Neatsfoot oil for Holster?

[David Jackson]

This thread has been on the forum before. I got the very strong impresseion that the best thing to do to an old collectible holster is ... NOTHING! Keep it out of the sun in a nice cozy place, don't squish it and that is that.

Of course I am not an leather expert, a chemist, or any of those things ...

If the holster were new and something I wanted to actually use maybe the story would be different.

FWIW

[lugerholsterrepair]

Dave I understand where you are coming from and just because Jaguar or Rolls Royce uses Hide care on their leather seats does not make it a great preservative. I have no degrees in chemistry and because of that I keep an open mind when people who do share their knowledge of such things. However I do have experience in working leather and I knopw that when vegetable tanned leather gets wet it dries to a stiff un-useable board and has to have some treatment to bring it back to life. What would you recomend for this application? The Hide Care product does not list any ingredients at all. I agree with Jhonny Peppers that I have treated leather for years and have observed no deteriazation or crumbling on good solid leather. Crumbly leather to start out with and I hesitate to treat it at all for fear of softening the piece and causing further damage. There is a difference between leather that has it's surface skin intact and leather that is cracked and split. Any ideas on this subject are welcome to me but I am not sure your do nothing approach is the best one for many collectors. That being said I want to agree that one must be careful about what to apply and how much. Storage is another issue and has been discussed by many knowledgable Forum Members here. It is important to pay attention to storage conditions for proper conservation. Thanks all for your input. Jerry Burney


The

[BILL]

David, that is what I have always heard. If it is a good leather artifact then leave it alone. If it is a shabby thing with little value then it is OK to try to 'pretty' it up and 'feed and caress' it since it does not have much value to lose. I think that the reason there are any minty specimens of Lugers and holsters is that people didn't fuss so much with them in the past (they survived their owners attentions). In other words, we as collectors can be our own worst enemies.

Thanks for the comments, JB. I never stated "do nothing" and that is where I would like everyone to begin reexamining their thinking. I suggest at least four specific things to be done to preserve (preserve, not alter) the condition, and of course value, of an old leather artifact. You mention some leather that has been water damaged. You might not want to preserve that as is but applying a chemical treatment may or may not have a positive effect. In general, water or other things that dry/stiffen a holster has removed some material or property of the tanned leather. Hence, the fibers have high degree of contact cross-fiber. Oils or other petroleum-based products primarily do two things if you read all the marketing claims about the products. First, they soften the leather (make "supple", plyable, etc.). This is accomplished by putting the fibers in an organic solvent that dissolves some of the cross-fiber attachments. Collagen is the principle protein in leather fiber and a solvent severs some of the cross-fiber attachments plus reduces the molecular attraction cross-fibers enabling fibers to once again slide along each other. Hence the flexibility. This enables leather shaping and movement. If you don't need to do this, the treatment is not appropriate. For slings and other misshapen items, it may be useful.


The second use of the petroleum-based treatments is water resistance. Because water and oil are not miscible, the water does not penetrate the leather easily. This is helpful for shoes and coats that are in active use in the rain. This is a weak benefit because leather is highly pourous and it takes a high boiling point (grease or wax like Pecards) product to have much effect. It is not helpful for antique items in a dry indoor environment.


There is a third and cosmetic benefit that is often mentioned but is an indirect side-effect. Petroleum products on leather will make them shiny. This is the same optical effect achieved when lubing a luger's metal surfaces. Unfortunately, with this comes darkening of the leather.


I appreciate your comments JB and have studied the leather product contents for some time to arrive at these conclusions. I do not want to suggest a "do nothing" approach, though. I am concerned that some people can not leave something alone and end up damaging an item that was fine to begin with. Although we should demand that we know what is in a product before we use it on a valuable and prized part of our collection, at the very least we can follow the first rule of conservation:


DO NOTHING YOU CAN NOT REVERSE


Thanks,

Dave

The jar states Lanolin waxy cream containing white spirit. Safety precautions. Store at room temperature. Keep container tightly closed. Keep out of reach of chrildren. Non-Hazardous mixture. Do not induce vomiting if swallowed. Keep ar rest and call physician. "CONNOLLY HIDE CARE" Made for preserving Connoly Hide Upholstery, Leather goods and Clothing. Made in England

Bill, that is a great comment. Leather that is far gone, unless associated with some special person or historical event, won't suffer a lot of value loss by tinkering. What is damaging is the tinkering collectors do to high condition specimens, sometimes mint specimens. Perhaps 1/2 of the holsters I see are damaged by attempts to "improve" the holster. In the past two months, I have see two US M1916 holsters that were absolutely flat mint except for a wide streak of oily dark leather across the flap. The oily streak was an attempt to stop/restore the cracking by applying Pecards or oil. One holster was cracking through and leather would fall off if you picked up the holster. The other was recently oiled and not yet crumbling. Both holsters could have been preserved in mint condition by simply storing them with the flap wide open (not folded and buttoned shut).


To the person who took his holster to a shop and had it oiled up, sure it looked pretty outside. Did you look inside and note the dark oily inside leather surface? Not pretty at all and a giveaway to experienced collectors. That holster will crack and rot much faster than if it was properly cared for.


It is best to avoid the urge to improve everything until you know what you are doing. Also be choosy about whose advice you take. Many collectors listen to the old sages at gun shows and do rediculous things to their collections. I watched a guy at a show rub the finish off a 1910 DWM with TS grip strap markings because an old goof at the show told him a razor blade was how to remove surface rust. He removed the rust, the blue and some of the surface, too. I can't think of a place more soaked in BS than a gun show--before risking a one-of-a-kind piece of history, check the credentials of your information sources regarding care of the item.


Thanks to everyone for a great set of questions and comments. Holsters, and historic preservation generally, are things about which I have passionate opinions and have devoted a lot of time to studying. It is a lot of fun and I encourage others to join in.


Dave

[Johnny Peppers]

And when we are all of the same opinion that Ford makes the best car, McDonalds the best hamburger, and that Bill Clinton was the best President ever, we will all be using the same thing on our collectible leather.

[Johnny Peppers]