1902 fat barrel discovered - Page 2

Tomathvl · 11-16-2008, 02:38 PM

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...light=tomathvl

Take a look at this thread. Ken does refinish work for many dealers on the east coast. I don't know about the finish being rough; I tend to agree with Ron but without a hands on it's difficult to evaluate. If I owned this gun I'd have ken look at it and tell me what he thinks it would cost to refinish. He's very reasonable and does such good work and thats why so many dealers use him.
Tom

maddog350gt · 11-17-2008, 06:04 PM

Wayne, nice find on the Fat Barrel.

I agree with most of the information that the other members have given you, with the exception of the value of restored vs non-restored. I have several restored guns, it's not that I am looking for them, but I am not as adverse to them as some collectors. I have always thought it better to have a restored piece in the collection than no piece in the collection. Value of restored Lugers are very much in the eye of the beholder, but I have always used the 50% rule, i.e. a gun restored to 100% of original finish should be worth about 50% of current Blue Book 98-100% value. As rarity increases so does the percentage of value. I would place the value of a restored Fat Barrel at $7,500 to 8,000 if it is high quality work and not just a re-blue. I think your gun would be a good candidate for restoration if you can get one of the quality restores to handle it.

Just my two cents, oh and by the way, I recently purchased a restored Fat Barrel for $6,000 because I thought it was under valued.

Thanks,
Bob M.

wayne8661 · 11-17-2008, 06:10 PM

Bob M Thanks for the insight It will be awhile before I can have it restored anyway, But It will be worth it to have it done i believe. Right now I am just glad to own it.

cma22inc · 11-17-2008, 06:15 PM

I with you on that one.

I would say with your recent tresure find it would be a shame not to get it back into first rate shape.

Looking at the photos I'm in agreement that it appears that its the park that is rough and the metal underneth may well be in better than you expect condition.

wayne8661 · 11-17-2008, 06:19 PM

I have looked at it ander magnification and it is not as pitted as the photos make it appear its mostly on the surface all markings are still crisp even though they look bad in the photos. Can anyone tell me where I can get a clip or at least a repro wood bottom for this? Also I have a holster with this its the brown type with a nuremburg maker.Would this possibly be the original holster that would have come with the pistol?

cma22inc · 11-17-2008, 06:28 PM

I picked up a Mec-Gar (made in italy) mag a while back for my shooter and it works great. Take your original along to compare as they make a few differant styles.

LugerDoc is the man for your replacment wood bottom. He posted back on page 1.

maddog350gt · 11-17-2008, 06:57 PM

Wayne;

I have the name of a guy in Texas that did some restoration work on one of my Navy Lugers. The work he did was excellent, but he didn't know Lugers as well as I thought he did. When I get home I'll send you his contact information you can check with him on availability (it took quite a while to get the work done on the Navy, 6 mos I think). I recommend that you talk with him and then go over each piece of the gun and review what finish you want on it. When he did the Navy he didn't know the 200 sight marking should have been left in the white and not blued. There were also some stampings that had been buffed off that he didn't replace. I was surprized when I had this done that it was not as expensive as I thought it would be. He did a lot of re-contouring on the frame and receiver as it looked like the gun had been buffed and re-blued more than once.

Thanks,
Bob M.

Ron Wood · 11-17-2008, 07:52 PM

Judging from the quality of the finish that Ken Karsted did on Toms shooter Luger, he woud be worth at least a phone call to see what he could do, how long it would take, and how much it would cost. I do not know how much you paid for it in its present condition, but I do not think you would go far wrong in expending at least $1000-$1500 on a good restoration. I think properly restored, the value would be in the neighborhood of previously stated $6000 - or more.

wayne8661 · 11-17-2008, 08:13 PM

Ron this is going to be the part that kills you guys, I didnt pay anything for it I got it as a gift.

Ron Wood · 11-17-2008, 10:20 PM

You're right...I'm dead.

