K Date Lugers, Faked and Restored

Frank · 10-28-2012, 07:48 AM

Hello Luger Nuts!! Anyone that knows me, as a member of this forum, is aware of my interest in Military Mauser Lugers. Also, that I collect data on these pistols and have compiled a decent size base. I thought you might be interested in some statistics on the 1934 (K-Date) production.

There were “about” 11,000 K-Date Lugers made. It’s difficult to determine the number that are in the still in existence, let alone the number available for us to collect data. In any event, my information shows about 7 percent are FAKED and another about 7 percent that have been restored.

Of the faked pistols, 50 percent were found on auction sites and about 25 percent from dealers and forum information, each.

Of the restored pistols, a little over 50 percent were identified from forum data, 30 percent from auction sites and the remaining 20 percent from dealers.

Just thought you might enjoy a few statistics and be aware of the most faked Military Mauser Luger, the K-Date. Please be wary when trying to purchase one of the gems and know how to identify an original.

Happy Hunting

JTD · 10-28-2012, 08:17 AM

Thanks for the excelent statistics Frank. Are you maintaining any kind of data base with serial numbers? I am mainly an Imperial collector, but would really like to aquire a decent K somewhere down the line. I knew there was a good share of boosted ones out there, but did not realize to that extent. John

deepdarkwoodsman · 10-28-2012, 08:45 AM

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, how are these guns faked? Does this mean a less expensive luger is converted to a K-Date with the removal and addition of markings and proofs? Or does this mean a gun is created completely from the ground-up, then aged and marked to look like a K-Date?

Thanks,

Doug

Frank · 10-28-2012, 09:52 AM

JDT, I have a data base for Military Mausers only.

Postino, I said I didn't know the number of K-Dates that are left of the original about 11,000. I also said I didn't know the number that are available to collect data. My guess the number of "Fakes" are considerably less than 770.

Deepdark, K Dates are "faked" in many different ways. I doubt if any were built up from ground level as that would be very expensive. I would guess, mostly began as converted less expensive Lugers.

spartacus38 · 10-28-2012, 12:08 PM

Frank,
I have sent you a private message.
Bob Young

spartacus38 · 10-28-2012, 12:55 PM

I collect K-Dates.I estimate 600 to 800 have survived.My guess is that approximately 150 to 200
of the 800 are correct based on what I have encountered over the years. spartacus38@charter.net
Bob Young

George Anderson · 10-28-2012, 01:43 PM

Frank, I have come across sn 2388. It was incorrectly reblued without buffing and I have sent it off to Ted Green to correct.

regul · 10-28-2012, 04:17 PM

Frank
I don't know if you already have s/n 3878 in your data base. It is subvariation 2. Finish and grips are poor.
Thanks
Ed

joeyhol75 · 11-19-2012, 04:41 AM

I have number 1159 in near mint condition with bring back papers. My grandfather took it from Mauthausen.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/68740160@N06/

34 "K" picks on page one
Bring back papers, pics of my grandfather (65thdiv,,BattleAxe) and discharge papers on page 2

Frank · 11-19-2012, 07:14 AM

George, Ed & Joey, thanks for your inputs. All data is welcome!

Dick Herman · 11-19-2012, 09:16 AM

Frank,

I have K date number 5970 (3rd Subvariation) and K date number 9797 (4th Subvariation). Both have been expertly restored.

Hope this helps build your list.

Motown · 03-30-2013, 08:57 AM

Hello,
I have a K Date, early production, correct and all matching - mag is a blued fxo w/aluminum bottom & matching serial #...I assume a 'force match' from a later gun. Where do I send the 'info' on the gun to add to your data?

Frank · 03-30-2013, 11:22 AM

Leon, you can post the information here or send me an email.

mrbguy@cox.net

Thanks in advance!

