P 08 questions. With pics

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 11:59 AM

So my coworker has the chance to buy this all numbers matching luger with holster and extra mag. Both mag serial numbers match pistol. I posted it up on calguns and was told to visit here for more info. Any help would be appreciated along with approx value. Here are some pics.

zinfull · 08-19-2014, 12:23 PM

It is a 41-42 Luger .

John Sabato · 08-19-2014, 12:35 PM

Welcome to the Lugerforum. I see this is your first posting.

A nice honest looking Military Mauser P.08 (code 42 on the toggle), and made in 1941 (over the chamber). The holster, while very interesting looking, and appears to be period, would not be a German issue item. It is more likely a commercial holster, purchased by a previous owner.

A value? All matching, including all internal parts? ...and the magazine? Somewhere between $1500 and $2500 depending on how bad the buyer would want it, and where the gun is physically located at the time of the sale. It is a nice specimen.

BTW, the script letter "o" that appears on the magazine bottom, is part of the serial number, and the same script letter "o'' would have to appear on the front of the frame under the serial number for the magazine to match the pistol correctly. The "+" symbol on the magazine indicates that it is the "Spare" magazine for this pistol. The primary magazine would have no "+" on the mag bottom. Does the second magazine have a Matching serial number? If so, that would be exceptional. Not often encountered for both mags to remain with the pistol for this length of time. Especially if the gun saw combat.

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 12:43 PM

I pictured both mag bottoms. One is in the gun and one in the holster. They are slightly different. Thank you for the info. You do not think the holster is german?

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zinfull

It is a 41-42 Luger .

Took your advice and posted here. Thanks More info in 5 minutes then on calguns.

Edward Tinker · 08-19-2014, 12:46 PM

The holster is not issued by the army or air force.

It looks like a P38 holster that has been modified

I'd say value is about $xx00 to $xx00

Ensure that ALL small parts that should be matching, have the last two, trigger, hold open, rear toggle pin, take down lever, trigger, etc

Ed

John Sabato · 08-19-2014, 01:02 PM

While the holster may have well been manufactured in Germany... (or not), it is not a military issue item that came with the pistol at the time of issue. As I stated before, it is likely a commercial item purchased by some previous owner. German military issue leather items such as holsters and belts would have inspector acceptance stamps and a manufacturing code stamped on them somewhere.

mrerick · 08-19-2014, 01:04 PM

If all matching, in original finish and with two matching magazines it would be worth more toward the higher end of what John mentions.

It's very hard to judge finish in flash and underexposed or soft focus pictures. It looks right, but I can't be sure.

Be sure to inspect every numbered part. This would include the inside of the grips (be particularly careful if you remove them. Don't lift and break the left one up near the safety).

The inside of the trigger plate should have a number one more than the first two digits of the serial number. I can't tell you this number because you obscured them in the photos.

You should check the barrel witness mark to ensure it's original and not replaced.

As Ed mentioned, the holster is not original issue German WW-II, and appears to be something sold after market, possibly here in the USA. Are there any makers markings on it?

Note that while your magazines look OK as far as I can see, it's not unusual to find the bottoms of magazines scrubbed and renumbered to match a pistol. It is very unusual to find two numbered matching magazines with a Luger, particularly without the correct German holster and loading tool. Note that as collectors, we are skeptical by nature.

DavidJayUden · 08-19-2014, 01:08 PM

Be very certain that the serial number on the front of the frame also has the "o" beneath it. 2 matching magazines is very rare, and both of those show signs of grinding across the numbers. I'd personally want to see close-ups of each mag bottom and the serial number on the frame. If it is priced right, then no problem, but if it is priced according to 2 matching mags, then look very hard.
Overall it looks like an honest gun.
Those holsters keep turning up but everyone here says they are non-issue. Probably correct, but there are a lot of them out there.
dju

alanint · 08-19-2014, 01:28 PM

Also, please tell your friend not to store the pistol and mags in the leather holster. Acids used to tan the leather will damage the blueing.
the primary mag looks good but the photo of the spare needs to be clearer to determine wether scrubbed or not.

