Unit Marked Cutaway Luger

Kansasman · 01-29-2021, 11:02 PM

I saw a interesting Luger yesterday at a local shop. I do not know much about it but it was a cutaway luger and also had unit markings. I didn’t get any pictures of it unfortunately. Any information would be helpful as I’ve never seen a cutaway with those markings and even a ballpark value. Thanks in advance.

gunnertwo · 01-30-2021, 01:29 AM

Others will post replies, In my opinion it would have been done to a factory gun and not modified after issue.

G2

Doubs · 01-30-2021, 02:38 AM

To me it would make sense to use a Luger with a problem that couldn't be fixed easily (or at all) to make a cutaway. As a teaching tool, it wouldn't make a difference.

Why waste a perfectly good Luger to make one?

Kiwi · 01-30-2021, 10:42 AM

At the right price I would get that. Fun show and tell.

mrerick · 01-30-2021, 10:57 AM

Simpson Ltd has a post-war cut away, if you want a price comparison:

https://simpsonltd.com/german-factory-cutaway-luger/

Also a WW-II Mauser:

https://simpsonltd.com/mauser-1940-luger-cutaway/

Since the one you are asking about was unit marked, it's likely that it was acquired and issued, but that an armorer did the cutaway for some reason. Cutaway Lugers were also salesman samples, but the factory would not be adding unit markings. That happened after they were acquired and issued to various units.

Kiwi · 01-30-2021, 12:53 PM

At those prices I prefer working versions

Kansasman · 01-30-2021, 10:29 PM

Thanks everyone for the information. The price tag was 3k which now seems pretty steep for what it is. Would be a neat piece to own but probably not for that price tag.

lugerholsterrepair · 01-30-2021, 10:49 PM

At one half of that amount it MIGHT be worth some consideration..But 3K will buy a pretty nice working collectable Luger without pieces cut out of it.

DonVoigt · 01-31-2021, 10:12 AM

The "cutaway" could have been done anytime and anywhere since the pistol was made.
Not necessarily an "official" job.
I would guess $500 worth of machine and man effort to make one; plus what ever the value of a
non-functioning luger would be - JMHO.

Vlim · 01-31-2021, 11:29 AM

Cutaways need some form of provenance to reach higher levels.

As stated before, anyone could have made it at any given time otherwise.

The post-war Mauser Parabellum cutaway on Simpson's site is a factory job, there is documentation on the creation of these (and HSc's) and that influences the value in a positive way.

Here is a HSc cutaway with the Mauser order and invoice form made out to then-Mauser manager Prof. Dr. Gminder.

sheepherder · 01-31-2021, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

The "cutaway" could have been done anytime and anywhere since the pistol was made.
Not necessarily an "official" job.
I would guess $500 worth of machine and man effort to make one; plus what ever the value of a
non-functioning luger would be - JMHO.

Looking at the 'cuts' and how they display the underlying parts, it would take painstaking examination of the blueprints and more meticulous measuring/planning to get the 'cuts' so that the parts don't fall out or catch on the cut ends...

I'm referring to the Simpson #2. That is not a garage effort.

Vlim · 01-31-2021, 12:16 PM

Interesting that you mention this.

Post-war, the cutaways were mostly made by apprentices at Mauser's own school. It was a great way to test their skill and to have them make something that was needed.

Creating a cutaway out of a single, numbered, pistol is much harder than creating one from scratch from the factory parts bin. Less room for error on the first.

Stucki · 01-31-2021, 12:35 PM

Here is my cutaway of a Swiss Luger 06/29, SN 40003.

W+F made a very small quantity of 06/29 cutaways in a special serial number block. The SN started at 40000 (the numbering of the normal 06/29 started at 50000). My 06/29 cutaway has the SN 40003. SN 40004 is in the former collection of W+F, I don't know of any other 06/29 cutaway models from this SN block.

Some time ago I had the opportunity to photograph both guns (SN 40003 and SN 40004) together...

Alexander

sheepherder · 01-31-2021, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stucki

Here is my cutaway of a Swiss Luger 06/29, SN 40003.
Some time ago I had the opportunity to photograph both guns (SN 40003 and SN 40004) together...

Alexander

Fascinating! Looking at the barrel/extension cut, they would have had to mill the barrel and extension cuts separately, and then screw them together. The top barrel cut is also at an angle, to show off the threads differently from the other cut. Very impressive!

Vlim · 01-31-2021, 01:23 PM

and others are just weird

Kansasman · 01-31-2021, 11:06 PM

I found a few photos online of the exact luger a while back.

Edward Tinker · 02-01-2021, 01:48 AM

If its unit marked - I find it hard to believe that it is a factory example, unless done in the interwar years (1919-1939), as why would it be unit marked and used as an example?

Kansasman · 02-01-2021, 01:01 PM

Here is the marking.

frankenlugerguy · 02-01-2021, 03:41 PM

Hmmm...In ruminating about the above, t's true that a non-functioning cutaway should have limited value. But they are interesting and unusual. And, one or more of them would enhance a collection. I like the ones Simpson's has for sale. Hard to decide about which one, though. I wonder if my wife would miss her car very much? Hmmm....

