New to lugers...a few questions please

[Tim]

What does a WW II vintage lugar cost? What calibre shell does it use? Are these guns still operational? Where is the closest market to buy a lugar to Henderson, N.C.? How do North Carolina State permits apply to out-of-state purchases? Thank you for your assistance.

Probably your best bet Tim is to read over this site. Look to your left and read the general info and it will explain many of your questions, but...


cost depends on rarity and condition


Millions were made before WW2, for WW1 and police use


7.65 or 30 Luger (is the same thing) and the most common WW1 and WW2 caliber size is 9 MM


You never know where you will find a Luger, which is the correct spelling, although you will see it spelled several different ways.


Ed

[Keith]

Hi Tim....good to see a fellow NCer here...I'm in the Triangle area. Like you, I'm fairly new to lugers and have learned a lot here. Got my first luger off the classifieds....a russian import...mismatched, but a good barrel...wonderful shooter. Had it refinished by Ted Green (also on this board) and he made it look brand new.


I've seen a few lugers for sale at the Raleigh gunshows, but be careful what you buy and how much you pay. The real knowledgeable guys are on this board, so post questions before you buy.


............Keith

hi tim and welcome to the forum. same questions i asked months ago. here's my 2 cents:


cost - anywhere from $500 to $5000 and up. reccomend looking for a nice shooter luger priced around $500 to $700. nice if you can find one all matching, but most important is that it functions correctly and is not full of pits and rust. also be leary of "bargians". plenty of greedy people willing to sell you something it's not.


read - get jan stil's luger books. read this forum from top to bottom. gain as much book knowledge as possible, it will help defeat the "evil elf's"


hold - go out and find real lugers to look at and hold in person. nothing more valuable than that.


shop - there are lots of places on the web to shop for lugers. simpson ltd. and world of lugers are a good starting place. mr. shattuck @ WOL has lot's of good shooters at a good price. (remember - a shooter is a shooter ) ask lots of stupid questions and get them answered in writing.


caliber - 9mm. cheaper than the 30. more desiable. 100 rounds of target ammo @ walmart for $11. deal.


shooting - yes, they still work. be sure to check out completly and have a gunsmith inspect if you are not sure.


enjoy - most of all, enjoy the craftmanship, beauty, and history of the luger. don't get all caught up in the hype and let other people's standards dictate what you like about your luger and the hobby itself. there's something for everbody in this hobby.


again welcome. myself and marvin both collect and we live in south carolina. good luck.

[CETME]

I'm in the same boat as you Tim.... I've Liked lugers for a long time, but im just starting to know the information about them. I'm a mechanical engineering student, and boy does the complicated action of the luger really interest me! The time it must have took to machine all the parts must have been incredible!

[Roadkill]

Good to hear from you, I'm new also, I bought a shooter grade, paid too much for it, and it wouldn't shoot. All because I didn't know better. Hugh referred me to this forum(so ya'll can blame me being here on him), now with the assistance & patience of the members I have repaired and replaced parts to the point where I now have a very presentable shooter that works excellently and in the process have met some very decent folks who are extremely knowledgeable about Lugers.


Roadkill

Hi Tim,

I just recently got my first Luger and really am glad that I have it. Before I even considered buying one of these beauties I devoured every post on this site and asked many questions. Don't be afraid to ask. There are so many people here that can help you out and there is no such thing as a stupid question. That is the best way to learn about the Luger. Good luck in finding the right one for you.

Sid.

[John Sabato]

The Luger Mechanical Features by Gerard Henrotin...


It is an E-book that you read on your computer. It is only $6.95 to download and enjoy great reading and all the great illustrations...


There are a total of four of these e-books on the Luger by the same author. I personally recommend them all because they are full of good info and pictures and they are real inexpensive.


I don't have any connection with the author except appreciating the books he put together on my favorite pistol...


If you buy any of them, give me a shout via email...


here is the download link:

http://users.skynet.be/HL-Editions/ebook/liste01.htm


regards, John

[Jimbo]

Hi Tim,


I am new to Luger collecting myself, though I have been fascinated by them all my life. I'd like to try to give you an idea of the cost of World War II Lugers. (I hope the experts here will correct my misconceptions.)


In proofing my post I realize it is really, really long. So in a nutshell you can buy a well-used or imported Luger for under a thousand dollars, even $600 to $700, but a mint original with all-matching serial numbers will cost around $2,000 and up.


********************************************************


Getting into more detail (here comes the REALLY long part...


Luger prices are wildly variable due to the huge number of variations, some merely uncommon and some ultra-rare. Here is some background and a few basic guidelines on cost, as I understand them:


WWII "vintage" Lugers were those made from 1934 to 1942, almost all of them manufactured by "Mauser." The earlier Lugers (1934 and 1935)and the models made in smaller quantities tend to cost more than the later Lugers (1941 and 1942) and those made in larger quantities.


Here are the basic models made by Mauser between 1934 and 1942.


Year Model Rarity


1934 K date code Pretty rare

1935 G date code Medium

1936 s/42 Common

1937 s/42 Common

1938 s/42 Common

1939 s/42 Medium

1939 42 Common

1940 42 Common

1941 41-42 Pretty rare

1941 byf 41 Common

1942 byf 42 Common


A "mint condition" Luger with all matching serial numbers on the parts will typically have a minimum cost of about $2,000 to $2,500 for 1934 models and about $1,200 to $1,500 for the 1941 and 1942 models. (Note: typically, all-matching does not mean the magazine has numbers that match the gun. If they do, this will be specifically noted.)