Frank

spartacus38 · 03-30-2013, 11:26 AM

Please post pics of the markings on the aluminum bottom;could be correct bottom on wrong tube.Would be nice to see gun too.
Bob

Motown · 03-30-2013, 05:05 PM

I'll send the info to your e mail - and post pics if I can figure out how to do it...also have a 1934 Navy Holster. Pistol isn't Kriegsmarine, but the only year appropriate holster I could find was Kriegsmarine marked...I'll post pics of that as well. Looking for a tool and rod for it, if they are available and priced for normal humans to afford!

Lugerdoc · 03-31-2013, 08:55 AM

Motown, I do have an original small loop cleaning rod available, but I'm sold out of the K date inspected loading tools. TH

Motown · 04-06-2013, 03:46 PM

Finally have the new computer up and on line! Let me know what you think of the photos. K Date Luger w/Kriegsmarine 1934 holster. Working on permission to pick up the rod the Luger Doc offered up...in negotiations w/the wife...you know how that goes.

Motown · 04-06-2013, 04:09 PM

OK, I give up. 3 tries and it won't upload anything...I tried to create an 'album' which worked this morning for another set of pics, but it won't take any of the ones of this pistol...little help?

Motown · 04-06-2013, 04:13 PM

Hmmm, seems to have uploaded a pic...I'll try again. What was it Einstein said about the definition of insanity?!

glock30 · 04-06-2013, 06:06 PM

THis is a REAL one....

10-28-2012, 07:48 AM	#1
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	K Date Lugers, Faked and Restored Hello Luger Nuts!! Anyone that knows me, as a member of this forum, is aware of my interest in Military Mauser Lugers. Also, that I collect data on these pistols and have compiled a decent size base. I thought you might be interested in some statistics on the 1934 (K-Date) production. There were “about” 11,000 K-Date Lugers made. It’s difficult to determine the number that are in the still in existence, let alone the number available for us to collect data. In any event, my information shows about 7 percent are FAKED and another about 7 percent that have been restored. Of the faked pistols, 50 percent were found on auction sites and about 25 percent from dealers and forum information, each. Of the restored pistols, a little over 50 percent were identified from forum data, 30 percent from auction sites and the remaining 20 percent from dealers. Just thought you might enjoy a few statistics and be aware of the most faked Military Mauser Luger, the K-Date. Please be wary when trying to purchase one of the gems and know how to identify an original. Happy Hunting

11-19-2012, 04:41 AM	#9
joeyhol75 New User Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 3 Thanks: 3 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	I have number 1159 in near mint condition with bring back papers. My grandfather took it from Mauthausen. http://www.flickr.com/photos/68740160@N06/ 34 "K" picks on page one Bring back papers, pics of my grandfather (65thdiv,,BattleAxe) and discharge papers on page 2 Last edited by joeyhol75; 11-19-2012 at 09:36 AM.

03-30-2013, 08:57 AM	#12
Motown User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Double Oak, TX Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hello, I have a K Date, early production, correct and all matching - mag is a blued fxo w/aluminum bottom & matching serial #...I assume a 'force match' from a later gun. Where do I send the 'info' on the gun to add to your data? __________________ "Avoid excessive sharpness or harshness of voice, which usually indicates the man who has shortcomings of his own to hide." --Field Marshall Erwin Rommel

03-30-2013, 05:05 PM	#15
Motown User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Double Oak, TX Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I'll send the info to your e mail - and post pics if I can figure out how to do it...also have a 1934 Navy Holster. Pistol isn't Kriegsmarine, but the only year appropriate holster I could find was Kriegsmarine marked...I'll post pics of that as well. Looking for a tool and rod for it, if they are available and priced for normal humans to afford! __________________ "Avoid excessive sharpness or harshness of voice, which usually indicates the man who has shortcomings of his own to hide." --Field Marshall Erwin Rommel

03-31-2013, 08:55 AM	#16
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Motown, I do have an original small loop cleaning rod available, but I'm sold out of the K date inspected loading tools. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

10-28-2012, 08:17 AM	#2
JTD User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: PA Posts: 424 Thanks: 217 Thanked 407 Times in 148 Posts	Thanks for the excelent statistics Frank. Are you maintaining any kind of data base with serial numbers? I am mainly an Imperial collector, but would really like to aquire a decent K somewhere down the line. I knew there was a good share of boosted ones out there, but did not realize to that extent. John