01-29-2021, 11:02 PM	#1
Kansasman User Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 13 Thanked 6 Times in 1 Post	Unit Marked Cutaway Luger I saw a interesting Luger yesterday at a local shop. I do not know much about it but it was a cutaway luger and also had unit markings. I didn’t get any pictures of it unfortunately. Any information would be helpful as I’ve never seen a cutaway with those markings and even a ballpark value. Thanks in advance.

01-30-2021, 10:57 AM	#5
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,909 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,110 Times in 1,510 Posts	Simpson Ltd has a post-war cut away, if you want a price comparison: https://simpsonltd.com/german-factory-cutaway-luger/ Also a WW-II Mauser: https://simpsonltd.com/mauser-1940-luger-cutaway/ Since the one you are asking about was unit marked, it's likely that it was acquired and issued, but that an armorer did the cutaway for some reason. Cutaway Lugers were also salesman samples, but the factory would not be adding unit markings. That happened after they were acquired and issued to various units. __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

01-30-2021, 10:49 PM	#8
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,928 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	At one half of that amount it MIGHT be worth some consideration..But 3K will buy a pretty nice working collectable Luger without pieces cut out of it. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

01-31-2021, 10:12 AM	#9
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,681 Thanks: 1,441 Thanked 4,350 Times in 2,040 Posts	The "cutaway" could have been done anytime and anywhere since the pistol was made. Not necessarily an "official" job. I would guess $500 worth of machine and man effort to make one; plus what ever the value of a non-functioning luger would be - JMHO. __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

01-31-2021, 11:29 AM	#10
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,988 Times in 1,205 Posts	Cutaways need some form of provenance to reach higher levels. As stated before, anyone could have made it at any given time otherwise. The post-war Mauser Parabellum cutaway on Simpson's site is a factory job, there is documentation on the creation of these (and HSc's) and that influences the value in a positive way. Here is a HSc cutaway with the Mauser order and invoice form made out to then-Mauser manager Prof. Dr. Gminder. Attached Thumbnails

01-30-2021, 01:29 AM	#2
gunnertwo User Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Nampa, Idaho Posts: 621 Thanks: 822 Thanked 930 Times in 363 Posts	Others will post replies, In my opinion it would have been done to a factory gun and not modified after issue. G2

01-30-2021, 02:38 AM	#3
Doubs User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Byron, Georgia Posts: 1,696 Thanks: 792 Thanked 1,679 Times in 552 Posts	To me it would make sense to use a Luger with a problem that couldn't be fixed easily (or at all) to make a cutaway. As a teaching tool, it wouldn't make a difference. Why waste a perfectly good Luger to make one?

01-30-2021, 10:42 AM	#4
Kiwi User Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Wrong side of the Delaware river Posts: 305 Thanks: 215 Thanked 434 Times in 171 Posts	At the right price I would get that. Fun show and tell.

01-30-2021, 12:53 PM	#6
Kiwi User Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Wrong side of the Delaware river Posts: 305 Thanks: 215 Thanked 434 Times in 171 Posts	At those prices I prefer working versions

01-30-2021, 10:29 PM	#7
Kansasman User Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 13 Thanked 6 Times in 1 Post	Thanks everyone for the information. The price tag was 3k which now seems pretty steep for what it is. Would be a neat piece to own but probably not for that price tag.

01-31-2021, 12:16 PM	#12
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,988 Times in 1,205 Posts	Interesting that you mention this. Post-war, the cutaways were mostly made by apprentices at Mauser's own school. It was a great way to test their skill and to have them make something that was needed. Creating a cutaway out of a single, numbered, pistol is much harder than creating one from scratch from the factory parts bin. Less room for error on the first.

01-31-2021, 12:35 PM	#13
Stucki User Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 84 Thanks: 1 Thanked 130 Times in 34 Posts	Here is my cutaway of a Swiss Luger 06/29, SN 40003. W+F made a very small quantity of 06/29 cutaways in a special serial number block. The SN started at 40000 (the numbering of the normal 06/29 started at 50000). My 06/29 cutaway has the SN 40003. SN 40004 is in the former collection of W+F, I don't know of any other 06/29 cutaway models from this SN block. Some time ago I had the opportunity to photograph both guns (SN 40003 and SN 40004) together... Alexander Attached Thumbnails

01-31-2021, 01:23 PM	#15
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,988 Times in 1,205 Posts	and others are just weird Attached Thumbnails

01-31-2021, 11:06 PM	#16
Kansasman User Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 13 Thanked 6 Times in 1 Post	I found a few photos online of the exact luger a while back. Attached Thumbnails

02-01-2021, 01:48 AM	#17
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,930 Thanks: 2,030 Thanked 4,527 Times in 2,090 Posts	If its unit marked - I find it hard to believe that it is a factory example, unless done in the interwar years (1919-1939), as why would it be unit marked and used as an example?

02-01-2021, 01:01 PM	#18
Kansasman User Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 13 Thanked 6 Times in 1 Post	Here is the marking. Attached Thumbnails

02-01-2021, 03:41 PM	#19
frankenlugerguy User Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: The Mountains of Western North Carolina Posts: 38 Thanks: 563 Thanked 33 Times in 21 Posts	Hmmm...In ruminating about the above, t's true that a non-functioning cutaway should have limited value. But they are interesting and unusual. And, one or more of them would enhance a collection. I like the ones Simpson's has for sale. Hard to decide about which one, though. I wonder if my wife would miss her car very much? Hmmm.... __________________ Cursum Perficio