Guns with 95% - 98% of their original finish with good bores and good grips cost about $1,500 for the 1934 models and about $1,000 for the 1941 and 1942 models.


Lugers with less than 90% of their original finish, Lugers that have various non-matching serial numbers on the parts and Lugers that have been stripped and re-blued can cost between $500 and $1,000 for the common varieties. Although it seems almost impossible any Luger for $500 these days unless it is a basket case.


You should also know that there are Lugers that were reworked in Russia or East Germany and "imported" to America, that typically cost between $600 and $900. These Lugers were re-blued and often have new barrels, distinctive looking new grips and have often had the numbers re-stamped on the magazines and the small parts.


I am fairly new to Luger collecting and I am trying to help here, so if I made too many mistakes, my sincerest apologies.


Last year I bought my first Luger -- a plain jane byf/41 all-matching with 95% finish, some pitting, fake grips and commercial magazine for $750. After investing another $200 it wears original grips and has a period-correct magazine. It was only after finding this forum that I learned I could have had a very clean byf/41 for only a bit more money from Ralph Shattuck or Bob Simpson.


Although, I like the gun more and more over time because I have since learned how rare it is to find any collectible Luger in an ordinary gun store such as where I bought mine. And I even like the "fake" grips originally included as they were ivory grips added by the Veteran who brought the pistol back. That kind of sentimental value is priceless, I think.


Good luck with your search Mr. Tim.

Tim---I suggest you subscribe to Simpson Ltd List, Shattucks List, watch gunbroker, watch auction arms and subscribe to other lists advertised such as Rayjack. This will give you an idea what is on the market. Just because a Luger is advertised at a certain price---doesn't necessarily mean that it will sell for that price. When you find a Luger advertised or at a gun show that is equal to what you see on lists but at a lower price---then you are probably finding a reasonable buy. I have been collecting Lugers for more than 40 years. I have some of Shattucks lists and others back to early 1960s. Down through the years I have followed a particular Luger on someones list for as much as a year or two which finally sold at advertised price. Do not be afraid to make offers. I have found that the best buys on Lugers are not usually from a Luger Dealer. I have found best buys from individuals or dealer who specializes in something else and happens to have one or two Lugers. As others have probably told you get a book and study. When you look at a Luger with thought of buying---don't pay much attention to what the dealer tells you that it is---you look at it and decide what you believe it is based on your research and study of the market. I doubt that you are going to get any rare Lugers at a steal price from the big boys. No matter what you pay for your first or 20th Luger someone is going to tell you that they saw one like it or bought one cheaper and in better condition. Study---then don't be afraid to trust your own judgement. Welcome to Lugers and enjoy!

[Carl]

I have been following the comments for some time and not seen the the best source mentioned. The vet who brought it home. I have been collecting for about 40 years and have yet to buy a gun at a gun show or from a dealer. In this time I have bought over 100 guns, about 60 to 70 lugers, all by advertising "wanted to buy" in bargan sheets, shoppers guides and small town newspapers. The most sought after souvenir by the GI was a luger. There are countless numbers of then out there waiting to be discovered! The stories that go with them are priceless.

carl you're giving away trade secrets!


but really, it's true. i think the internet has made us all lazy in hunting down the real treasures.


now i feel all dirty for buy on-line from those dealers.

[Dwight Gruber]

Regarding the "fake" grips, you should be aware that if they are real ivory they are worth a heckofalot of money.


--Dwight

[Jimbo]

Hi Dwight,


The grips are ivory and fit the gun precisely. It was a nice bonus they are valuable as well. But I don't collect lugers for investment value, but because I have a passion for the design and the history. If I never make a penny from them, I won't be less happy. But thank you for confirming the value of post-war ivory grips.


The gun looks far better with the original-style wood grips in place, but I usually keep the ivories on her out of respect for the WWII veteran who previously owned it. I think that is how he would have wanted it.

[Jimbo]

Carl,


I envy you. You must have some great stories. I agree that how you find these treasures can be as exciting as the guns themselves. I hope someday I will have some stories like yours.

[Dwight Gruber]

I'm with you there. To my mind there is some authentic/historical value to customization such as your grips, having to do with respect for the people who have used and loved the Luger before you or I got it. Its a very personal kind of value, not one that every collector is going to recognize, let alone pay for. The yellow (plastic or ivory, not sure yet) grips have been taken off the gun I posted about recently only because they fit poorly and loosen up under fire.


The point about the real ivory grips is that their value is intrinsic and real, and if you are insuring your guns you might consider listing them separately as they posess their own value, perhaps even particularaly, separate from the Luger they are on.


--Dwight

[unspellable]

There must be such a thing as a stupid question. I am forever being told I'm asking stupid questions...


But, as my dear old pappy said, "Never be afraid to ask a stupid question. They're easier to deal with than stupid mistakes."


unspellable

[Tim]

Thaks to all of you for your info regarding my questions. Collectively, you are a valuable resource. I am heading to the Raleigh Gun and Knife Show on Sat., armed with your advice and warnings. I'll let you know how my search turns out.

Thanks again, Tim