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidJayUden

Be very certain that the serial number on the front of the frame also has the "o" beneath it. 2 matching magazines is very rare, and both of those show signs of grinding across the numbers. I'd personally want to see close-ups of each mag bottom and the serial number on the frame. If it is priced right, then no problem, but if it is priced according to 2 matching mags, then look very hard.
Overall it looks like an honest gun.
Those holsters keep turning up but everyone here says they are non-issue. Probably correct, but there are a lot of them out there.
dju

Yes there is a o on the front of frame below serial number. Looks like a go. Thanks guys. If anyone else comes up with more please post. I am very impressed with how fast you came up with answers. Thank you.

John Sabato · 08-19-2014, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bodlfed66

. I am very impressed with how fast you came up with answers. Thank you.

"Fast" is related to how passionate the collectors on this forum are to their hobby, and therefore how closely they monitor the new posts here.

Correct "Answers" are directly proportional to the knowledge level of those who frequent this forum, and their level of experience with the 'details' necessary to identify historical artifacts like this Luger, and their willingness to share that knowledge with new collectors.

You came to the right place!

DavidJayUden · 08-19-2014, 03:31 PM

Now, just for grins, what is the asking price on this gun?
dju

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 04:09 PM

Had I known the original asking price I would not have wasted your time.
Heres the story as I was told.
Following the battle of the bulge the sellers grandfather was somewhat lost with another soldier. They heard voices talking and came upon three german soldiers smoking next to a vehicle. They approached them and the other us soldier spoke german and told the 3 german soldiers they were surrounded and put their weapons down. They set there guns down at which time they removed there pistols and hopped in their vehicle and rolled out. The grandfather supposedly kept the higher ranking officers gun that was in the holster pictured.

Seller comes to my coworkers son who had seen the gun several times and knew he wanted the gun. He needs cash apparently pretty bad. 24 hours of trying to figure out what it is and value the guy gets irritated asks for $425 or hes going to someone else.. It was bought immediately and paperwork is now being done.
Honestly blown away right now.

rhuff · 08-19-2014, 04:54 PM

All I can say to that price is WOW!! Where am I when this kind of deal is available?

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 05:33 PM

Beats me. Wasnt my deal. How do i refresh this page with chrome w/o going back to home page? Or is it just me?

John Sabato · 08-19-2014, 05:56 PM

Not sure about chrome browser but try the F5 key to refresh.

sheepherder · 08-19-2014, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Sabato

Not sure about chrome browser but try the F5 key to refresh.

"FS key"??? Is that the one next to the "Any" key???

Bodlfed66 · 08-19-2014, 06:57 PM

F5 takes me back to home page. Weird.

DavidJayUden · 08-19-2014, 09:20 PM

Sounds like grandad has a real mutton-head for a grandson...Imagine the blood, sweat and tears he went thru to get that gun.
dju

08-19-2014, 11:59 AM	#1
Bodlfed66 User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 8 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	P 08 questions. With pics So my coworker has the chance to buy this all numbers matching luger with holster and extra mag. Both mag serial numbers match pistol. I posted it up on calguns and was told to visit here for more info. Any help would be appreciated along with approx value. Here are some pics.

08-19-2014, 12:35 PM	#3
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,309 Times in 1,098 Posts	Welcome to the Lugerforum. I see this is your first posting. A nice honest looking Military Mauser P.08 (code 42 on the toggle), and made in 1941 (over the chamber). The holster, while very interesting looking, and appears to be period, would not be a German issue item. It is more likely a commercial holster, purchased by a previous owner. A value? All matching, including all internal parts? ...and the magazine? Somewhere between $1500 and $2500 depending on how bad the buyer would want it, and where the gun is physically located at the time of the sale. It is a nice specimen. BTW, the script letter "o" that appears on the magazine bottom, is part of the serial number, and the same script letter "o'' would have to appear on the front of the frame under the serial number for the magazine to match the pistol correctly. The "+" symbol on the magazine indicates that it is the "Spare" magazine for this pistol. The primary magazine would have no "+" on the mag bottom. Does the second magazine have a Matching serial number? If so, that would be exceptional. Not often encountered for both mags to remain with the pistol for this length of time. Especially if the gun saw combat. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-19-2014, 12:46 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,974 Thanks: 2,072 Thanked 4,607 Times in 2,123 Posts	The holster is not issued by the army or air force. It looks like a P38 holster that has been modified I'd say value is about $xx00 to $xx00 Ensure that ALL small parts that should be matching, have the last two, trigger, hold open, rear toggle pin, take down lever, trigger, etc Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

