Question Regarding Imperial Rod - Page 2

lugerholsterrepair · 06-25-2013, 02:45 PM

Why would anyone bother!!!

Eric..One good reason and one only that I can think of. The 02 Carbine was a civilian Pistol /rifle and as such it employed the grease barrel type cleaning rod. It would really be magical to be able to reproduce an accurate rod for Carbines.

Original Carbine grease barrel rods are like hens teeth and would cost you about $800-1,000. That's IF you ever find one for sale in your lifetime.

cirelaw · 06-25-2013, 03:22 PM

Do we know who produced these wonderful accessories?

Neil Young · 06-25-2013, 04:10 PM

You would bother because it is a challenge. If you successfully build a sterling example, you have accomplished something that very few people could do. It would make you very proud. I know that that sounds a little like BS (or maybe a lot), but it is true.

Neil Young · 06-25-2013, 04:27 PM

..I would guess it would be a tad difficult to accurately make one of these grease barrel rods?

I think you are absolutely right Jerry--it would really be difficult.

Jerry, I can do pretty good on some small, tedious projects, but I am not a really good craftsman. There are people on this forum who are, in my estimation, Master Craftsmen. The two that I can think of offhand are Olle and Postino. I know that there are others that I am forgetting, or just don't know about. Check out some of their work--it's awesome!

cirelaw · 06-25-2013, 05:16 PM

The 1906 French Commercial as seen in Kenyans' book, Lugers At Random, page 106 includes the subject of debate!~~~Eric

sheepherder · 06-25-2013, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Young

There are people on this forum who are, in my estimation, Master Craftsmen. The two that I can think of offhand are Olle and Postino.

...

...

Speed kills, Neil!!!

lugerholsterrepair · 06-25-2013, 06:54 PM

Neil, I am sure you are too bashful..I have seen your work. Having asked you and others to do the impossible..I know.

I should make a list someday..I have done a lot of projects that took real skill.. My Trommel magazine box, wood.. Kris Antzak metal hardware Craig Creswell. Carbine rods and small loop Luger rods, Neil Young. Dutch pin punch, Craig again. I generally take on rare projects and only accept the best. I have many more but will have to put it all together someday.

I will have to say there are many masters of their craft out there. Always a joy to see the fantastic stuff they make.

Ron Wood · 06-25-2013, 07:43 PM

Man, I love this hobby! The master craftsmen listed in the previous posts, including Jerry, contribute so much to the continued enjoyment, preservation and augmentation of items that are part of history. And they are real gentlemen. If you have ever met any of them in person or through correspondence you know that you are in rare company. Thanks guys!

sheepherder · 06-25-2013, 08:02 PM

I am interested in knowing how the machinist that did this grease barrel knurled it with a single-direction knurl???

I've attached a pic of the grease barrel and a scan of knurling rollers...there is basically only two knurls; the crosshatch, and the straight knurl...In different pitches, but that's about it...

The only way I can think of to get a single-direction knurl is using two identical sets of knurl rollers, and use both right rollers or both left rollers, of the cross hatch set...

Even then they would have a tendency to 'ride off' to the side while knurling...

(The clamp type tool post knurling tool in the pic is the one I received; replaces the 'run it in' knurling tool I've used up to now - it is much better)...

And looking close, Neil hit it on the head...That grease barrel is crude...

lugerholsterrepair · 06-25-2013, 08:15 PM

Rich..The single knurling is proclaimed by some in the past to be original and correct but I have never been a proponent of that line of thinking.

Any rod I ever inspected I thought was real had a crosshatch knurl, a fixed rod to the barrel and was finely made. I believe I have one around here..but it's missing the top. I always thought I would stumble across an orphan top but I never have.

sheepherder · 06-25-2013, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

Rich..The single knurling is proclaimed by some in the past to be original and correct but I have never been a proponent of that line of thinking...

The knurl on the barrel top you mean??? Do you know how they did it???

cirelaw · 06-25-2013, 09:29 PM

Does the fact that both are different make any difference in anyones' opinion? Do we know from who produced them and when?

lugerholsterrepair · 06-25-2013, 09:50 PM

Rich..No I don't.

Eric, Both or your rods screw into the barrel and that is what concerns me about them.

cirelaw · 06-25-2013, 09:56 PM

A good point!!!

sheepherder · 06-25-2013, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Young

When you look at that close-up, it is apparent that the work is pretty crude. Even I can do better than that.

I think even Eric can do better than this...I lightened it to show the file marks, emery cloth scratches, gouges, uneven width of clamp...Sorry Eric...

I'm thinking now, from the crude look of the work, that the single knurl cut is from a misaligned knurling tool - only one roller cutting...(Well, displacing the metal actually)...I'm basing that on some of my own mistakes...But I learn, eventually...

By the time I'm 120, I'll have this work down pat...

cirelaw · 06-25-2013, 10:19 PM

I do take some nice close ups!! PS Thats why I went to Law School for three years! A man must know his limitations, wether real or imaginary~~~

LU1900 · 06-26-2013, 03:09 AM

I do some pic in the past about original and repro , here they are from old post :

lugerholsterrepair · 06-26-2013, 11:59 AM

Patrice..I would be very happy to see your photo's with a little better lighting..It's hard to distinguish details in the low light! Thank you though..

sheepherder · 06-26-2013, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

Eric, Both or your rods screw into the barrel and that is what concerns me about them.

