1937 s/42 questions

trigger643 · 11-17-2004, 05:42 PM

I have an opportunity to purchase a 1937 s/42 in the t serial # range. Gun is the property of a veteran and comes with a notorized letter, but no capture papers. The veteran claims he has not reblued this gun and has had it since he took it from a german sgt in early 1945. I rate this gun blue @ 98%, straw 60%, comes with 1 police magazine which does not match, drop eagle "2" marking on holster, I can't read maker, and is matching, including grips, except for magazine. but here are my questions...

1. Would the bluing method used in 1937 be shinier than say, 1938 or 41? This appears to be an almost deep commercial type blue. There is no smudging of markings (except on the right side proof marks, I assume these were applied before the final polish?). Halo is evident on "1937", serial#s, "s/42" on toggle. Edges are crisp. There is thining on the grip straps, on muzzle, but little wear.

2. Would the toggle pins be fire blued? These are.

He's asking $1,100.00. I don't doubt this fellow's story. I'm just concerned about his memory.

Tomathvl · 11-17-2004, 10:42 PM

Trigger643,
According to Jan Still in "Third Reich Lugers" you're looking at a subvariation 1 that was rust blued and had strawed parts. Later 1937 models were hot salt blued and did not have strawed parts. Rust blue is a much nicer looking finish. I'm not sure about the toggle pins but I believe so. IMO, based on your assessment of condition the piece with the holster is worth the asking price.
Tom
Tom

jamese · 11-18-2004, 07:56 AM

Trigger,
I have a 1937 1st variation in the q block. The pins are fire blue with straw small parts.

Jim

Lugerdoc · 11-18-2004, 10:22 AM

Trigger, Depending on the condition of the E/2 marked Luftwaffe holster, it may be worth $500 by itself. TH

trigger643 · 11-18-2004, 06:16 PM

"My name is Donald E Zahn. I was a PFC when I parachuted into Normandy on D.Day and discharged a 1st Lt. in 1945. This history of this Lugger [sic]is contained in part under my name in the books "Vanguard of the Crusades" and "The 101st Airborne in Normanday" written by Mark Bando. The Lugger [sic] was obtained from a German Sgt. in a group of prisoners captured on patrol with Lt. Richard Meason to contact a unit with communications as we had none at our location.

Donald E. Zahn /s/

(witnessed by notary 9-29-04).

trigger643 · 11-18-2004, 06:39 PM

Sorry this picture is not very good. We are still unpacking from our move 3 weeks ago and I don't know where my other camera is yet (nor most of my socks, books, the phone...). Now that I have this sucker home, I'm going to rate the bluing at around 98% and strawing around 90%. matching. Holster is marked inside (maybe-- it is hard to read) "Alein Eger Schimilkalden" or something like that, and a drop eagle "2". Leather is in excellent condition, however, stitching on the rear flap has come undone and it could use a dose of Jerry's magic restorative powers. It is fairly scuffed all over, but not cut. a Crack is present in the mag pouch. The magazine is the nickeled type with aluminum bottom marked with "1." followed by "1930" -- serial # not the gun. still looks like a police mag to me.

trigger643 · 11-18-2004, 09:57 PM

trigger643 · 11-18-2004, 10:12 PM

now if I can find my socks and phone I'm in business

Edward Tinker · 11-19-2004, 02:05 AM

We moved 8 months ago, found the socks, no phone

Mark Bandos website, very cool

http://www.101airborneww2.com/index.html

Especially go see the the souvenirs part of the site!

Ed

Ida-Alp · 11-19-2004, 09:38 AM

Ed--Thanks for the heads up on a GREAT website--Al

trigger643 · 11-30-2004, 09:11 PM

got to talk with the vet further last night about the circumstances surrounding this piece. They had engaged a german paratrooper unit earlier in the day, then captured about dozen soldiers, many of whom were hungarian volunteers. The pistol was taken from one of these prisoners. This happened within the first couple of days of D-Day. Later, a holster was acquired to put it in. As he brought back several Lugers at the end of the war, he admits it's possible the magazines got switched or there may have not been one with the pistol when he took it. He stated many times when they had prisoners it was just too much of a hassle to get them to undo their belt, so they often took just the pistols, leaving the holster with the wearer. He's liquidated almost his entire collection of Nazi Booty and this was his last fire-arm.

