Evaluating a Luger - Page 2

lugerholsterrepair · 05-17-2014, 11:50 PM

Your mag appears likely to be from before 1942, though, 'cause by '42, they had aluminum bottoms. Yeah, WAY before 42... like about 1913-1918. Aluminum bottoms appeared around 1926.

A third mag, if it existed for that gun, would have "++" on it. These are military marks. UUHH NO they wouldn't. An extra mag is an extra is an extra mag and any and all extra mags only have ONE +, indicating it is an extra.

ithacaartist · 05-18-2014, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

A third mag, if it existed for that gun, would have "++" on it. These are military marks. UUHH NO they wouldn't. An extra mag is an extra is an extra mag and any and all extra mags only have ONE +, indicating it is an extra.

Uh-oh, I'm deluded! Well, no longer! I admittedly needed better info about this. An Artillery Luger would have been issued with three mags, right? One for the gun and two for the double pouch? If the two for the pouch were identically serialized and each had only one +, how did a soldier tell the difference later if one of the "extras" was acting up? Is my memory of pics of ++ mags mistaken, or were the mags inappropriately doctored post-issue to create this double+?

lugerholsterrepair · 05-18-2014, 10:16 AM

David, An Artillery could have been issued with 5 or more magazines. All numbered to the weapon. One for the pistol and 2 double mag pouches or one 4 mag pouch. Almost anything was possible.

But yeah..only ONE + on each extra. If you kept adding +'s on each extra you would have a bunch on the 4th mag! I suspect that if an extra was acting up badly enough the Soldat would take it out and lose it in the mud. But I don't know if the Germans repaired mags or what? I think they were considered fairly expendable.

ithacaartist · 05-19-2014, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

But yeah..only ONE + on each extra. If you kept adding +'s on each extra you would have a bunch on the 4th mag! I suspect that if an extra was acting up badly enough the Soldat would take it out and lose it in the mud. But I don't know if the Germans repaired mags or what? I think they were considered fairly expendable.

I guess they would have needed G.T.!!

So, a mag with two "+"s would have been messed with? Other than signifying that issued mags had been tried/tested with each gun they accompany, I don't see much effect in their being numbered at all. It seems reasonable that in use, they were lost and found, discarded and swapped, because most mags seem to work in most Lugers, all else being equal. I can't picture checking serial numbers on mags while someone is throwing lead your way and you are trying to return the favor. Seems to me the mag numbering can be chalked up to the German near-obsession with organization, record keeping, etc.

mrerick · 05-19-2014, 11:15 AM

Hi Mike and welcome to the forum.

Because of the soft focus and lighting issues it is very hard to give you accurate evaluation of your 42 byf (Mauser made) Luger sn 4449l.

It looks like there might be finish issues on the rear metal of the handgrip area. If the finish is thin there and showing active rust (red oxide), it will impact the valuation.

This Luger was very well made, with excellent metallurgy.

It also looks like there is a small chip missing from the top right of the left side grip panel. That can be repaired.

If your magazine has a wood base, it's from a period prior to about 1933, after which mainly aluminum and bakelite bases were used.

I think that $1500 may be at the higher end of valuation of these problems are present.

With that said, you have a very nice Luger that is collectible and it should sell quickly within the collector market.

Avoid local gun stores and the auction sites unless you have experience with them. If you list it here, you should be able to quickly sell it. Just take normal precautions, and ensure it's transferred legally in both your state and where ever you sell it.

Note that you can deal with a holder of a Federal Firearms License anywhere in the USA, and ship it directly to them. This includes dealers (class 01 licenses) and collectors (class 03 Curio and Relic licenses).

Marc

Marc

ithacaartist · 05-19-2014, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrerick

Note that you can deal with a holder of a Federal Firearms License anywhere in the USA, and ship it directly to them. This includes dealers (class 01 licenses) and collectors (class 03 Curio and Relic licenses).

Marc,

Generally, yes, but the class 3 C&R has the value of bathroom tissue here in NY state. I don't think a C&R holder can even receive ammo from out of state without going thru a class 1. Soon, we'll have to have a background check to get a background check!

wlyon · 05-20-2014, 09:02 AM

Be cautious on shipping to a Class 3 . Some States do not allow this. As stated above New York is one and also California. There are probably others? Bill

Sergio Natali · 05-21-2014, 03:06 AM

Byf 42 probably dated 1941 or 1942, are the wooden grips original?
If it had black plastic grips and a black plastic bottom magazine could be a so called "Black Widow"

My two cents.

Sergio

05-17-2014, 11:50 PM	#21
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,922 Thanked 3,123 Times in 1,434 Posts	Your mag appears likely to be from before 1942, though, 'cause by '42, they had aluminum bottoms. Yeah, WAY before 42... like about 1913-1918. Aluminum bottoms appeared around 1926. A third mag, if it existed for that gun, would have "++" on it. These are military marks. UUHH NO they wouldn't. An extra mag is an extra is an extra mag and any and all extra mags only have ONE +, indicating it is an extra. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

05-18-2014, 10:16 AM	#23
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,771 Thanks: 4,922 Thanked 3,123 Times in 1,434 Posts	David, An Artillery could have been issued with 5 or more magazines. All numbered to the weapon. One for the pistol and 2 double mag pouches or one 4 mag pouch. Almost anything was possible. But yeah..only ONE + on each extra. If you kept adding +'s on each extra you would have a bunch on the 4th mag! I suspect that if an extra was acting up badly enough the Soldat would take it out and lose it in the mud. But I don't know if the Germans repaired mags or what? I think they were considered fairly expendable. __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

05-19-2014, 11:15 AM	#25
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,907 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,108 Times in 1,509 Posts	Hi Mike and welcome to the forum. Because of the soft focus and lighting issues it is very hard to give you accurate evaluation of your 42 byf (Mauser made) Luger sn 4449l. It looks like there might be finish issues on the rear metal of the handgrip area. If the finish is thin there and showing active rust (red oxide), it will impact the valuation. This Luger was very well made, with excellent metallurgy. It also looks like there is a small chip missing from the top right of the left side grip panel. That can be repaired. If your magazine has a wood base, it's from a period prior to about 1933, after which mainly aluminum and bakelite bases were used. I think that $1500 may be at the higher end of valuation of these problems are present. With that said, you have a very nice Luger that is collectible and it should sell quickly within the collector market. Avoid local gun stores and the auction sites unless you have experience with them. If you list it here, you should be able to quickly sell it. Just take normal precautions, and ensure it's transferred legally in both your state and where ever you sell it. Note that you can deal with a holder of a Federal Firearms License anywhere in the USA, and ship it directly to them. This includes dealers (class 01 licenses) and collectors (class 03 Curio and Relic licenses). Marc Marc __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

05-20-2014, 09:02 AM	#27
wlyon Lifer 2X Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere in Montana Posts: 2,632 Thanks: 3,170 Thanked 2,555 Times in 954 Posts	Be cautious on shipping to a Class 3 . Some States do not allow this. As stated above New York is one and also California. There are probably others? Bill __________________ Bill Lyon

05-21-2014, 03:06 AM	#28
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,082 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	Byf 42 probably dated 1941 or 1942, are the wooden grips original? If it had black plastic grips and a black plastic bottom magazine could be a so called "Black Widow" My two cents. Sergio __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list.