New Kreighoff Side Frame Commercial

Lugers down under · 05-01-2003, 08:19 PM

As promised, some photos of my latest acquisition, Kreighoff commercial.
Side frame inscribed P code variation serial number P893.

Commercial proof c/n on the barrel, frame and chamber.
It has the star rejection mark on the right hand side chamber.

Matching numbers including the magazine.

Brown Plastic Grips. 99% original blue all over with very minor holster wear on the
barrel end. Bore is excellent, Two tiny scratches on the concave surface of one of the aluminium magazine base. Gun is identical to the one shown on page 284 of Jan C Still book on Nazi period Lugers.
Any questions?
Regards
Murray.

John D. · 05-02-2003, 01:05 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Lugers down under:
As promised.....Any questions?.....<hr /></blockquote>You are kidding with "any questions"....??????

O U T S T A N D I N G Murray.....

When I recover my senses - I'll post a few... BUT, that SF HK is simply outstanding..... Can you take a pic of the RH side? Also - have you taken the grips off - and if so, what are the stamps in there....

Mine is in the 100 block - and not nearly in the condition of yours.....

Fantastic......

Thanks for posting these Murray - you made my day... No - you made my week... On second thought - you made my month....

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Lugers down under · 05-02-2003, 02:54 AM

Thanks John,
Here is the right side with the grips removed.
There are no marks other than the same proof marks as seen on the rest of the gun
There was no pitting or sign that there ever has been any pitting under the grips,
See below.

Here is a close up showing the little star.

Imperial Arms · 05-02-2003, 03:58 AM

Murray,

Congratulations on your superb and very rare SF Krieghoff! What beautiful straw on the various parts and the fire-blue on the grip screws. You always seem to find those special Lugers 'down under', and I would have never imagined such a fine Kreighoff surfacing in your area of the world. I wonder how you will surprise us the next time?

Can you please try to explain the loss of blue on the right side of the middle toggle link for a pistol in such fine condition? I am not doubting the authenticity of your pistol, but does this anomaly have any connection with these SF Krieghoff Lugers being rejected pieces. Maybe John D. can give some additional insight and further explanation on these rejected SF Krieghoffs.

Second question: How is the matching magazine serialled to the pistol - 'P893' or '893'?

Third question: How much?!!

Well done,
Albert

Lugers down under · 05-02-2003, 04:33 AM

Thanks for your interest Albert,
Yes, there is a slight amount of loss of blue on the right side of the centre toggle joint.
Maybe this was the cause of the rejection.
Here is a close up of the side frame inscription.

The magazine only has the gun numbers, no "P"
How much?
You tell me how much I should have paid for it and then I will tell you how much I did pay.
Kind regards
Murray.

John Sabato · 05-02-2003, 11:42 AM

Hey John D.

You need to add that great gif file:

to the inbedded smilie faces... it is not as great as this wonderful Krieghoff, but still pretty neat.

Congrats Murray! Your good fortune in the hunt for pristine Lugers never ceases to amaze me.

Edward Tinker · 05-02-2003, 12:01 PM

Great pistol Murray!

Ed

Big Norm · 05-02-2003, 09:52 PM

Murry,
I also have a nice P-code w/side inscription (#P792). Thanks, you gave me a good excuse to look at it and check it out. Lucky you, you have a matching magazine. Unlucky me, I don't. I am happy that you mentioned that your magazine did not have a 'P' in from of the serial number. I have been unsuccessful trying to find the magazine maybe because I was looking for the 'P' in front of the serial number.
My three pointed rejection star (possible badly punched five pointed) is on the right hand side of the frame near the barrel. My C/N's are on the bottom of the barrel, side frame on the finger, top left hand side of the front toggle and on the left hand side of the frame just in front of the serial number. My side inscription looks just like yours but shallower. Mine is a 30 cal.
The only difference that I can see between our guns is under the barrel. We both have the C/N but you seem to have an eagle under yours and I have 755 followed by some unintelligible engraving. Possible small cap 'm'. No eagle.
If anyone should happen to care, I paid $50 American plus a pack of Lucky Strike cigarettes to some wino in Detroit.
Big Norm

John D. · 05-02-2003, 11:11 PM

(Sorry for the delayed reply - but just got home - and I've been waiting to see this forum ALL DAY!!!

