231 in 9mm luger

robbt · 08-21-2014, 01:28 AM

hi guys , does anyone use 231 in there luger 9mm ??

ithacaartist · 08-21-2014, 10:53 AM

I don't--yet. But someone posted that along with their brass and primers, Winchester loads its "white box" ammo with 231, so I'm inclined to think it's a go. Since a hopper full of 231 was included with the SD-B Dillon press I acquired last year, I was going to give it a try when I got the press working. I think that there is decent info out there for loading 9mm with it, but best to confirm with factory suggestions/data, or the advice from an experienced re-loader--which I am not.

mrerick · 08-21-2014, 11:15 AM

I use Win 231 and it works fine in 9mm, .45acp and .38 special.

Follow the load data published by Hodgdon online.

HP-38 is the same powder.

Marc

rhuff · 08-21-2014, 04:48 PM

HP-38/231 powder has a moderately fast burn rate. You can, and should give it a try in your Luger. If, you find that it does not function 100% reliably in YOUR Luger, you might want to consider going to a slightly slower burning powder that produces a different recoil impulse than the faster burners. Powder that you might consider include, but not limited to, Unique and Power Pistol. basically, we use what works the best in OUR handguns....especially Lugers.

Peter S · 08-21-2014, 05:26 PM

I've been using the 231 for the 9mm and had good results. I load them to the low end of the powder range and they cycle my 1940 42 code without any problems.

robbt · 08-21-2014, 05:39 PM

hi peter , how many grains is low on the scale ??

sheepherder · 08-21-2014, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robbt

hi peter , how many grains is low on the scale ??

Best to find out what weight bullet he's pushing before using his loads...

Peter S · 08-21-2014, 08:44 PM

I'm using 4.7 gr of WW231 pushing a 115gr round nose or hollow point bullet.

rhuff · 08-22-2014, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter S

I'm using 4.7 gr of WW231 pushing a 115gr round nose or hollow point bullet.

Your load is 0.2gr off of a Max load for 115gr FMJ bullet according to the newest Lyman(49th) and Speer(14th) reloading manuals. I wouldn't consider this as a light/soft load, but that is just me.

sheepherder · 08-22-2014, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhuff

Your load is 0.2gr off of a Max load for 115gr FMJ bullet according to the newest Lyman(49th) and Speer(14th) reloading manuals. I wouldn't consider this as a light/soft load, but that is just me.

Hornady's Fourth Edition Vol 1 lists 5.5gr of W231 as max; 4.5gr is lowest for the 115gr FMJ-RN.

Peter S · 08-22-2014, 06:45 PM

from the Hodgdon website for a jacketed bullet.

sheepherder · 08-22-2014, 06:52 PM

And just to show that you can't trust just one source, here's a scan of a booklet from eBay...

Peter S · 08-22-2014, 07:18 PM

When I first started reloading, this is what Winchester had for 9mm loading data.

rhuff · 08-22-2014, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter S

from the Hodgdon website for a jacketed bullet.

Peter,

I also have this source, but this loading is for the Speer Gold Dot HP, and that loading is designed to allow that bullet adequate velocity to work/expand. I don't mean to argue, but if I were going to develop a load using 115gr FMJ bullets for a 100 year old Luger, I feel sure that I would start a bit lower than 4.7gr of 231 powder and work up the load. Granted, I am old school, and feel that safety is paramount. I have no way of knowing how experienced of a handloader the OP actually is, so I try to error on the safe side. Perhaps I am wrong......have been many times.

Peter S · 08-23-2014, 09:27 AM

I see what you're saying. If you look at the load data from the WW booklet, all it gives is 5.1 gr for a 115 gr full metal case bullet (see previous reply) so I didn't consider the 4.7 gr hot.

cliffdropover1 · 08-25-2014, 10:43 AM

I have used W231 in 9mm for many years. I load a 115 grain jacketed bullet with 4.7 grains. Max according to the Lyman manual #48 is 4.9. This load was chronographed and came out 100fps slower than factory. I have used it in my Luger and all my other 9mm's with no problems.

Copied from Rick W.--The basic concept of starting low and letting the load in your particular pistol tell you facts is still around for the guys that still have their vision and some fingers.

I have spent several weeks working up a proper loading for a .30 caliber Luger just to stay safe.
I strongly suggest you do the same.

kurusu · 08-25-2014, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cliffdropover1

I have used W231 in 9mm for many years. I load a 115 grain jacketed bullet with 4.7 grains. Max according to the Lyman manual #48 is 4.9. This load was chronographed and came out 100fps slower than factory. I have used it in my Luger and all my other 9mm's with no problems.

Copied from Rick W.--The basic concept of starting low and letting the load in your particular pistol tell you facts is still around for the guys that still have their vision and some fingers.

I have spent several weeks working up a proper loading for a .30 caliber Luger just to stay safe.
I strongly suggest you do the same.

Very good advice.