08-19-2014, 01:02 PM	#7
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,309 Times in 1,098 Posts	While the holster may have well been manufactured in Germany... (or not), it is not a military issue item that came with the pistol at the time of issue. As I stated before, it is likely a commercial item purchased by some previous owner. German military issue leather items such as holsters and belts would have inspector acceptance stamps and a manufacturing code stamped on them somewhere. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-19-2014, 01:04 PM	#8
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,925 Thanks: 1,377 Thanked 3,139 Times in 1,520 Posts	If all matching, in original finish and with two matching magazines it would be worth more toward the higher end of what John mentions. It's very hard to judge finish in flash and underexposed or soft focus pictures. It looks right, but I can't be sure. Be sure to inspect every numbered part. This would include the inside of the grips (be particularly careful if you remove them. Don't lift and break the left one up near the safety). The inside of the trigger plate should have a number one more than the first two digits of the serial number. I can't tell you this number because you obscured them in the photos. You should check the barrel witness mark to ensure it's original and not replaced. As Ed mentioned, the holster is not original issue German WW-II, and appears to be something sold after market, possibly here in the USA. Are there any makers markings on it? Note that while your magazines look OK as far as I can see, it's not unusual to find the bottoms of magazines scrubbed and renumbered to match a pistol. It is very unusual to find two numbered matching magazines with a Luger, particularly without the correct German holster and loading tool. Note that as collectors, we are skeptical by nature. __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

08-19-2014, 12:23 PM	#2
zinfull Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sonoma County CA Posts: 244 Thanks: 5 Thanked 34 Times in 17 Posts	It is a 41-42 Luger .

08-19-2014, 12:43 PM	#4
Bodlfed66 User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 8 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I pictured both mag bottoms. One is in the gun and one in the holster. They are slightly different. Thank you for the info. You do not think the holster is german?

08-19-2014, 01:08 PM	#9
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Be very certain that the serial number on the front of the frame also has the "o" beneath it. 2 matching magazines is very rare, and both of those show signs of grinding across the numbers. I'd personally want to see close-ups of each mag bottom and the serial number on the frame. If it is priced right, then no problem, but if it is priced according to 2 matching mags, then look very hard. Overall it looks like an honest gun. Those holsters keep turning up but everyone here says they are non-issue. Probably correct, but there are a lot of them out there. dju

08-19-2014, 01:28 PM	#10
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,917 Times in 1,193 Posts	Also, please tell your friend not to store the pistol and mags in the leather holster. Acids used to tan the leather will damage the blueing. the primary mag looks good but the photo of the spare needs to be clearer to determine wether scrubbed or not. Last edited by alanint; 08-19-2014 at 02:32 PM.

08-19-2014, 03:31 PM	#13
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Now, just for grins, what is the asking price on this gun? dju

08-19-2014, 04:09 PM	#14
Bodlfed66 User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 8 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Had I known the original asking price I would not have wasted your time. Heres the story as I was told. Following the battle of the bulge the sellers grandfather was somewhat lost with another soldier. They heard voices talking and came upon three german soldiers smoking next to a vehicle. They approached them and the other us soldier spoke german and told the 3 german soldiers they were surrounded and put their weapons down. They set there guns down at which time they removed there pistols and hopped in their vehicle and rolled out. The grandfather supposedly kept the higher ranking officers gun that was in the holster pictured. Seller comes to my coworkers son who had seen the gun several times and knew he wanted the gun. He needs cash apparently pretty bad. 24 hours of trying to figure out what it is and value the guy gets irritated asks for $425 or hes going to someone else.. It was bought immediately and paperwork is now being done. Honestly blown away right now.

08-19-2014, 04:54 PM	#15
rhuff Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Az. Posts: 2,314 Thanks: 2,746 Thanked 998 Times in 733 Posts	All I can say to that price is WOW!! Where am I when this kind of deal is available?

08-19-2014, 05:33 PM	#16
Bodlfed66 User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 8 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Beats me. Wasnt my deal. How do i refresh this page with chrome w/o going back to home page? Or is it just me?

08-19-2014, 05:56 PM	#17
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,309 Times in 1,098 Posts	Not sure about chrome browser but try the F5 key to refresh. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

08-19-2014, 06:57 PM	#19
Bodlfed66 User Join Date: Aug 2014 Posts: 8 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	F5 takes me back to home page. Weird.

08-19-2014, 09:20 PM	#20
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Sounds like grandad has a real mutton-head for a grandson...Imagine the blood, sweat and tears he went thru to get that gun. dju