)

Murray.........

Outstanding!!!!

What I was wondering (and why I asked) - under the grips, RH Side - if you had an "A" or "G" or star (4/5). I have seen a two with a "7" as well.... The "7" appears at the read top left on the RH side - or on the flat near the grip screw.

Also - it's not uncommon to see most with an unmarked mag - or with a mag with the "P". As well. These CAN be off by a few digets - if marked....

The Left/forward of the breechblock were marked several ways - horizontal or vertical. Yours is the more common type - which is interesting as well...

Barrel stamps are excellent - Crown N over the LwAa2 stamp - correct orientation.... Excellent...

Straw - HOLEEEE SMOOOKES!!!!!

OUTSTANDING!!!!

Inscription - outstanding. Correct "a" "f" and "e". Spacing is correct on the "Suhl" and the line up of the "S" - and the "l" is just short of the "r" down-drop just above... Yes - it is an original.

Price??? Hmmm - in the US...??? Low - $5800 in an 85%. Recent high - $7800 - almost as nice as yours....

Couple of notes - LH Toggle ear? Is that wear or blue - or the photo? Toggle chain - yep - that's late production of the run (you have a higher serial # - which makes sense...)...

Top of the toggle ears are correct as well - should be a "plum"... Yours are

Anyway - these are my first thoughts - simply off the top of my head... Let me spend some time tomorrow going through the pics in some detail - and your points, OK???

Murray - simply OUTSTANDING!!!!

John D. · 05-06-2003, 01:56 PM

Hi Murray.!

Right side - under the grip - top left:

Is that a proof, letter, star - or just a machining mark??

Yes - I'm still drooling all over your pics

05-01-2003, 08:19 PM	#1
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	New Kreighoff Side Frame Commercial As promised, some photos of my latest acquisition, Kreighoff commercial. Side frame inscribed P code variation serial number P893. Commercial proof c/n on the barrel, frame and chamber. It has the star rejection mark on the right hand side chamber. Matching numbers including the magazine. Brown Plastic Grips. 99% original blue all over with very minor holster wear on the barrel end. Bore is excellent, Two tiny scratches on the concave surface of one of the aluminium magazine base. Gun is identical to the one shown on page 284 of Jan C Still book on Nazi period Lugers. Any questions? Regards Murray. __________________ Lugers down under

05-02-2003, 01:05 AM	#2
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 477 Thanked 515 Times in 128 Posts	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Lugers down under: <strong>As promised.....Any questions?.....</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">You are kidding with "any questions"....?????? O U T S T A N D I N G Murray..... When I recover my senses - I'll post a few... BUT, that SF HK is simply outstanding..... Can you take a pic of the RH side? Also - have you taken the grips off - and if so, what are the stamps in there.... Mine is in the 100 block - and not nearly in the condition of yours..... Fantastic...... Thanks for posting these Murray - you made my day... No - you made my week... On second thought - you made my month.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

05-02-2003, 02:54 AM	#3
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Thanks John, Here is the right side with the grips removed. There are no marks other than the same proof marks as seen on the rest of the gun There was no pitting or sign that there ever has been any pitting under the grips, See below. Here is a close up showing the little star. __________________ Lugers down under

05-02-2003, 04:33 AM	#5
Lugers down under User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Great Barrier Island, New Zealand Posts: 228 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Thanks for your interest Albert, Yes, there is a slight amount of loss of blue on the right side of the centre toggle joint. Maybe this was the cause of the rejection. Here is a close up of the side frame inscription. The magazine only has the gun numbers, no "P" How much? You tell me how much I should have paid for it and then I will tell you how much I did pay. Kind regards Murray. __________________ Lugers down under