If you have the resources, go for a full-house restoration - you are going to come out waaay ahead. Congratulations.

wayne8661 · 11-17-2008, 10:20 PM

Thank you.

Zamo · 01-02-2009, 04:32 PM

Hey Wayne, what is the current status of this project? Did you ever find someone to restore it? Have you sent it off?

wayne8661 · 01-03-2009, 03:49 PM

Zamo I havent done anything with it yet. I am taking my time with it. Its in good hands now and to be honest I just dont have 3500 to put into it right now. I have 2 American eagles that need restoration the fat barrel and a 1900 so i am thinking it thru what to do next.

wayne8661 · 01-02-2010, 10:42 PM

Okay It has been a while But I just boxed up the fat barrel to send off to Ken Karstead on Monday for an evaluation. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

alvin · 01-02-2010, 11:28 PM

IMO, if bore is excellent, pay $$ to professional restoring it. If not, you can refinish it yourself.

wayne8661 · 01-03-2010, 07:34 PM

The bore is fine I dont think I will be attempting any home remedies on a pistol this rare!!

alvin · 01-03-2010, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wayne8661

The bore is fine I dont think I will be attempting any home remedies on a pistol this rare!!

Then probably worth it. The final result will be more balanced. Please post us a picture when it's done. Most likely, restorers do it at home as well, but they are experienced and skillful on metals, no doubt.

wayne8661 · 01-03-2010, 09:28 PM

I will keep the thread updated with the findings and hopefully the restoration

wayne8661 · 01-07-2010, 04:06 PM

Spoke with Ken today, He recieved the my 1902. He told me that the metal is not in bad shape at all and the only corrosion he could see was a small amount on the barrel, He told me he could have it done in 6 or 7 weeks. I cant wait.

cma22inc · 01-07-2010, 06:26 PM

That is good news!
I think the park job might have saved it from any further damage.

Can't wait to see the job Ken is able to do on it.

11-17-2008, 07:52 PM	#28
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,019 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,173 Times in 1,701 Posts	Judging from the quality of the finish that Ken Karsted did on Toms shooter Luger, he woud be worth at least a phone call to see what he could do, how long it would take, and how much it would cost. I do not know how much you paid for it in its present condition, but I do not think you would go far wrong in expending at least $1000-$1500 on a good restoration. I think properly restored, the value would be in the neighborhood of previously stated $6000 - or more. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

11-17-2008, 10:20 PM	#30
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,019 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,173 Times in 1,701 Posts	You're right...I'm dead. If you have the resources, go for a full-house restoration - you are going to come out waaay ahead. Congratulations. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-02-2009, 04:32 PM	#32
Zamo User Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Washington State Posts: 142 Thanks: 4 Thanked 13 Times in 9 Posts	Hey Wayne, what is the current status of this project? Did you ever find someone to restore it? Have you sent it off? __________________ <INSERT WITTY SAYING HERE> My collection: http://home.comcast.net/~gunspotz/guns.htm

01-07-2010, 06:26 PM	#40
cma22inc User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Tampa Bay FL Posts: 93 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 4 Posts	That is good news! I think the park job might have saved it from any further damage. Can't wait to see the job Ken is able to do on it. __________________ Matt A. Tampa, FL (C&R) Collector

11-16-2008, 02:38 PM	#21
Tomathvl User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Milan, IN Posts: 363 Thanks: 3 Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts	http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...light=tomathvl Take a look at this thread. Ken does refinish work for many dealers on the east coast. I don't know about the finish being rough; I tend to agree with Ron but without a hands on it's difficult to evaluate. If I owned this gun I'd have ken look at it and tell me what he thinks it would cost to refinish. He's very reasonable and does such good work and thats why so many dealers use him. Tom