DougT · 11-30-2004, 09:34 PM

Trigger, remember what they say about snoozing and loosing. I think this is a very nice Luger--go for it!
DougT

11-17-2004, 05:42 PM	#1
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	1937 s/42 questions I have an opportunity to purchase a 1937 s/42 in the t serial # range. Gun is the property of a veteran and comes with a notorized letter, but no capture papers. The veteran claims he has not reblued this gun and has had it since he took it from a german sgt in early 1945. I rate this gun blue @ 98%, straw 60%, comes with 1 police magazine which does not match, drop eagle "2" marking on holster, I can't read maker, and is matching, including grips, except for magazine. but here are my questions... 1. Would the bluing method used in 1937 be shinier than say, 1938 or 41? This appears to be an almost deep commercial type blue. There is no smudging of markings (except on the right side proof marks, I assume these were applied before the final polish?). Halo is evident on "1937", serial#s, "s/42" on toggle. Edges are crisp. There is thining on the grip straps, on muzzle, but little wear. 2. Would the toggle pins be fire blued? These are. He's asking $1,100.00. I don't doubt this fellow's story. I'm just concerned about his memory. __________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-18-2004, 07:56 AM	#3
jamese User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Florida Posts: 789 Thanks: 0 Thanked 84 Times in 34 Posts	Trigger, I have a 1937 1st variation in the q block. The pins are fire blue with straw small parts. Jim __________________ The "truth" is a matter of Perception

11-18-2004, 10:22 AM	#4
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Trigger, Depending on the condition of the E/2 marked Luftwaffe holster, it may be worth $500 by itself. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

11-18-2004, 06:16 PM	#5
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	"My name is Donald E Zahn. I was a PFC when I parachuted into Normandy on D.Day and discharged a 1st Lt. in 1945. This history of this Lugger [sic]is contained in part under my name in the books "Vanguard of the Crusades" and "The 101st Airborne in Normanday" written by Mark Bando. The Lugger [sic] was obtained from a German Sgt. in a group of prisoners captured on patrol with Lt. Richard Meason to contact a unit with communications as we had none at our location. Donald E. Zahn /s/ (witnessed by notary 9-29-04). __________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-18-2004, 06:39 PM	#6
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Sorry this picture is not very good. We are still unpacking from our move 3 weeks ago and I don't know where my other camera is yet (nor most of my socks, books, the phone...). Now that I have this sucker home, I'm going to rate the bluing at around 98% and strawing around 90%. matching. Holster is marked inside (maybe-- it is hard to read) "Alein Eger Schimilkalden" or something like that, and a drop eagle "2". Leather is in excellent condition, however, stitching on the rear flap has come undone and it could use a dose of Jerry's magic restorative powers. It is fairly scuffed all over, but not cut. a Crack is present in the mag pouch. The magazine is the nickeled type with aluminum bottom marked with "1." followed by "1930" -- serial # not the gun. still looks like a police mag to me. __________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-17-2004, 10:42 PM	#2
Tomathvl User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Milan, IN Posts: 363 Thanks: 3 Thanked 48 Times in 19 Posts	Trigger643, According to Jan Still in "Third Reich Lugers" you're looking at a subvariation 1 that was rust blued and had strawed parts. Later 1937 models were hot salt blued and did not have strawed parts. Rust blue is a much nicer looking finish. I'm not sure about the toggle pins but I believe so. IMO, based on your assessment of condition the piece with the holster is worth the asking price. Tom Tom

11-18-2004, 09:57 PM	#7
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	__________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-18-2004, 10:12 PM	#8
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	now if I can find my socks and phone I'm in business __________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-19-2004, 02:05 AM	#9
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,924 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,518 Times in 2,087 Posts	We moved 8 months ago, found the socks, no phone Mark Bandos website, very cool http://www.101airborneww2.com/index.html Especially go see the the souvenirs part of the site! Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

11-19-2004, 09:38 AM	#10
Ida-Alp Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Nampa ID Posts: 116 Thanks: 81 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	Ed--Thanks for the heads up on a GREAT website--Al

11-30-2004, 09:11 PM	#11
trigger643 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Murfreesboro Posts: 502 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	got to talk with the vet further last night about the circumstances surrounding this piece. They had engaged a german paratrooper unit earlier in the day, then captured about dozen soldiers, many of whom were hungarian volunteers. The pistol was taken from one of these prisoners. This happened within the first couple of days of D-Day. Later, a holster was acquired to put it in. As he brought back several Lugers at the end of the war, he admits it's possible the magazines got switched or there may have not been one with the pistol when he took it. He stated many times when they had prisoners it was just too much of a hassle to get them to undo their belt, so they often took just the pistols, leaving the holster with the wearer. He's liquidated almost his entire collection of Nazi Booty and this was his last fire-arm. __________________ "There are three reasons to own a gun: To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face." Ã¢?? Krusty the Clown

11-30-2004, 09:34 PM	#12
DougT User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: So. Cal. Posts: 171 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Trigger, remember what they say about snoozing and loosing. I think this is a very nice Luger--go for it! DougT