...???...Patrice's original screws into the barrel as well...

sheepherder · 06-26-2013, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cirelaw

Why would anyone bother!!!

...Because it is there...

06-25-2013, 02:45 PM	#21
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Why would anyone bother!!! Eric..One good reason and one only that I can think of. The 02 Carbine was a civilian Pistol /rifle and as such it employed the grease barrel type cleaning rod. It would really be magical to be able to reproduce an accurate rod for Carbines. Original Carbine grease barrel rods are like hens teeth and would cost you about $800-1,000. That's IF you ever find one for sale in your lifetime. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-25-2013, 04:10 PM	#23
Neil Young Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Scottsboro, Alabama Posts: 545 Thanks: 559 Thanked 442 Times in 168 Posts	You would bother because it is a challenge. If you successfully build a sterling example, you have accomplished something that very few people could do. It would make you very proud. I know that that sounds a little like BS (or maybe a lot), but it is true. __________________ Neil The hurrier I go the behinder I get. Sometimes it takes me all day to get nothing done.

06-25-2013, 04:27 PM	#24
Neil Young Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Scottsboro, Alabama Posts: 545 Thanks: 559 Thanked 442 Times in 168 Posts	..I would guess it would be a tad difficult to accurately make one of these grease barrel rods? I think you are absolutely right Jerry--it would really be difficult. Jerry, I can do pretty good on some small, tedious projects, but I am not a really good craftsman. There are people on this forum who are, in my estimation, Master Craftsmen. The two that I can think of offhand are Olle and Postino. I know that there are others that I am forgetting, or just don't know about. Check out some of their work--it's awesome! __________________ Neil The hurrier I go the behinder I get. Sometimes it takes me all day to get nothing done. Last edited by Neil Young; 06-25-2013 at 04:51 PM. Reason: added more text

06-25-2013, 05:16 PM	#25
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	It Complete The Package! The 1906 French Commercial as seen in Kenyans' book, Lugers At Random, page 106 includes the subject of debate!~~~Eric Attached Thumbnails

06-25-2013, 06:54 PM	#27
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Neil, I am sure you are too bashful..I have seen your work. Having asked you and others to do the impossible..I know. I should make a list someday..I have done a lot of projects that took real skill.. My Trommel magazine box, wood.. Kris Antzak metal hardware Craig Creswell. Carbine rods and small loop Luger rods, Neil Young. Dutch pin punch, Craig again. I generally take on rare projects and only accept the best. I have many more but will have to put it all together someday. I will have to say there are many masters of their craft out there. Always a joy to see the fantastic stuff they make. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-25-2013, 03:22 PM	#22
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Do we know who produced these wonderful accessories?

06-25-2013, 07:43 PM	#28
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,019 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,173 Times in 1,701 Posts	Man, I love this hobby! The master craftsmen listed in the previous posts, including Jerry, contribute so much to the continued enjoyment, preservation and augmentation of items that are part of history. And they are real gentlemen. If you have ever met any of them in person or through correspondence you know that you are in rare company. Thanks guys! __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-25-2013, 08:02 PM	#29
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,400 Thanked 4,442 Times in 2,330 Posts	I am interested in knowing how the machinist that did this grease barrel knurled it with a single-direction knurl??? I've attached a pic of the grease barrel and a scan of knurling rollers...there is basically only two knurls; the crosshatch, and the straight knurl...In different pitches, but that's about it... The only way I can think of to get a single-direction knurl is using two identical sets of knurl rollers, and use both right rollers or both left rollers, of the cross hatch set... Even then they would have a tendency to 'ride off' to the side while knurling... (The clamp type tool post knurling tool in the pic is the one I received; replaces the 'run it in' knurling tool I've used up to now - it is much better)... And looking close, Neil hit it on the head...That grease barrel is crude... Attached Thumbnails __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

06-25-2013, 08:15 PM	#30
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Rich..The single knurling is proclaimed by some in the past to be original and correct but I have never been a proponent of that line of thinking. Any rod I ever inspected I thought was real had a crosshatch knurl, a fixed rod to the barrel and was finely made. I believe I have one around here..but it's missing the top. I always thought I would stumble across an orphan top but I never have. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-25-2013, 09:29 PM	#32
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Does the fact that both are different make any difference in anyones' opinion? Do we know from who produced them and when? Attached Thumbnails

06-25-2013, 09:50 PM	#33
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Rich..No I don't. Eric, Both or your rods screw into the barrel and that is what concerns me about them. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-25-2013, 09:56 PM	#34
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	A good point!!!

06-25-2013, 10:19 PM	#36
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	I do take some nice close ups!! PS Thats why I went to Law School for three years! A man must know his limitations, wether real or imaginary~~~

06-26-2013, 03:09 AM	#37
LU1900 User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: FRANCE Posts: 908 Thanks: 41 Thanked 469 Times in 197 Posts	I do some pic in the past about original and repro , here they are from old post : Attached Thumbnails __________________ Best regards from France...Patrice https://www.fichier-pdf.fr/2016/03/1...nd-snail-drum/

06-26-2013, 11:59 AM	#38
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Patrice..I would be very happy to see your photo's with a little better lighting..It's hard to distinguish details in the low light! Thank you though.. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."