10-28-2012, 08:45 AM	#3
deepdarkwoodsman User Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 38 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 1 Post	Just to satisfy my own curiosity, how are these guns faked? Does this mean a less expensive luger is converted to a K-Date with the removal and addition of markings and proofs? Or does this mean a gun is created completely from the ground-up, then aged and marked to look like a K-Date? Thanks, Doug

10-28-2012, 09:52 AM	#4
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	JDT, I have a data base for Military Mausers only. Postino, I said I didn't know the number of K-Dates that are left of the original about 11,000. I also said I didn't know the number that are available to collect data. My guess the number of "Fakes" are considerably less than 770. Deepdark, K Dates are "faked" in many different ways. I doubt if any were built up from ground level as that would be very expensive. I would guess, mostly began as converted less expensive Lugers.

10-28-2012, 12:08 PM	#5
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	Frank, I have sent you a private message. Bob Young

10-28-2012, 12:55 PM	#6
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	I collect K-Dates.I estimate 600 to 800 have survived.My guess is that approximately 150 to 200 of the 800 are correct based on what I have encountered over the years. spartacus38@charter.net Bob Young

10-28-2012, 01:43 PM	#7
George Anderson Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VA Posts: 3,592 Thanks: 1,773 Thanked 2,527 Times in 786 Posts	Frank, I have come across sn 2388. It was incorrectly reblued without buffing and I have sent it off to Ted Green to correct.

10-28-2012, 04:17 PM	#8
regul Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: VA Posts: 96 Thanks: 19 Thanked 57 Times in 20 Posts	Frank I don't know if you already have s/n 3878 in your data base. It is subvariation 2. Finish and grips are poor. Thanks Ed

11-19-2012, 07:14 AM	#10
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	George, Ed & Joey, thanks for your inputs. All data is welcome!

11-19-2012, 09:16 AM	#11
Dick Herman User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 302 Thanks: 496 Thanked 354 Times in 138 Posts	Frank, I have K date number 5970 (3rd Subvariation) and K date number 9797 (4th Subvariation). Both have been expertly restored. Hope this helps build your list.

03-30-2013, 11:22 AM	#13
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 163 Times in 87 Posts	Leon, you can post the information here or send me an email. mrbguy@cox.net Thanks in advance! Frank

03-30-2013, 11:26 AM	#14
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	Please post pics of the markings on the aluminum bottom;could be correct bottom on wrong tube.Would be nice to see gun too. Bob

04-06-2013, 03:46 PM	#17
Motown User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Double Oak, TX Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Finally have the new computer up and on line! Let me know what you think of the photos. K Date Luger w/Kriegsmarine 1934 holster. Working on permission to pick up the rod the Luger Doc offered up...in negotiations w/the wife...you know how that goes. __________________ "Avoid excessive sharpness or harshness of voice, which usually indicates the man who has shortcomings of his own to hide." --Field Marshall Erwin Rommel

04-06-2013, 04:09 PM	#18
Motown User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Double Oak, TX Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	OK, I give up. 3 tries and it won't upload anything...I tried to create an 'album' which worked this morning for another set of pics, but it won't take any of the ones of this pistol...little help? Attached Thumbnails __________________ "Avoid excessive sharpness or harshness of voice, which usually indicates the man who has shortcomings of his own to hide." --Field Marshall Erwin Rommel

04-06-2013, 04:13 PM	#19
Motown User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Double Oak, TX Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hmmm, seems to have uploaded a pic...I'll try again. What was it Einstein said about the definition of insanity?! Attached Thumbnails __________________ "Avoid excessive sharpness or harshness of voice, which usually indicates the man who has shortcomings of his own to hide." --Field Marshall Erwin Rommel

04-06-2013, 06:06 PM	#20
glock30 User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Obama LAND Posts: 206 Thanks: 18 Thanked 17 Times in 14 Posts	THis is a REAL one.... Attached Thumbnails __________________ Mauser Parabellum 10.2098 !