made many parts over the years with hand tools, and am pretty darn careful and productive with a mill file, I would not attempt to make that lower receiver modification without a milling machine or equivilant.

Just one OOPS is all it would take and a $1700 firearm would be an ugly paperweight...and I can't afford to replace that receiver. The $180 is the insurance that if the machinist doesn't do it RIGHT, he is liable for fixing or replacing it. ...and it takes me a long time to push that many pennies into a pile.

Rich, I know you live alone... and your only "job" is pleasing yourself at your address, ...but do you have children? Grandchildren? If not, then you don't know how much of a hassle (and often a waste of time) your personal priority list can be... you almost never get to the big stuff that is only important to you.

I wouldn't trade any of my grandchildren for Georg Luger's personal sidearm (well maybe just one... ), but I sure would like to drop a satchel full of money and own it!

There is an old proverb (...not from the bible) that says that "Life is what happens while you are making plans" If you look up the origin, you will probably find my photo next to it as the example.

[ithacaartist]

Three times the old price of the adapter would be worth it, in terms of time spent making it and dollars spent if hiring the work out or making the piece instead of spending the time at otherwise paying work. Bit I swear it isn't that complicated, just a stock piece of steel 1/8 x 1 cut to length, with the rear end beveled, or radius-ed as in the blueprint, two to four countersunk holes just about anywhere reasonable that will catch the receiver, and the notch for the latch--again, located by the blueprint. For the receiver, one could use a couple of pieces of 1/8 flat bar clamped on either side of the material to be removed, perhaps shimmed up a few thousandths to make sure that a tad more than 1/8 of the base remains. One could hacksaw the rectangle of steel with its lug from the body of the receiver and finish it up with careful grinding and filing. The side plates would keep the methods of removing the steel from going too far. Just have to be sure the front end of the cutout is cut square. This would save any money spent for machine work, and although it might take a while to do it carefully, it's a pretty straightforward project. All the surfaces addressed will be hidden once it's assembled, so no sins showing when done. The machinist said he would saw out the bulk of the extra stuff, as it would have taken too long to hog it all off with a mill cutter.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by John Sabato

Rich, I know you live alone... and your only "job" is pleasing yourself at your address, ...but do you have children? Grandchildren? If not, then you don't know how much of a hassle (and often a waste of time) your personal priority list can be... you almost never get to the big stuff that is only important to you.

Regardless of our life choices, you can still pull out your Sears charge card and buy the exact same 3in1 machine I have, and not have to wait or pay thru the nose for the little things you might want. If you were once a gunsmith, then it would not be a big learning curve. Mistakes is how we learn. I've posted Samuel Beckett's adage about failure on my shop wall.

And when asked, I respond "Ah git bet-tah ev-ra day"...

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

Three times the old price of the adapter would be worth it...

That is almost exactly what I would charge, for milling off the bottom ridge and fabricating the T adapter. Assuming no problems, no hardened steel, and the 'customer' had the piece of CRS steel bar stock in his hand along with the assembled buttstock and separate gripframe/receiver.

My last employer paid me $28/hr. Figuring your machinist's fee, that would be 6 1/2 hrs work. That doesn't look like 6 1/2 hours to me. Maybe two hours. More likely less.

I would have said $40 was a fair price, for a milled part, with tool marks left similar to anything found on a Luger. And I would have used socket flat head machine screws, because they are grade 8.

If it was a must-have right-away part, then price is no object. I assume your guy has shop charges to pay; gas, electric, water, property taxes, permits, phone, etc. I don't figure that in any of my calculations. It's already here, whether I do outside work or not. So my estimates don't include any of those incidentals.

If I hadn't had a major life setback 20 years ago, I might have the exact same business your machinist has. And probably the same pricing...and the same bills...

You pays you money and you takes you chances...

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

That is almost exactly what I would charge, for milling off the bottom ridge and fabricating the T adapter. Assuming no problems, no hardened steel, and the 'customer' had the piece of CRS steel bar stock in his hand along with the assembled buttstock and separate gripframe/receiver.

This was my circumstance, plus I provided the Thompson lower's drawing.

My last employer paid me $28/hr. Figuring your machinist's fee, that would be 6 1/2 hrs work. That doesn't look like 6 1/2 hours to me. Maybe two hours. More likely less.

6 1/2 hrs would be a close estimate for me to do it, given the equipment he had available to do it. Plan, set up, mill the notch on the receiver; lay out the plate, round the back corners, rough cut the notch, plan out the screw holes, drill pilots, clamp in place on receiver, transfer hole centers, drill and tap receiver, clearance drill and countersink holes; then fine tune the notch to fit the stock slot, which may take several tries to get it to fit slick--as it does. Maybe more, for me. Someone who knows what he's doing would definitely take less time.

If it was a must-have right-away part, then price is no object. I assume your guy has shop charges to pay; gas, electric, water, property taxes, permits, phone, etc. I don't figure that in any of my calculations. It's already here, whether I do outside work or not. So my estimates don't include any of those incidentals.

Nope, he does "government work" where he's employed, so no overhead. The budget I'd set was perhaps too liberal, although it totaled much less than the quote of $400-something for a stock, adapter, milling the receiver, and fitting it all together, from the guy who designed and made the last run of Numrich adapter kit plates. He had one left, but would only sell if I bought the stock with it. Since I already had the assembled, finished stock... I can also make myself feel better to know that the $280 total I have in the project is also way less than the extra I would have had to pay to just have bought one with that feature.

My shop rate is $65/hr, which beats the local remaining fab shop. So, at my biz rate, at my pace, I'd have had to charge me about double what he did. Obviously, there's no easy substitute for craft knowledge and skills!

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

My shop rate is $65/hr...

That's well outside my comfort zone!

[ithacaartist]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

That's well outside my comfort zone!

Sorry, Rich, didn't mean to make you uncomfortable. Check the fab shops up there and you'll find the rate comparatively gentle. A fabricator wears many hats, from digging holes to TIG welding. Gotta be part designer, engineer, estimator, woodworker, mason, electrician, machinist, weldor, painter/finisher. etc., including psychotherapist! It's not stuff that nobody else can do, but check out to see if your favorite architect can effectively handle a MIG gun, or even a had drill! It basically requires someone who never made up his mind exactly what to do, so does it all!