1900 Test Eagle? - Page 2

deepdarkwoodsman · 11-30-2011, 04:50 PM

I agree with you, Ron. I have been following this thread and I haven't been completely convinced this is a reblue.

Doug

DavidJayUden · 11-30-2011, 05:46 PM

Is this one blue on the muzzle and under the safety?
dju

Ron Wood · 11-30-2011, 06:16 PM

According to Mike, the safety area is blued...hence his assessment that it is a reblue. I would again withhold judgment until I saw a good photo of the safety area. Many bright polished safety areas on early guns have darkened over time, so a close gun in hand examination is needed if a photo is not conclusive.

Hugo Borchardt · 11-30-2011, 11:53 PM

Very nice test piece! Congratulations! Ron was this number already on Dwights list?

MFC · 12-01-2011, 09:42 PM

Pics of the reblue...
Safety area
Barrel
Toggle lock catch on frame rail. You should be able to see the solder lines on an original finish.

sheepherder · 12-02-2011, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MFC

Toggle lock catch on frame rail. You should be able to see the solder lines on an original finish.

That's interesting...What parts are soldered on that toggle lock (or catch)???

alanint · 12-02-2011, 07:51 AM

The part is dovetailed into the frame but is silver soldered into place upon fitting. There is usually a dicernable line at the metal/metal joint where the solder is visible.

cirelaw · 12-02-2011, 09:51 AM

Heres up and down!

John Sabato · 12-02-2011, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugo Borchardt

Very nice test piece! Congratulations! Ron was this number already on Dwights list?

Hey Ron, (or Dwight?) Just in case you missed this question...

Was this serial number already on the list?

MFC · 12-02-2011, 11:07 AM

toggle lock latch on frame rail...

cirelaw · 12-02-2011, 12:12 PM

An Ansel Adams Moment!

cirelaw · 12-02-2011, 12:40 PM

It will show up if the gun was fired. Its more pronounced as the gun is used. Next to no wear, is questionable!

Ron Wood · 12-02-2011, 12:50 PM

It was not on my list, I don't know about Dwight's but we usually are in sync.

cirelaw · 12-02-2011, 01:02 PM

This is an unfired or recently reblued. In this case is a 1937 Krieghoff which doesnt appear to be used! A picture of the rear will tell everything.

Lugerdoc · 12-03-2011, 01:08 PM

There appears to be some damage to the left side frame ramp of the M1900. The frame piece of the toggle lock looks normal, although I do have this piece in stock if needed. TH

MFC · 12-03-2011, 09:19 PM

Tom,
Are you refering to Eric's (cirelaw) or mine? I don't see any damage to either one.

Dwight Gruber · 12-06-2011, 08:41 PM

New number.

Also, I'm not entirely sure the toggle latch is silver soldered. I was always under the impression that it is a hard-press fit sufficient to compress the metal surface enough to cause the halo effect.

--Dwight

Ron Wood · 12-07-2011, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dwight Gruber

Also, I'm not entirely sure the toggle latch is silver soldered. I was always under the impression that it is a hard-press fit sufficient to compress the metal surface enough to cause the halo effect.

--Dwight

You may very well be correct. But I have never seen the halo effect without some deformation of the adjacent metal. The area around the toggle latch is dead flat. I am not entirely sure either but I err on the side of silver solder.

alanint · 12-07-2011, 07:13 AM

I doubt any assembly that was designed to have a toggle hook violently yanking on it on a regular basis would be simply press fitted in. I have always believed they were silver soldered in, which would have been the practice at that time and could be reversed with heat.