05-02-2003, 11:42 AM	#6
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	Hey John D. You need to add that great gif file: to the inbedded smilie faces... it is not as great as this wonderful Krieghoff, but still pretty neat. Congrats Murray! Your good fortune in the hunt for pristine Lugers never ceases to amaze me. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

05-02-2003, 03:58 AM	#4
Imperial Arms Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Malta, EU Posts: 579 Thanks: 0 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	Murray, Congratulations on your superb and very rare SF Krieghoff! What beautiful straw on the various parts and the fire-blue on the grip screws. You always seem to find those special Lugers 'down under', and I would have never imagined such a fine Kreighoff surfacing in your area of the world. I wonder how you will surprise us the next time? Can you please try to explain the loss of blue on the right side of the middle toggle link for a pistol in such fine condition? I am not doubting the authenticity of your pistol, but does this anomaly have any connection with these SF Krieghoff Lugers being rejected pieces. Maybe John D. can give some additional insight and further explanation on these rejected SF Krieghoffs. Second question: How is the matching magazine serialled to the pistol - 'P893' or '893'? Third question: How much?!! Well done, Albert

05-02-2003, 12:01 PM	#7
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,929 Thanks: 2,029 Thanked 4,527 Times in 2,090 Posts	Great pistol Murray! Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

05-02-2003, 09:52 PM	#8
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Murry, I also have a nice P-code w/side inscription (#P792). Thanks, you gave me a good excuse to look at it and check it out. Lucky you, you have a matching magazine. Unlucky me, I don't. I am happy that you mentioned that your magazine did not have a 'P' in from of the serial number. I have been unsuccessful trying to find the magazine maybe because I was looking for the 'P' in front of the serial number. My three pointed rejection star (possible badly punched five pointed) is on the right hand side of the frame near the barrel. My C/N's are on the bottom of the barrel, side frame on the finger, top left hand side of the front toggle and on the left hand side of the frame just in front of the serial number. My side inscription looks just like yours but shallower. Mine is a 30 cal. The only difference that I can see between our guns is under the barrel. We both have the C/N but you seem to have an eagle under yours and I have 755 followed by some unintelligible engraving. Possible small cap 'm'. No eagle. If anyone should happen to care, I paid $50 American plus a pack of Lucky Strike cigarettes to some wino in Detroit. Big Norm

05-02-2003, 11:11 PM	#9
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 477 Thanked 515 Times in 128 Posts	(Sorry for the delayed reply - but just got home - and I've been waiting to see this forum ALL DAY!!! ) Murray......... Outstanding!!!! What I was wondering (and why I asked) - under the grips, RH Side - if you had an "A" or "G" or star (4/5). I have seen a two with a "7" as well.... The "7" appears at the read top left on the RH side - or on the flat near the grip screw. Also - it's not uncommon to see most with an unmarked mag - or with a mag with the "P". As well. These CAN be off by a few digets - if marked.... The Left/forward of the breechblock were marked several ways - horizontal or vertical. Yours is the more common type - which is interesting as well... Barrel stamps are excellent - Crown N over the LwAa2 stamp - correct orientation.... Excellent... Straw - HOLEEEE SMOOOKES!!!!! OUTSTANDING!!!! Inscription - outstanding. Correct "a" "f" and "e". Spacing is correct on the "Suhl" and the line up of the "S" - and the "l" is just short of the "r" down-drop just above... Yes - it is an original. Price??? Hmmm - in the US...??? Low - $5800 in an 85%. Recent high - $7800 - almost as nice as yours.... Couple of notes - LH Toggle ear? Is that wear or blue - or the photo? Toggle chain - yep - that's late production of the run (you have a higher serial # - which makes sense...)... Top of the toggle ears are correct as well - should be a "plum"... Yours are Anyway - these are my first thoughts - simply off the top of my head... Let me spend some time tomorrow going through the pics in some detail - and your points, OK??? Murray - simply OUTSTANDING!!!!

05-06-2003, 01:56 PM	#10
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 477 Thanked 515 Times in 128 Posts	Hi Murray.! Right side - under the grip - top left: Is that a proof, letter, star - or just a machining mark?? Yes - I'm still drooling all over your pics