JCP · 08-26-2014, 01:19 AM

Just for information, ammo manufacturers do not load with the same powders that are available to reloaders. Reloading powder has to stay consistent from lot to lot so that the information developed for each load is consistent over many years, even decades. When manufacturers load they go for velocity and pressure consistency for each load developed. They blend many different kinds of powder to achieve their goal. They also buy powder by the ton. They use the cheapest bulk powder that they can find and use as little as possible to reach their goal. I am not involved in the loading of ammo but I do work for W-W. Hodgdon makes all of W-W powder and just sells it in W-W branded containers.

08-21-2014, 01:28 AM	#1
robbt User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	231 in 9mm luger hi guys , does anyone use 231 in there luger 9mm ??

08-21-2014, 10:53 AM	#2
ithacaartist Twice a Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY Posts: 3,339 Thanks: 7,263 Thanked 2,564 Times in 1,362 Posts	I don't--yet. But someone posted that along with their brass and primers, Winchester loads its "white box" ammo with 231, so I'm inclined to think it's a go. Since a hopper full of 231 was included with the SD-B Dillon press I acquired last year, I was going to give it a try when I got the press working. I think that there is decent info out there for loading 9mm with it, but best to confirm with factory suggestions/data, or the advice from an experienced re-loader--which I am not. __________________ "... Liberty is the seed and soil, the air and light, the dew and rain of progress, love and joy."-- Robert Greene Ingersoll 1894

08-21-2014, 11:15 AM	#3
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,909 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,110 Times in 1,510 Posts	I use Win 231 and it works fine in 9mm, .45acp and .38 special. Follow the load data published by Hodgdon online. HP-38 is the same powder. Marc __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

08-21-2014, 05:26 PM	#5
Peter S User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 37 Thanks: 16 Thanked 37 Times in 16 Posts	I've been using the 231 for the 9mm and had good results. I load them to the low end of the powder range and they cycle my 1940 42 code without any problems. __________________ -Peter

08-21-2014, 08:44 PM	#8
Peter S User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 37 Thanks: 16 Thanked 37 Times in 16 Posts	I'm using 4.7 gr of WW231 pushing a 115gr round nose or hollow point bullet. __________________ -Peter

08-21-2014, 04:48 PM	#4
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,289 Thanks: 2,707 Thanked 971 Times in 716 Posts	HP-38/231 powder has a moderately fast burn rate. You can, and should give it a try in your Luger. If, you find that it does not function 100% reliably in YOUR Luger, you might want to consider going to a slightly slower burning powder that produces a different recoil impulse than the faster burners. Powder that you might consider include, but not limited to, Unique and Power Pistol. basically, we use what works the best in OUR handguns....especially Lugers.

08-21-2014, 05:39 PM	#6
robbt User Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 17 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	hi peter , how many grains is low on the scale ??

08-22-2014, 06:52 PM	#12
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,182 Thanks: 1,400 Thanked 4,442 Times in 2,330 Posts	And just to show that you can't trust just one source, here's a scan of a booklet from eBay... Attached Thumbnails __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

08-22-2014, 07:18 PM	#13
Peter S User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 37 Thanks: 16 Thanked 37 Times in 16 Posts	When I first started reloading, this is what Winchester had for 9mm loading data. Attached Thumbnails __________________ -Peter

08-23-2014, 09:27 AM	#15
Peter S User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 37 Thanks: 16 Thanked 37 Times in 16 Posts	I see what you're saying. If you look at the load data from the WW booklet, all it gives is 5.1 gr for a 115 gr full metal case bullet (see previous reply) so I didn't consider the 4.7 gr hot. __________________ -Peter

08-25-2014, 10:43 AM	#16
cliffdropover1 User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kentucky Posts: 65 Thanks: 1 Thanked 9 Times in 5 Posts	I have used W231 in 9mm for many years. I load a 115 grain jacketed bullet with 4.7 grains. Max according to the Lyman manual #48 is 4.9. This load was chronographed and came out 100fps slower than factory. I have used it in my Luger and all my other 9mm's with no problems. Copied from Rick W.--The basic concept of starting low and letting the load in your particular pistol tell you facts is still around for the guys that still have their vision and some fingers. I have spent several weeks working up a proper loading for a .30 caliber Luger just to stay safe. I strongly suggest you do the same.

08-26-2014, 01:19 AM	#18
JCP User Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Illinois Posts: 23 Thanks: 0 Thanked 10 Times in 5 Posts	Just for information, ammo manufacturers do not load with the same powders that are available to reloaders. Reloading powder has to stay consistent from lot to lot so that the information developed for each load is consistent over many years, even decades. When manufacturers load they go for velocity and pressure consistency for each load developed. They blend many different kinds of powder to achieve their goal. They also buy powder by the ton. They use the cheapest bulk powder that they can find and use as little as possible to reach their goal. I am not involved in the loading of ammo but I do work for W-W. Hodgdon makes all of W-W powder and just sells it in W-W branded containers.