Lugerdoc · 12-07-2011, 11:06 AM

Dwight, I agree with you --- just a tight fit in the dove tail cut. I've removed and installed several of these. The toggle lock was originally designed to prevent the toggle from opening prematurely on recoil, but it was later determined that cartridge ignition actually force the toggle DOWN into the frame, so the lock was unnecessary and eliminated on the M1906. Just another example of German over-engineering. TH

11-30-2011, 06:16 PM	#23
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,178 Times in 1,703 Posts	According to Mike, the safety area is blued...hence his assessment that it is a reblue. I would again withhold judgment until I saw a good photo of the safety area. Many bright polished safety areas on early guns have darkened over time, so a close gun in hand examination is needed if a photo is not conclusive. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

11-30-2011, 11:53 PM	#24
Hugo Borchardt User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 370 Thanks: 339 Thanked 133 Times in 47 Posts	Very nice test piece! Congratulations! Ron was this number already on Dwights list? __________________ My militaria collection is dedicated to the memory of my Grandfather, Marine Gunnery Sergeant Dave Hill, Jr., wounded in action at The Assault of the Second Marine Division on Betio Island, Tarawa Atoll, 20-23 November, 1943. http://www.tarawa1943.com/pages/casualties%20tarawa.htm

12-01-2011, 09:42 PM	#25
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	Pics of the reblue... Safety area Barrel Toggle lock catch on frame rail. You should be able to see the solder lines on an original finish. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Mike C.

12-02-2011, 09:51 AM	#28
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	What are you referring to!! Heres up and down! Attached Thumbnails

12-02-2011, 11:07 AM	#30
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	toggle lock latch on frame rail... Attached Thumbnails __________________ Mike C.

11-30-2011, 04:50 PM	#21
deepdarkwoodsman User Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 38 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 1 Post	I agree with you, Ron. I have been following this thread and I haven't been completely convinced this is a reblue. Doug

11-30-2011, 05:46 PM	#22
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Is this one blue on the muzzle and under the safety? dju

12-02-2011, 07:51 AM	#27
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	The part is dovetailed into the frame but is silver soldered into place upon fitting. There is usually a dicernable line at the metal/metal joint where the solder is visible.

12-02-2011, 12:12 PM	#31
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	Imagine That! An Ansel Adams Moment! Attached Thumbnails

12-02-2011, 12:40 PM	#32
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	This Is Your Normal Wear Pattern It will show up if the gun was fired. Its more pronounced as the gun is used. Next to no wear, is questionable! Attached Thumbnails

12-02-2011, 12:50 PM	#33
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,178 Times in 1,703 Posts	It was not on my list, I don't know about Dwight's but we usually are in sync. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

12-02-2011, 01:02 PM	#34
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	This is an unfired or recently reblued. In this case is a 1937 Krieghoff which doesnt appear to be used! A picture of the rear will tell everything. Attached Thumbnails

12-03-2011, 01:08 PM	#35
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	There appears to be some damage to the left side frame ramp of the M1900. The frame piece of the toggle lock looks normal, although I do have this piece in stock if needed. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

12-03-2011, 09:19 PM	#36
MFC User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Louisiana Posts: 1,237 Thanks: 183 Thanked 281 Times in 162 Posts	Tom, Are you refering to Eric's (cirelaw) or mine? I don't see any damage to either one. __________________ Mike C.

12-06-2011, 08:41 PM	#37
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,902 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,317 Times in 431 Posts	New number. Also, I'm not entirely sure the toggle latch is silver soldered. I was always under the impression that it is a hard-press fit sufficient to compress the metal surface enough to cause the halo effect. --Dwight

12-07-2011, 07:13 AM	#39
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	I doubt any assembly that was designed to have a toggle hook violently yanking on it on a regular basis would be simply press fitted in. I have always believed they were silver soldered in, which would have been the practice at that time and could be reversed with heat.

12-07-2011, 11:06 AM	#40
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Dwight, I agree with you --- just a tight fit in the dove tail cut. I've removed and installed several of these. The toggle lock was originally designed to prevent the toggle from opening prematurely on recoil, but it was later determined that cartridge ignition actually force the toggle DOWN into the frame, so the lock was unnecessary and eliminated on the M1906. Just another example of German over-engineering. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net