11-17-2008, 06:04 PM	#22
maddog350gt User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Washougal WA Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Wayne, nice find on the Fat Barrel. I agree with most of the information that the other members have given you, with the exception of the value of restored vs non-restored. I have several restored guns, it's not that I am looking for them, but I am not as adverse to them as some collectors. I have always thought it better to have a restored piece in the collection than no piece in the collection. Value of restored Lugers are very much in the eye of the beholder, but I have always used the 50% rule, i.e. a gun restored to 100% of original finish should be worth about 50% of current Blue Book 98-100% value. As rarity increases so does the percentage of value. I would place the value of a restored Fat Barrel at $7,500 to 8,000 if it is high quality work and not just a re-blue. I think your gun would be a good candidate for restoration if you can get one of the quality restores to handle it. Just my two cents, oh and by the way, I recently purchased a restored Fat Barrel for $6,000 because I thought it was under valued. Thanks, Bob M.

11-17-2008, 06:10 PM	#23
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Bob M Thanks for the insight It will be awhile before I can have it restored anyway, But It will be worth it to have it done i believe. Right now I am just glad to own it.

11-17-2008, 06:15 PM	#24
cma22inc User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Tampa Bay FL Posts: 93 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 4 Posts	I with you on that one. I would say with your recent tresure find it would be a shame not to get it back into first rate shape. Looking at the photos I'm in agreement that it appears that its the park that is rough and the metal underneth may well be in better than you expect condition.

11-17-2008, 06:19 PM	#25
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	I have looked at it ander magnification and it is not as pitted as the photos make it appear its mostly on the surface all markings are still crisp even though they look bad in the photos. Can anyone tell me where I can get a clip or at least a repro wood bottom for this? Also I have a holster with this its the brown type with a nuremburg maker.Would this possibly be the original holster that would have come with the pistol?

11-17-2008, 06:28 PM	#26
cma22inc User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Tampa Bay FL Posts: 93 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 4 Posts	I picked up a Mec-Gar (made in italy) mag a while back for my shooter and it works great. Take your original along to compare as they make a few differant styles. LugerDoc is the man for your replacment wood bottom. He posted back on page 1.

11-17-2008, 06:57 PM	#27
maddog350gt User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Washougal WA Posts: 170 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Wayne; I have the name of a guy in Texas that did some restoration work on one of my Navy Lugers. The work he did was excellent, but he didn't know Lugers as well as I thought he did. When I get home I'll send you his contact information you can check with him on availability (it took quite a while to get the work done on the Navy, 6 mos I think). I recommend that you talk with him and then go over each piece of the gun and review what finish you want on it. When he did the Navy he didn't know the 200 sight marking should have been left in the white and not blued. There were also some stampings that had been buffed off that he didn't replace. I was surprized when I had this done that it was not as expensive as I thought it would be. He did a lot of re-contouring on the frame and receiver as it looked like the gun had been buffed and re-blued more than once. Thanks, Bob M.

11-17-2008, 08:13 PM	#29
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Ron this is going to be the part that kills you guys, I didnt pay anything for it I got it as a gift.

01-03-2009, 03:49 PM	#33
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Zamo I havent done anything with it yet. I am taking my time with it. Its in good hands now and to be honest I just dont have 3500 to put into it right now. I have 2 American eagles that need restoration the fat barrel and a 1900 so i am thinking it thru what to do next.

01-02-2010, 10:42 PM	#34
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Okay It has been a while But I just boxed up the fat barrel to send off to Ken Karstead on Monday for an evaluation. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

01-02-2010, 11:28 PM	#35
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	IMO, if bore is excellent, pay $$ to professional restoring it. If not, you can refinish it yourself.

01-03-2010, 07:34 PM	#36
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	The bore is fine I dont think I will be attempting any home remedies on a pistol this rare!!

01-03-2010, 09:28 PM	#38
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	I will keep the thread updated with the findings and hopefully the restoration

01-07-2010, 04:06 PM	#39
wayne8661 User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Kennett Square Pennsylvania Posts: 591 Thanks: 15 Thanked 334 Times in 104 Posts	Spoke with Ken today, He recieved the my 1902. He told me that the metal is not in bad shape at all and the only corrosion he could see was a small amount on the barrel, He told me he could have it done in 6 or 7 weeks. I cant wait.